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File: 1434419302155.jpg (86.58 KB, 331x456, 331:456, 1432936818023.jpg)

 No.5936

I'm looking for a new religion, one that will let me

>has rich scripture and a literary tradition which I can dive deep into

>God/gods that aren't too clearly defined or personal…more mysterious like Plato's Demiurge

>has good virtuous morals, but values strength over meekness, no arbitrary rules based on pointless customs

>has some sort of meditation/theosis practice of transcendence/enlightenment

>believes in hierarchy not total equality

>allows masturbation (in moderation)

>alows fucking transexuals (in moderation)

>having premarital sex

>experiment with psychaedelic drugs

Does Asatru fit the bill?

 No.5937

>has rich scripture and a literary tradition which I can dive deep into

Yes, as much as Christians like to say that all of Paganism was wiped out, there is a great deal left. Check out this thread for reading materials.

http://8ch.net/asatru/res/5081.html

>God/gods that aren't too clearly defined or personal…more mysterious like Plato's Demiurge

Eh idk, Odin is pretty mysterious just because he's unique to the Germanic pantheon and because he mixes things that appear to be contradictory but really aren't (hes the god of war, wisdom, poetry and death)

>has good virtuous morals, but values strength over meekness, no arbitrary rules based on pointless customs

Read the Havamal.

>has some sort of meditation/theosis practice of transcendence/enlightenment

The Germanic Pagans did practice meditation but the specifics on how it was done is now unknown. It can be guessed at however based on other Pagan traditions, which are again, vague and the details are unknown

>believes in hierarchy not total equality

In the Rigsthula it makes it very clear that Germanic Pagan society was based on hierarchy and a nearly religious caste system, similar to Hinduism

>allows masturbation (in moderation)

This is debated, no one is really sure but I don't think that gods will send you to Dark Hel for touching your wiener

>alows fucking transexuals (in moderation)

Now this is where you're getting over the line, Germanic Paganism has a very strict no fag policy. The best I could say is that its POSSIBLE that the Vikings views homosex as only bad for the receiving end because it made them unmanly and that being on top had no shame, but this is only a possibility and theres nothing that clearly proves it. Also it only applies to the Vikings, not the many other Germanic tribes, the most ancient of which hated fags and would kill both parties (bottom and top)

>having premarital sex

This is also debated but according to Tacitus, no

>experiment with psychaedelic drugs

For religious experience, yes, for fun and WHOOOOOAH duududde IM SO HIIIIIGH O: then no. Psychedelics were used by the ancient Germanics for spiritual purposes but even then it was viewed dubiously as a type of magic

Hope this helps


 No.5939

File: 1434427165781.gif (2.06 MB, 150x173, 150:173, 1433290655484.gif)

>>5937

Wow, this helps a lot. Thanks


 No.5942

>>5939

no problem m8


 No.5976

>>5937

>Psychedelics were used by the ancient Germanics for spiritual purposes but even then it was viewed dubiously as a type of magic

Drugfag here:

There are no true psychedelics native to europe that have a documented history of use before at least the 1600s, unless we get into unprovable Terence McKenna tier bullshit about pre indo-european europe.

Note that "psychedelic" does not mean "psychotropic".

The former generally refers to 5-HT2 partial agonists, while the latter refers to any drug that effects the mind. I.e. alcohol is psychotropic, but not a psychedelic. LSD is a psychedelic psychotropic.

The drugs our ancestors, for sure, had access to were things such as henbane, atropa belladonna, and amanita muscaria. The former two are powerful deliriants, and the latter is a hard to classify mushroom (wholly unrelated to psilocybin "shrooms" in terms of effects) that can cause anything from delirium to sensations of flying.

None of these three are particularly useful as recreational drugs (and most recreational drug users find them to be extremely unpleasant, both physically and mentally), and are more useful for shamanic trances and for poisoning people than for having fun.

Given that our ancestors never actually had access to true psychedelics, they never wrote anything about them, so we have no idea how they would have reacted to/treated them.

>The best I could say is that its POSSIBLE that the Vikings views homosex as only bad for the receiving end because it made them unmanly and that being on top had no shame, but this is only a possibility and theres nothing that clearly proves it.

The Norse also had insult words that made fun of people "afraid" of having straight sex/reproducing. If OP is exclusively fucking traps, he's worth insulting to say the least.

Additionally, norse law (can't remember if scanian or gragas) defines gay anal rape as being a crime just as heinous as cutting someone to the bone with a weapon – the only context where it would be "ok", would be raping someone to show dominance in utangard (i.e. if you're a soldier in a foreign country trying to humiliate some locals).


 No.5978

>>5976

What about henbane? What about amanita muscaria? Why is them being unpleasant something that disproves it? Peyote isnt always pleasant but it was still used among the native americans.


 No.5979

>>5978

>What about henbane? What about amanita muscaria?

What about them? Neither one of them are psychedelics, which is what OP asked for. They're certainly psychotropic (henbane being an anticholingeric deliriant and amanita being…well, amanita)

>Why is them being unpleasant something that disproves it?

Disproves what? I'm not saying the ancestors didn't use henbane and amanita (henbane has been found on the corpses of volvae, and amanita is known among the saami, who are often referred to as being magical people in sagas). They almost certainly used these drugs…how pleasant they are has nothing to do with that.

What I'm saying is that they didn't have access to psychedelics – shit like LSD, 2C family drugs, psilocybin, etc… you know, 5-HT2 receptor agonists. They certainly had drugs, and they certainly had drugs that caused hallucinations, but they didn't have psychedelics.


 No.5992

From Wikipedia:

>Der Sumpfporst enthält ein ätherisches Öl (Ledumöl; Hauptwirkstoff Ledol), das stark berauschend wirkt, in höheren Dosierungen zu Krämpfen, Wut und Raserei führt. Gelegentlich wurden auch Zusätze wie Fliegenpilz, Schwarzes Bilsenkraut, Tollkirsche und Stechapfel beigefügt, die halluzinogene Eigenschaften besitzen. Der Ethnopharmakologe Christian Rätsch sieht im Reinheitsgebot daher ein frühes Drogengesetz. Es bestehe der Verdacht, dass der Gebrauch heidnischer Ritualpflanzen unterdrückt werden sollte.

Rhododendron tomentosum is apparently an inebriant and leads in higher dosages to cramps, rage and furor. (seems to me like it might be connected to the Berserkers?) They used it to flavour beer.

Also they sometimes added stuff like Amanita muscaria, henbane, Atropa and Datura which apparently have hallucinogenic properties. Some ethnobotanist sees in the Reinheitsgebot basically a anti drug law and there is a suspicion that the goal was the suppression of the use of heathen ritual plants.


 No.5994

>>5976

What makes you think our ancestors didn't know anything about Psilocybe semilanceata, probably native to Europe?

Excavated graves of Völvas in Sweden have even revealed seeds of cannabis.

Without going into unprovable McKenna tier bullshit I think the shamanic roots of the proto-religion is showing quite clear in the myths.


 No.5996

>>5979

Okay FINE I used the wrong word stop sperging out already. Psychedlics are not against Heathenry either, again, IF USED APPROPRIATELY.

Also this

>>5992

>>5994

Our ancestors had trade you fool, the Vikings went all through the Danuba to the Black Sea and traded with Turks. It's likely they had materials that were not native to their lands, they certainly carried artifacts not native to Scandinavia, such as Buddha statues. Doesn't mean they were Buddhist or knew anything about Buddhism, they probably just thought it looked nice.


 No.5998

>>5936

>I'm looking for a new religion

>I want to be a degenerate and LARP as a pagan

That's some wiccan tier shit right there.


 No.5999

>>5998

This, "looking for a new religion" makes it sound like you view religions like a shirt as if it's something to wear a new one every day depending on your aesthetic preference.

You are either loyal to the old gods are you are not.


 No.6001

>>5994

>What makes you think our ancestors didn't know anything about Psilocybe semilanceata, probably native to Europe?

I'll definitely agree that there are several species of probably-native psilocybin mushrooms in europe. The reason I can't stand behind the notion of the ancestors using them, though, is because there's no evidence of it at all.

The first reliably documented use of a psilocybin mushroom in europe comes to us from the relatively modern year of 1799, as a suprise case of mushroom "poisoning".

I feel that if the ancestors were using psilocybin species, we'd see not only evidence of it in eddaic and sagaic sources (for instance, we see deliriants poetically described in odin's "death" on the tree + evidence in the form of volvae corpses with henbane, and traditional beer recepies), but also in later medieval medicinal and witch-trial sources (like flying ointments of the middle ages, which were the "modern" descendant of pre-christian deliriant mixtures).

The deliriants are (relatively) well attested, but not so with psilocybin…so, this leads me to believe that although there are definitely psilocybin species native to europe, there is no reason to believe that our people were consciously aware of their uses until after 1799.

>Excavated graves of Völvas in Sweden have even revealed seeds of cannabis.

I personally don't know what to make of this. Not only have volvae been found with seeds, but norse farmsteads have been found with evidence of growing cannabis sativa, bow strings and ship's rigging from the viking age onwards in germanic lands has historically been made of hemp, and it is well attested that cannabis sativa was used as a salad herb in the middle ages (not to mention what those crazy scythians were using the shit for).

So, yeah, it's DEFINITE that the ancestors had access to cannabis sativa. The question becomes whether they were using it as hemp or as "marijuana". Cannabis not cultivated specifically for psychotropic effects tends to be rather underwhelming as a drug, especially without the new world technology of smoking….

>Without going into unprovable McKenna tier bullshit I think the shamanic roots of the proto-religion is showing quite clear in the myths.

no doubt there's shamanism and even drug-induced shamanism clearly portrayed in the myths. We have volvae who work confusion "magic" by touching people on the face (know that scopolomine can be administrated transdermally). We have odin "dying" and the receiving the runes (that is, he went into a deliriant trance, which causes severe ataxia and can last for several days), and we have volvae who go on "spirit journeys" while their body lies appearantly "dead" (again, attestation of deliriant induced ataxia).

Like that other guy is saying: I'm sperging on the difference between general psychoactive drugs vs. psychedelics, which are a specific class of drugs with a specific set of effects that are different from everything I'd have reason to believe our ancestors to have made use of.

>>5992

again, none of these are psychedelics. definitely hallucinogenic drugs, but not psychedelic.

>>5996

>Okay FINE I used the wrong word stop sperging out already.

Well, with drugs, one has to be precise. If I were to describe the christian rite of the eucharist as "a ritual involving the psychoactive drug, alcohol", and then one were to go and telephone-game that into "the early christians used psychedelics", the difference in meaning would be phenomenal and have far-reaching implications.

>Psychedlics are not against Heathenry either, again, IF USED APPROPRIATELY.

I agree. My big point is that our ancestors didn't use them, so we have no real way of definitely knowing their thoughts on them, and their use is something that is beyond the scope of what our ancestors' magical/medicinal practices would have covered.


 No.6002

>>6001

Alright good points I suppose, sorry for unleashing the volkish wrath

And about the marijuana, I remember reading the Freyr and Freyja were praised as the patrons of hemp and its possible that rituals similar to what the Scythians did were used in their temples, as they Germanics believed ingesting hemp unlocked the powers of the Vanir. However I don't remember the source and it may have been a dubious one

Nonetheless it would make sense. The Vanir were gods of the Earth and plants and it is believed that Freyja and Gullveig taught magic to Odin.


 No.6003

People that fuck transexuals should be drowned in a bog


 No.6004

>>6003

op's religion shopping. that in itself is concerning.


 No.6005

>>6003

>>6004

Agreed

What doe's OP think? Are you good enough to be a Stern Saxon? Or a Br00tal Barbarian? Or a Storming Suebiian? A Tight Teutonic? A Great German? A Ku Klux Khermundarii? A Crazy Celtic? A Frank…Frank?

If not GTFO

Maybe the Rough Ridin Romans are for you


 No.6006

>>6005

he sounds like an argr angle to me…


 No.6007

>>5936

It's not a religion in my books. Its ethnic heritage, you can't choose it.


 No.6017

File: 1434687284412.jpg (96.54 KB, 640x640, 1:1, umm hi there big guy.jpg)

>>6005

Romans fucked boys and they were pretty badass pagans.

Also hermaphrodites were seen as a luxury in the slave markets, they fetched a high price…

I identify a lot with the Greeks/Romans and they have a rich written history and we know about their culture since they recorded history very well. They also have tons of stories about their Gods.

I find it hard to identify with the vikings because they are so far from my mother country (romania) And they barely recorded any history/religion/philosophy since it was mostly oral tradition.

So maybe Greek paganism is for me


 No.6018

>>6017

>Romans fucked boys and they were pretty badass pagans.

Romans (and greeks too) also had strict codes concerning proper masculinity and illegal effiminate behaviour, just like the norse with their concept of "ergi".

Hell, the greeks thought people who got too much pussy were faggots because if you're getting that much pussy, it shows that you must know how to think like a woman.


 No.6025

>>6017

Lol ok you argr gypsie have fun with that


 No.6028

>>6025

gypsies are 3% of the population

that's like assuming all americans are jews


 No.6030

File: 1434758500704.jpg (193.94 KB, 670x1024, 335:512, 6e6fe813dbcaa8d0ea37284a02….jpg)

>>6028

>denying that all Romanians are gypsy

explain how your country is called ROMAnia then

checkmate, friend


 No.6034

>>6030

pretty good b8




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