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/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

File: e47a2550e067e07⋯.jpeg (248.73 KB, 2560x1440, 16:9, 8478484.jpeg)

36c163  No.808706

Do you think there is a single Calvinist out there that doesn't consider himself one the mythical pre-chosen for salvation?

1a0861  No.808714


Back in the 17th century lots of Calvinists concluded/feared themselves to be not part of the elect.

The criteria of defining this is rather…different.

On the one hand, you got the OG Dutch Calvinists that were easy to convert because their criteria was "wealth and riches are an outwards expression of being elect" and since a lot of those Dutch were middle-class spice merchants lots of them were saved.

On the other hand, you got a Prussian king who feared he was not part of the elect despite his wealth, successes and riches.

What criteria the latter used I do not know.

Tl;dr: yes, there are Calvinists who consider themselves not part of the elect.

818517  No.808723

I’m one of them. I mean I have my doubts.

578fc7  No.808725

Calvinists focus too much on the OT, to the point of idolatry. There is a New Covenant, in His blood.

dfbd88  No.808732


Yes, and it is a sad sight to behold.

508929  No.808753


I suspect the ones who choose to live in sin and 'repent later' perpetually or try suppress their wrong doing to the back of their mind.

3d3b9f  No.808760


>Back in the 17th century lots of Calvinists concluded/feared themselves to be not part of the elect.

These may be some of the only ones I admire.


Pretty much all Puritans were in the category above. I don't think their need to simplify (de-beautify) church environment was necessary, but the humility seen in their prayers and the gravity with how they preached the gospel is nothing to be sad about.

Of course, you can ignore me since I'm not Protestant, but I'm just trying to say something good. Puritans were especially not as bad as the reputation (same goes for the Inquisition on the Catholic end).

b068ed  No.808878

This always happens when you lose sacramental focus. What is the meaning of for many? Those who draw near with faith. The Eucharist is our peace with God, our salvation. And yet we must remember, there are wolves within and sheep without - freedom in Christ is not feigned. The strongest advice I'd give is to read the 1662 Eucharist - it's a picture of salvation. We are remembered who we are, but shown who God is. Who is invited to the table of the Lord?

YE that do truly and earnestly repent you of your sins, and are in love and charity with your neighbours, and intend to lead a new life, following the commandments of God, and walking from henceforth in his holy ways: Draw near with faith, and take this holy Sacrament to your comfort; and make your humble confession to Almighty God, meekly kneeling upon your knees.

The fundamental truth here is that you didn't get you to repent.

b068ed  No.808880

Remember, the fundamental picture of God is not in theological treatises, but the liturgy, in what we see and do.

02372c  No.809336


where does it say in the bible my friend?

fd6e40  No.809347

I know a calvinist, and I partially suspect they don't think they are chosen. I'm not sure they even believe in free will.

7c9716  No.809358


where does it say in tradition my friend?

8a682b  No.809365


>but the liturgy,

The Novus Ordo doesn't paint a very pretty picture of God.>>808880

>but the liturgy,

d24a30  No.809368



Passover meal in Lev 23

Leviticus 16 Scapegoat

Direct application:

Jesus revealed in the breaking of the bread in Luke 24,

The restoration of Thomas in John 20,

The picture of worship in Rev 4 (see esp 4:1)

the revelation of Christ in Matt 3 through Baptism,

the picture of the Eucharist in 1 Cor 1.

That's just for starters.

8bfd45  No.809431


the liturgy is tradition, Lex orandi, lex credendi

7c9716  No.809432


>the liturgy is tradition

It's neither normative nor descriptive tradition so why are you basing a definition on it?

e9317a  No.809453


whatever you say bro

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