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/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
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January 2019 - 8chan Transparency Report
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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

File: f88f9348ebc1b4d⋯.jpg (40.01 KB, 300x448, 75:112, 9780393292497_custom-7c6bb….jpg)

1a7e82  No.756187

After 24 Years, Scholar Completes 3,000-Page Translation Of The Hebrew Bible

For 24 years, literary scholar Robert Alter has been working on a new translation of the Hebrew Bible and — "this may shock some of your listeners," he warns — he's been working on it by hand.

"I'm very particular — I write on narrow-lined paper and I have a Cross mechanical pencil," he says.

The result is a three-volume set — a translation with commentary — that runs over 3,000 pages.

Working solo for so long on a project of this magnitude can take its toll, he says: "If you keep going verse by verse, looking at the commentary and wrestling with difficult words and so forth, you can get a little batty."

Alter says it was the "very high level of artistry" in the language of the Bible that drew him to the massive undertaking. "The existing English versions simply didn't do justice to the literary beauty of the Hebrew," he says.

As he worked, Alter found himself removing "Christological references" in the existing English translations.

"In trying to be faithful to the literary art of the Hebrew Bible I certainly edged it away from being merely a precursor to the New Testament — which is a different kind of writing all together," he says.

Take, for example, the word "soul" — you won't find it in Alter's translation.

"That's because the Hebrew word translated very often as 'soul' means something like 'life breath,' " Alter explains. "It's a very physical thing and there is no concept among the biblical writers in a split between body and soul. So I got rid of the soul."

He also changed the wording in Psalm 23 — "thou anointest my head with oil," is what you'll find in the King James translation. "But the Hebrew verb does not mean 'to anoint,' " Alter says. "The word that's actually used by the psalmist means 'to make luxuriant' — something like that. It's a very physical word. So after wrestling with other alternatives … I ended up saying 'you moisten my head with oil.' "

Alter also tried to imitate the rhythm of the original — which was a challenge because Hebrew is a much more compact language than English.

"Words squeeze together," Alter says. For example, in English it takes three words to say "he saw him." But in Hebrew it takes just one. "You know it's 'he' in the way the verb is conjugated, and then there's a little suffix at the end of the verb that tells you it's 'him.' "

Alter also tried to steer clear of words with a lot of syllables — you don't find many of those in biblical Hebrew, he says — and he omitted words that felt extraneous.

Alter points to one example in Psalm 30: The King James translation uses the phrase "What profit is there in my blood?" Alter removed "is there" to leave: "What profit in my blood?" Which he says is much closer to the rhythm of the Hebrew.

Alter always makes an audio recording of his work before handing it off to the transcriber — that way he hears everything out loud.

Of course, some day down the road another translator will come along and attempt to improve on his work.

"A translator of a great work is delusional if he or she thinks that there aren't places where the translation falls down," Alter says. He imagines this future translator will say: "That's awkward. I can see he's trying to get the literal sense of the Hebrew, but it sounds goofy in English and I can do better than that."

http://archive.fo/yllVO

1a7e82  No.756190

File: d2d26955bcc1df0⋯.png (125.56 KB, 957x537, 319:179, Screenshot (77).png)

Not even gonna lie. This is the CAPTCHA I got when making this thread. TOP KEK.


4f2658  No.756196

File: c613ff7592b687e⋯.jpg (28.66 KB, 300x418, 150:209, 300px-Into_the_trash_it_go….jpg)

>>756187

>As he worked, Alter found himself removing "Christological references" in the existing English translations

>mfw pic related

>>756190

Topest kek in the realm


20555b  No.756197

>>756187

Lmao! The Jewish Bible was not written in exclusively Hebrew. It was written in a combination of Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek. The "Jewish Bible in Hebrew" was invented in 700 AD. What a joke!


9e5522  No.756198

>life breath

>literal living essence

>physical


114c58  No.756219

What a waste of time. The Greek Septuagint has been proven to be older than the Masoratic and was also literally divinely inspired.


9be00e  No.756235

>>756187

>Take, for example, the word "soul" — you won't find it in Alter's translation.

>"It's a very physical thing and there is no concept among the biblical writers in a split between body and soul. So I got rid of the soul."

I got banned once on this very board for saying that exact same thing. Enjoy your ban. I know I'll enjoy mine for calling attention to it.


19bdc0  No.756305

>>756235

Autism.


227d19  No.756308

>>756219

Perhaps the first statement is true but I doubt about the second. There was an early belief that 70 scholars came independently wrote the Greek Septuagint and it was exactly the same but it's probably a legend. I first heard this in the church writings from Justin Martyr but I doubt you want to go to him for historical facts since he can be anachronistic at times and even got the reign of Herod wrong in his wirings.


0fd0b2  No.756318

>>756235

I thought it was standard catholic teaching that soul and body are inseparable.


5d5b30  No.756357

>>756187

>"Original" Hebrew

Call me when he does the original geek


863f5d  No.756380

>>756219

>>756357

No, while the claims that the Masoretic text contains edits or abridgements may be assertable, that does not change the fact that the original language of composition is Hebrew.

It would interest you to know that the OSB and the NETS translation both largely rely on popular translations which use the MT as the base and only deviate from it where it is necessary to agree with the Septuagint. This is in part due to the recognition of the LXX being a translation from Hebrew. The other would be just the circumstantial convenience of it as opposed to trying to translate everything from scratch and in a literal manner.

http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/nets/edition/00-front-nets.pdf


f0ed54  No.756381

>>756187

>So I got rid of the soul

That about sums the whole thing up, doesn't it?


ba6eed  No.756383

I remember this posited some interesting interpretations.

http://www.mechanical-translation.org/

Otherwise I just prefer the ASV and a variety of translations for the apocrypha. To the displeasure of Douay-Rheims fans, its apocrypha may be less desirable than that of other translations for being of second hand Latin translations instead directly from older or more original Greek sources.


b8afeb  No.756396

File: 9d926c6cd93e897⋯.png (17.03 KB, 648x328, 81:41, 1235243423.PNG)

>>756187

>Alter says it was the "very high level of artistry" in the language of the Bible that drew him to the massive undertaking

>Alter found himself removing "Christological references" in the existing English translations

>"So I got rid of the soul."

>The King James translation uses the phrase "What profit is there in my blood?" Alter removed "is there" to leave: "What profit in my blood?"

Imagine being so butthurt that you waste 24 years of your life butchering the Holy Bible by removing all references to Christ and ruining the literary beauty of it. I might as well waste 24 years of my life scribbling all over the Talmud with a crayon and selling copies of that. No one's going to read or use this translation.


21050c  No.756414

>>756396

>Alter is a jewish name

Every single time.


6302cd  No.756417

>>756396

>No one's going to read or use this translation.

I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. We live in a world where people read and use The Message.


a49306  No.756434

>>756414

A Jewish person translating Tanakh? GOSH!

Go away, /pol/. It's past your bedtime.


177295  No.756479

>>756434

this tbh fam


114c58  No.756498

>>756380

Of course the original text was composed in hebrew, but that doesn't make the Masoratic the original text. The Masoratic is a heavily edited bastardization of the original text and the Septuagint is the closest thing to the original that we have.


c3f5cb  No.756592

>>756434

A jew perverting the word of God is almost as predictable as some faggot getting in a huff over people pointing it out.


87d2b7  No.756788

>>756592

this tbh fam


aa9e7d  No.756791

>>756498

No Konstantin Ivanovich, things aren't that simple. The most authentic syntax and vocabulary can only be preserved through the Hebrew text. This is the reason why it is highly valuable to biblical heritage.

The ideal is to correct it according to Septuagint, DSS, and possibly even Samaritan readings. The Vulgate could also be important.


bc08ac  No.756835

>Robert Alter

>Alter

As if using the (((Original Hebrew™))) isn't a good enough joke.




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