Free Will Is Real

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Free Will Is Real One of Little Faith !!EmXaPcEUcU 05/25/15 (Mon) 19:21:24 No.1942

Just so you know how to argue in case someone denies free will.

discipulus !qBzTcerKDk 05/26/15 (Tue) 08:38:53 No.1956

>>1942

Good video.

The channel is good in general, which is why I linked to it here

>>1373

It is the Calvinists/Zwinglians and other Reformed sects that believe so hard in Determinism, is it?

Never really got that.

It seems like a cheap version of denying responsibility to me.

which is also why most of the people irl i've heard claiming that are commies btw

discipulus !qBzTcerKDk 07/16/15 (Thu) 15:14:22 No.4526

>pharaoh has free will

>God hardens his heart

>pharaoh has no free will

Well fug.

How is God wanting us to have free will compatible with him hardening the hearts of people as he pleases?

Free will unless unfree? Seems cheap.

Anonymous 07/16/15 (Thu) 17:23:40 No.4528

>>4526

he didnt knew hes heart was hardened, he acted the same way.

my bible commentary said that its more than just that ad that God did it because that extra time helped to save more people

Anonymous 07/16/15 (Thu) 17:32:07 No.4531

>>4526

God acted in his life to make his heart hardened so that he would make certain decisions, but the mechanism for his decision-making was still inside his own mind.

Anonymous 07/16/15 (Thu) 17:45:27 No.4534

How would you argue for freewill from Scripture? I'm not so interested in what scientists and philosophers say unless it can be backed up by the Bible.

Ephesians 1:4 says that God chose the elect before the creation, which means that freewill can't exist.

Anonymous 07/16/15 (Thu) 18:52:04 No.4538

>>4534

I actually think that the possibility of God choosing a path for us beforehand is compatible with free will, or at least free will as I understand it.

If God puts external obstacles or opportunities in our way, then it is still our own mind which chooses what to do in reaction to these things; even if God in his perfect knowledge knows how we will act.

If God puts internal things in our mind, shaping our mind so that we act in a certain way, then it is still our mind that acts and chooses according to that chosen configuration, even if that mind comes from God.

Maybe there is confusion because "free will" is such a loaded and ambiguous term. A better phrasing to "does system X have fee will?" might be "does system X make choices?", which is an equivalent question to any useful definition/usage of the term.

OoLF !!EmXaPcEUcU 07/16/15 (Thu) 19:37:30 No.4540

Great channel, I post it a lot on Christian boards.

discipulus !qBzTcerKDk 07/17/15 (Fri) 13:48:54 No.4590

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>4528

>>4531

But if an almighty being wants to act in a way that makes me do certain things, do I even have a chance to resist?

>God wanted to harden the heart of the pharaoh

>the pharaoh has lost

Or no?

>>4534

>How would you argue for freewill from Scripture? I'm not so interested in what scientists and philosophers say unless it can be backed up by the Bible.

>I'm only interested for facts if they are confirmed by scripture

>>4538

>I actually think that the possibility of God choosing a path for us beforehand is compatible with free will, or at least free will as I understand it.

Possibly

>>4540

It's you thread after all.

————–

I have never actually talked to a Calvinist/Zwinglian. What would they say exactly, I'm sure they have favourite arguments/passages.

How to refute it?