/christ/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

>>2509

No and yes

I know a bit about devil(s, plural) and demons, as natural thing after studying angelology is knowing a bit about demonology too, clergy exorcists' specialisation. I used to study the topic hobbistically few years ago.

Devils and demons reside in Hell, but they might also wander around Earth, if person wishing summons them.

(Unlike for angels, who are only at God's disposal)

Yes, they can possess persons. They exist because of various sins they have committed. Satan - pride, Lucifer - envy, Semyazza - lust, etc.

They have only malevolent intentions towards humans, they hate us

Sure, I can add a bit

First, let's differentiate!

While most people think that Devils and Demons are the same thing, or that there are "satans", or ever that a Satan is a rank, this does not held true to demonology.

Demon - Shedim, it's a demonisation of the word Daemon/Daimon, who were spirits believed by Greeks, Roman version being Genies (yes, related to Islamic Djinns/Efreeti/Various others), Hebrew version of this word - Shedim, comes from Shedu, other spelling of Lamassu, who also were believed to be spirits in Assyro-Babylonian mythology

(Origin of the rank Cherubim seems to be similar)

Now the difference is, Devils (Diaboli) are Fallen Angels (Angeli/Malachim), those who have joined rebellions (there were at least two Heavenly wars) or gone after lust during uprising of Grigoris (Enoch)

Now here's my theory trying to sum it up, I think Demons are just new beings, created after fall, servitors of Devils, unlike them who are original Fallen Angels. Or might be a fruit of various relationships between Devils (or Demons) and Humans, these even have the names - Nephilim being child of a Devil and a human, Cambion (Asmodeus was mentioned to be one in rabbinic legends) being child of a Demon and a human. You probably also heard various stories about Succubi, Incubi, Lilim, etc, it's a class of that and might explain how it have been done.

The difference was nicely explained in D&D, where Hellish creatures (called Fiends generally) were divided between Devils (Baatezu), Demons (Tanari) and Daemons/Daimons (Yugoloths), demonic and diabolic being also a different character traits/types. Angels were called Aasimon and have wierd non-Biblical hierarchies (Archon, which stinks like Gnosticism, Solar and Planetar, instead of your typical Angel, Archangel, Cherubim, Seraphim, etc)

Why these wierd names? Parents protected that D&D is "Satanic" so they had to rename some characters, names of those 3 Hellish races and Angels got changed, later re-introduced, except for Daemons, who remained Yugoloths (and their rulers weren't reverted either)

There are various Hellish hierarchies, based on sins or pre-fall position, where Lucifer is assumed to be Fallen Seraphim, Satan Fallen Cherubim, etc…

>>2537

While generally alligned with evil, God DID use some devils, it's said King Solomon used their power to build Temple of Solomon, being given authority of an exorcist by God. There was/is even a Church of "St. Solomon (OT characters are Saints in Orthodoxy at least) the Exorcist"

More on the whole legend here: http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php?topic=52931.0

It also mentions some Saints have used power of various demons or devils in their life, one replacing broken wheel with a demon (broken because of demon), other turned him into a horse to attend some synod, etc.

How God did use them? To do his biddings.

In Hebrew religions, historically, there were 3 main evils - Belial, Mastema and Satan. Satan is so overhyped in Christianity mainly because he was used as a boogeyman in pre-Christian Judaism right before events described in the Gospel.

Satan and Mastema were the accursors - They were "looking for various hooks" as we say to accuse people of various sins.

(I saw interpretation that Ha-Satan mentioned in Hiob isn't really a name, but a title, but how that corresponds with Mastema?)

In the story of Hiob, it was Satan (his name means literally Accurser, or Accurser of God, as Satanael, other his names are Samael or Sammael - Poison or Severity of God), Mastema was accusing Abraham and I've heard God used his power to spread the Egyptian plagues.

Are they evil, but alligned to God, or were forced by God to do so, like a demon or devil under exorcist authority?

Well, in the series SMT they were on the Law side like YHVH, as opposed to Neutral and Chaos side, led by Lucifer

(It looked funny when Satan and his concubine Lilith were in opposing fractions), might be why they tried to explain it like that.

You can dissmiss the whole idea and simply see Book of Hiob as an allegory, and reject rabbinical records about Mastema.

Main forces in Hell - Satan, Lucifer and Beelzebub, "Unholy Trinity", parodying the Holy Trinity.

Prime Vatican's Exorcist Gabriele Amorth, in his book "An Exorcist tells his story" say that Satan and Lucifer two different legions of Hell, and deecting on the eyes of possessed person you can say if it was possessed by Samael's or Helel's legion.

Where does Beelzebub fit in this? Maybe he pulls the strings? I don't know.

Well, hope that will be enough for you? It may be just an introduction tho… If you want to dig the topic further.

Here's something useful:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classification_of_demons

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_demons_in_the_Ars_Goetia

(Demons SUPPOSEDLY used by Solomon, but Goetia/Clavicula Solomonis is a known falsery/pseudoepigrapha)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theophory_in_the_Bible

(Some Devils and Demons have names ending in -el like most Angels, or with "baal")

Also funfact about Goetia - What you know as "Ars Goetia" is just part of 3, "the Lesser Key of Solomon" is about Demons (and some Devils), but there was also part about Angels and natural spirits (like nymphs, fairies, etc, mediaeval monsters)

I have not found lists of the other 2 thought. This, as complete thing, is the "Ars Goetia".

(Sorry, had to strip post in two, admin pls allow longer posts)

>>2538

Oh forgot to mention, Church of Solomon somewhere in the Holy Land

If you'll even have problem with these beings, you can use list from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classification_of_demons#Michaelis.27_classification_of_demons to counter them with Saint

There are also few nemesis amongst angels and devils, to name a few

Lucifer - Metatron

Satan - Michael

Azazel and Asmodeus - Raphael

Lilith - Leliel or Lailah/Senoy, Sansenoy and Semangelof

About the latter, first humans were said to wear "amulets" with their names engraved on them, to defend themselves from the devil Lilith, concubine of Satan.

Pic related is how these looked (modern reconstruction?) and how Hebrews imagined angels too looks like, before Hellenisation period and Ark of Covenant being build.

>>2539

Other succesful solution is the "Protection Prayer" towards angel Michael, created by one Pope so I've heard:St. Michael the Archangel,

defend us in battle.

Be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the Devil.

May God rebuke him, we humbly pray,

and do thou,

O Prince of the heavenly hosts,

by the power of God,

thrust into hell Satan,

and all the evil spirits,

who prowl about the world

seeking the ruin of souls. Amen..

Alternatively you can pray for intercession of other Angels or Saints.

The four crown princes of hell :

Satan, Lucifer, Belial, Leviathan

Each of them has different qualities/sins that stick to him, an element and a region.

Satan: Lie, treason, denial

Opposer, enemy, accusator

Fire

South

Lucifer: Pride

Lightbringer, illumination, morning star

Air

East

Belial: War, rage violence

Perfidity of this world, independence

Earth

North

Leviathan: Envy

Snake coming from the depth

Water

West

At least it is one form of categorising them, I also know one according to the seven deadly sins associating each with a demon.

This one is obviously a malapropism of the Holy trinity. But those 4 do not seem equal to me on the other hand.

Also I would not see hell as their kingdom but as a never opening cage.

But so far popular perception does not fit with the different branches of mysticism here.

It is not like there is a good God and an evil devil. There is a good God and different disobedient servants.

Is there a highest devil? How does this even work? They form an army, some kind of organisation, how can they do that when they are only driven by malintent?

Wouldn’t it all break apart and be an endless civil war between themselves, especially without a leader? But they will form an army in the end.

Are they disordered yet and will the antichrist manage to unite them? Who is the antichrist btw? Afaik he is a human without a soul, isn’t it ironic that he will lead the antihuman angel uprising?

Also I wonder if he will be created by god, or if this will be a product of devilish intervention. On the other hand I do not believe that devils can create from nothing. So maybe it will be humans that create him, they are similar to God after all.

Just my 2 cents

Any demons you know about?