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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

A collective of people engaged in pretty much what the name suggests


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Tags: leftism (CLICK HERE FOR MORE LEFTIST 8CHAN BOARDS), politics, activism, news

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This thread is dedicated to the discussion of /leftypol/ moderation, both as a matter of direction and accountability for individual actions.

If you see a thread deleted or moderated in a way that you think is unfair, please post ITT, preferably with evidence or a detailed description of it. This won't guarantee a reversal, but it will help bring it to my attention. Volunteers who turn out to be repeat offenders and refuse to learn will have their accounts removed. You can also monitor our actions here:



As well, Volunteers who can't decide what to do about something should post ITT to get feedback before acting.

NOTE: This thread is not for the discussion of the recent potential migration announcement. You are allowed to discuss the matter, just not in this thread.

Apparently the last thread got inadvertently deleted. No it was not an act of suppression. I just spilled greasy pocket cheese all over my keyboard, and in the ensuing hurt and confusion, accidents happened. My sincerest apologies orz

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>It's like if you went to /pol/ & constantly defended Jews. If you come here to only praise Nazis or spout that "niggers & immigrants should be killed", you're shitposting.

Another *Not to say that every poster who does it deserves a ban, which is why I said

>rampant shitposting

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Just a reminder to our users that if anything happen to 8ch or /leftypol/ please go to https://www.bunkerchan.xyz/leftypol

It is our bunker in case of an emergency

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Right here. What happened?

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Official /leftypol/ reading list

In this thread, various members of the community have listed recommended literature regarding leftism, i.e. economics, political theory, philosophy and other subjects related to leftism. Some recommendations are for starters, or for those in advanced literature.


/Leftypol/ has many ideologies, Marxist, Anarchist, Left-com, etc. so there is a variety of different literature with different viewpoints.

Reading literature is recommended, as it helps you understand leftism better and is much better than reading Wikipedia synopses.

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>Judith Butler

Fuck off IdPolack

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Hello and welcome to /leftypol/. Please check the board tags for related boards. These are our groups:





/leftypol/'s magazine:


Other leftist chans/backups:




>How can you call yourselves leftist politically incorrect?

/leftypol/ posters are allowed to voice opinions that offend liberals, SJWs, and so on. All sects of leftism are allowed to post on /leftypol/, leading to plenty of fighting and shitflinging between leftists, which other forums would tend to ban. However, this was only a minor consideration in the naming of /leftypol/. Since the concept is simply a leftist version of /pol/, the entire name of /pol/ was retained.

>I'm not a leftist can I post here?

/leftypol/ welcomes debate from non-leftists. Non-leftists frequently come here to ask questions and raise topics for debate. Board moderation here is more focused on maintaining a good board index, so non-leftists have to be on better behavior as OP than they do as participants in someone else's thread. If you aren't b8ing or shitposting, your thread is likely to stay up.

>Are you liberals? Are you SJWs? Do you like Obama? Are you all Zionists???

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Syndicalists welcome, nationalists don't

File: c0518538fbbdd79⋯.jpg (111.08 KB, 800x1256, 100:157, trotsky.jpg)


Is there anyone on this board who's unironically a Trotskyite? The ideology just doesn't seem sensible to me. I can see justifications for being an anarchist or a tankie, but being a Trot seems like you just want everyone in the world including yourself to be miserable.

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File: 9cc33f1a302c1ad⋯.jpg (17.02 KB, 480x360, 4:3, j posadas.jpg)


Posadism is love, posadism is life


>The ideology just doesn't seem sensible to me.

Why not?



One the three resident trots on this board here.

Have you read any of Trotsky's contributions to Leninist theory and Marxism in general? I'm not sure why you would deem MLs comprehensible but find Trots to be less so. What in trotskyism makes people miserable?


>I can see justifications for being an anarchist or a tankie

Really? I'd love to hear your justifications. Should be good for a laugh.



>Let's ignore how shitty Trotskyists are for a second. What did Trotsky himself believe?

He was an orthodox Leninist, the only real difference between Trots and MLs is their stances on Socialism in One Country and Permanent Revolution. Also, many Trots view the former USSR as a "deformed worker's state", or "state capitalist". I also understand that Trotsky, and by extension Trots in general favor a more "decentralized" economy to the centralized planned economy of the USSR, but I don't know enough about Trotskyism to speak on that.


I honestly wish you guys posted more, I'd love to learn more about Trotskyism, but I guess it makes sense to keep away since any Trot on this board is bombarded with "lol, fuck le Trots XXD"

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>blocks your path

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File: 18deb1ab99f2824⋯.jpg (45.86 KB, 480x480, 1:1, crg.jpg)

>*teleports behind you*

>*slaps your girlfriends ass*

>*does an 180*

You see this guy, what you do?



Kick the chair.


Do you see any cool kid there? I only see ugly ass nerd rejects.


knock him out, he is just a dweeb



Fuck off, fatty.



Is it just me or does Laci Green look like a fat Riley Reid?


I say

>It's okay, I take you seriously

>Pats Carl's big belly

>Tell him Mummy May will get Corbyn next time

File: 65304aa26e721e3⋯.jpg (273.86 KB, 1297x736, 1297:736, STEM-Logo1.jpg)


Will the value of STEM go down once more jobs are automated? The way I see it, more jobs being automated means more people going into STEM fields as STEM will be required for the growth industries (robotics, bio-engineering, AI, etc.), I'm afraid that as a Comp Science graduate, the field will be riddled with over supply problems which means low wages in the future, plus add the fact that thanks to globalization I'll be competing with programmers from India and Eastern Europe who will be willing to work for peanuts and things start to look grim for my future. I will have to distinguish myself in order to compete. My family is pretty well off (both parents make mid six figures) and I go to a great university but it still sucks that even a person like me is suffering from economic anxiety.

It sucks because I assumed that I would be making a killing (six figures or more) as a programmer for the next 20 years time but that dream doesn't seem like it will manifest itself. This is one of the main reasons why I consider myself a leftist now.

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dubs and trips, nice


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>Most of that isn't required at my university

In the US, theres CIS (computer information systems) and MIS (Management information systems) which are basically CS but with all the math taken away plus a little business added.

For an actual CS (B.S.) degree, a third year/upper division course on data structures and algorithms is almost always required. Plus all those math courses look pretty standard, except that I'd add a probability/statistics course possibly.



Interesting. I believe that way is a much better way to teach it. Of course, they always recommended those types of courses (which I took because I did math too), but it felt like most people were just there because "computers = $".



Basically this. Jobs that would normally be classified as "technician" will certainly be lost with increasing automation, but most STEM-related work beyond that still needs skilled humans involved. That's not to say that over-saturation in this or that field won't result in people being unable to find those non-technician jobs in the first place, but automation won't necessarily be the cause.

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no one was forced off campus.



It's like trying to leave the Mormons or Jehovahs Witnesses. Chances are that if you're involved in leftist politics, even just online, you're surrounded by a people who all think and speak the same way. Even if you don't agree and would speak out against it from a universalist or identity-agnostic perspective, you're probably going to lose friends and associates (or if you're, say, guys who are mostly in social circles with woke new york liberals and you run a lucrative podcast, your livelihood too), it can cause problems in your party if you're in one and you'll generally be ostracised. I know we all like to make fun of /pol/yps and r/t_d fags telling stories about losing friends and family for coming out as racist or whatever, but the same can and does happen to leftists who publicly question micronationalist narratives or identity-focused theory.

Aside from a handful of big names like Chibber or Reed, who are established and have the clout to weather any shit they get thrown at them, the non-identity left is tiny and in a very precarious position.





I can't seen to find anything about two trans students being beaten, only information about alleged harassment and questioning by campus police. The leave of absence is a tradition thing where the minority members usually leave in an act to bring awarness. Instead what happend this time was that students demanded that white students leave instead, to which Bret objected to as it was now less of a volutary act to bring awarness and now more toward telling another group to go away and said in his letter:

>“If there was interest in a public presentation and discussion of race through a scientific/revolutionary lens, I would be quite willing to organize such an event,” Weinstein wrote.

Which if that isn't the most proper answer, I don't know what is



>When it's students and other "grassroots" movements even the most anti-liberal, anti-idpol irony dudes just avoid the subject.

Because most of the "DUDE IDPOL IS FOR LIBERAL SJWS AND NEETSOCS LMAO" ironbyros pretty much agree with SJWs on everything, they just think they need to mention class a bit more when they're bitching that straight white males still exist


File: 05f760961039e46⋯.jpg (286.94 KB, 533x400, 533:400, 1497494178503.jpg)


how can you distribute resources within a socialist system without massive centralization? if so, wouldn't this centralization (big gov, big AI) lead to a decline in freedoms?

also isn't communism only achievable in a post-scarcity society which is lets face it impossible to achieve or at the best very impossible

i mean I don't like capitalism especially the modern form of global neoliberal capitalism which is one of the worst cancers that humanity has ever faced but I also don't like socialism either. I think that democratic socialism is probably the best model we can come up with also I think that markets are not a bad thing in and of themselves, the price-system is one of the best ways to distribute resources and maximize efficiency, and I think that markets don't need to be tied to private property at all.

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>Let me guess: read Bordiga?

Nah I wasn't going to tell you to do that (though I do agree with a sizable portion of his positions), though based on your comment about power I might tell you to re-read Dauve. :^)

>sortition of groups of people qualified to do necessary labor might be forced if needed

Wut? This wasn't what I was talking about at all. I was advocating the use of sortition to select groups from a pool of volunteers to oversee certain administrative matters, not randomly selecting people to be put to work at gunpoint, something that is significantly worse than both pseudo-currency and the "cookie method".

>There will always be power

In the banal sense of a larger group being able to force its will on a minority, sure, but in the sense of state power? If that still exists then we fucked up. I'm reminded of comment by Dauve: "we will not solve the question of power by spreading little bits of it around everywhere". We won't solve it by creating "true" democracy either.

>A party cannot be allowed to substitute itself for the proletariat as the revolutionary subject.

I agree there too, but again: it wasn't what I was talking about.



>the system must be used without any restrictions on consumption (cookie method or pseudo-currency or anything else)

Google isn't helping me here. Could you please clarify this?



That's a rule for distributing several units of the same thing to people who ask for different quantities. The silly name comes from an example using cookies. A robot servant has made a lot of (identical) cookies and there are people who would like to have some. How should they be allocated? The robot can ask how many cookies each individual person wants, but what if the sum of these individual wishes is higher than the amount of cookies available? There are different ways the robot can handle that:

A) Divide sum of wishes by number of cookies available. Shrink each individual wish by that. E. g. People wish for 200 cookies in total, but the robot servant only has 100, so the amount each individual asked for gets cut in half, and that's what the individual gets.

Problem with that is that people can anticipate the shrinking and make exaggerations, and they can anticipate that others will exaggerate and so on, with no end in sight. Even if the robot actually has enough cookies currently to give everybody as many as they really want, it can happen that some people underestimate how much others exaggerate, so they get fewer; while some make the opposite mistake and now they have cookies they don't care to have; though of course it's better to have too many than too little. (And not just the present situation is unsatisfactory. The robot would also like to know how much people want now in order to adjust production for the future, but these numbers are totally screwed up.)

B) The robot processes the requests in random order, giving every individual as many units as they want until the supply is exhausted. Now, there is no need to exaggerate. If you want no more than X units, you do not increase the probability of getting at least that many units by stating a higher number. But the distribution can get very inegalitarian, if the requests that get processed early are very high.

C) Imagine the people sit in a circle and the robot moves from one person to the next and asks whether you want at least one more cookie, and if your answer is yPost too long. Click here to view the full text.



Thanks for clarifying what I mentioned, but please stop bumping this thread. OP needs to go ctrl+f his answers from the SovCyb thread. Anything which we give him right now is only the tip of the iceberg.


>though based on your comment about power I might tell you to re-read Dauve. :^)

tfw I actually went and read Dauve and Martin but am apparently too much of a brainlet to properly understand them ;_;

>I was advocating the use of sortition to select groups from a pool of volunteers to oversee certain administrative matters, not randomly selecting people to be put to work at gunpoint, something that is significantly worse than both pseudo-currency and the "cookie method".

I didn't mean that either. Both the pseudocurrency and cookie method are distribution systems. The question is, how do you keep up productivity at whatever the maximum capacity is when shit hits the fan and revolution starts? My solution is that people should be organized into self-regulating groups which force their members to do work, an informal industrial militia system contraposed to the industrial army described by Marx, as something for the workers themselves to prevent shirking of war-time production targets. Already, play is part of work under modern society because work in a firm is already stretched to the limits of potential productivity and companies increasingly adopt a model of limited self-management of workers or die out. The last step in advancing through capitalism to reach communism is to make work such an integral part of the direct relations between people in daily life that management from above is no longer needed and SNLT drops to the point that current hierarchical structures can no longer sustain themselves in a market environment, if that makes sense, and generalized revolt is directed then against all that is left in the way of communism, the violence of the state. This late-capitalist inverse of communism, already in birth under the name of the gig economy, must in turn become the industrial militia's organizational basis, with productPost too long. Click here to view the full text.



>To clarify, it would be a tool that would allow us to depend less on the state, and thus facilitate its dismantling.

Someone in the cybernetics thread realized something important.

>That's what I've always found very interesting about this subject - in essence what we're working on here is a method of automating the role of the bourgeoisie, in so far as they mediate the distribution of resources within society. If the last actual thing they can be considered to do was automated, they would be entirely obsolete.

Mankind will be saved from poverty the network called Platform for Optimization of Resources by Keying Yields aka P.O.R.K.Y.

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Reminder to all lolberts and ancaps on this board that we will tread.

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File: 9bd3c792e04dd1c⋯.png (12.3 KB, 160x160, 1:1, hmm.png)


"said something nice about the poor once"

>All for ourselves, and nothing for other people, seems, in every age of the world, to have been the vile maxim of the masters of mankind.

>Civil government, so far as it is instituted for the security of property, is in reality instituted for the defence of the rich against the poor, or of those who have some property against those who have none at all.

>Wherever there is great property, there is great inequality.

>When the regulation, therefore, is in favor of the workmen, it is always just and equitable; but it is sometimes otherwise when in favor of the masters.

>It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.

>The earth and the fullness of it belongs to every generation, and the preceding one can have no right to bind it up from posterity. Such extension of property is quite unnatural.

>No society can surely be flourishing and happy, of which the greater part of the members are poor and miserable. It is but equity, besides, that they who feed, cloath and lodge the whole body of the people, should have such a share of the produce of their own labour as to be themselves tolerably well fed, clothed, and lodged.


File: 9a699baa101a10d⋯.png (80.14 KB, 900x600, 3:2, gaddy.png)


This flag is ugly, and snakes did nothing wrong. The Gadsden flag is well designed in all candor. Have a less ugly, Anarcho-Syndicalist version.



Oh shit you beat me too it. Good to see like-minded people about.

t. >>1799224




This is good. I've been always shilling for the "don't tread on us" slogan but the multiple snakes are nice.


File: 36127d6aaaa5bf6⋯.png (57.33 KB, 990x660, 3:2, HJxSDF5.png)


That flag is literally one of the worst things I've ever seen. It is poorly designed, and sends the message that we are against individual liberty.

Pic related is worse because is perpetuates the myth that communism is about equality.

Liberals make me want to die.

File: e1acaac509447ac⋯.jpg (55.46 KB, 445x445, 1:1, college kid.jpg)


What do you guys think about liberal arts education? By this I don't mean liberal arts majors (eg history, art, women's studies) but the idea that students should be required to take classes outside their focus area to become "well-rounded" citizens. Is this really an effective form of education or is it just a capitalist hoax designed to keep students in school as long as possible to maximize their college debt?

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right now 95% of college subjects are fucking pointless.

They should study Medicine or Engenerring. Anything else it's better to just stay home & learn by yourself or working saving money (I'm well aware the current system pays dirt & takes a long time to get to an useful amount but it's better than generating debt making you a target of the state eventually).


i study music

im the most stereotypic leftist around

autistic, studying "liberal" arts, loner



Althrough this is true >>1798668

I should add.

Eng & Science students are always irl trash. These students never graduate thorugh they spend too much time on the internet & playing games wasting money on College, just to never finish.

Medicine students are usually like the Liberal Arts guy through. They're genuine people that want to help others or they're either assholes who just do it for the profit.


You should work instead man. It's slavery but instead of throwing money away you're making some.

Learn music on your free time.




Not the best useless degree but could be worse



if he is in a college it's kind of a waste. If it's a music conservatory it's ok.

or working in a studio, that would be ideal. any friend with a studio will help a ton.

File: db17c0837a79182⋯.jpg (91.83 KB, 750x401, 750:401, marx.jpg)


>…From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.

damn, this first shocked me when I heard it. why did Rowling decide to include Marx in her novels? it seemed so out of place.

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>Remember, with proletarian power comes great responsibility.


File: 96caaafe280c7f2⋯.jpg (325.04 KB, 1600x1201, 1600:1201, 1474482022208.jpg)

>It's you who's out Gobbie! Out into the frozen, barren labor camps of Siberia!

Wow, Spiderman really was a working class hero.


File: bf94252d4155030⋯.jpg (120.54 KB, 2080x1080, 52:27, maxresdefault.jpg)

>You'll get your surplus when you fix this door you bourgeois piece of shit!

Based Raimi


File: f57e4187a4006e8⋯.webm (499.13 KB, 1220x506, 610:253, stole pizza3.webm)

>Woah! He stole that guy's surplus value!


File: 464f53c98d535aa⋯.jpg (11.58 KB, 480x360, 4:3, vfnh4.jpg)

So which is it? Is the whole thing one big truth, or one hundred million little lies?

Did you believe that Communism itself systematically murdered 100 million people? If you did…we got you! The CIA made that story up. It never happened!

Were you able to recognize the truth tonight, or were you thrown off by the Bourgeois controlled mass media? We're bombared by so much capitalism in our lives that sometimes the truth becomes a little unclear. We hope that our stories tonight have demonstrated that the infrastructure needed to kill 100 million people is…Beyond Belief!

I'm Jonathan Frakes.

File: cef9a06ffa62654⋯.png (29.99 KB, 424x600, 53:75, Red_Rose_(Socialism).svg.png)


Why is Social Democracy the most popular branch of socialism among the masses?

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Because porky controls what is popular among the masses, and because Social Democracy is the only policy that can save capitalism and ensure porky rule


because changes through the state (without revolutions) happen very fuckin slowly. It's a slow transition middle phase to socialism. most people are afraid of sudden change.


Because it's just capitalism with a "human" face



So does communism.



Who amongst the ruling class supports communism?

File: 420db8f94629f69⋯.png (70.81 KB, 227x227, 1:1, rubinstupidface.png)



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File: 5000ff8625ca5e8⋯.png (355.26 KB, 1200x325, 48:13, 1274812518.png)

>dumping waste in rivers is OK because it will trend on Twitter

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Racism is a spook

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Are we implying that religion isn't a tool for hierarchies to oppress? Take those goggles of, bruh. If we are performing chemo, religion is the first to go.



>other areas received more funding and were unable to mimic the same success despite greater resources

Sorry mulatto.


File: 9206cce7cbd8e2b⋯.png (159.78 KB, 1920x1036, 480:259, spook wiki.png)

File: bf4bab42ff9eb92⋯.gif (898.51 KB, 600x600, 1:1, thinking.gif)


Class is a spook.

There is scientific evidence for the physical reality of race.



That's not true at all. If anything most other places were intentionally kept poor so America could continue exploiting them.

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