/cow/ - Lolpigs

>>151156

I didn't underline everything funny. My comments/highlighting was rather spontaneous.

I would argue there was the occasional poster pointing out how how the thread was cancer, which it is

But the over all feeling was like a echo chamber for sandy vaginas

>"I HATE men and I am repulsed by them! But #notallmen"

Someone posted the thread link on /r9k/ and the thread basically balanced out and it no longer feels like an echo chamber

I don't have a beef with lolcow.farm. As far as women go, they're actually pretty reasonable.

If you want to derail a thread, just start talking about thigh gaps. Insist that not having one means you're fat or that having one means you're anorexic.

Don't be silly. Girls can't be wizards!

>>152199

Well she's not wrong

>cat thread on the front page

>:3c

not surprised in the least. did OP find a board of ozmas or something?

>>152824

You got a link of that doxxing? I need a pick-me-up because college is hosing me again.

>>152766

Witches then.

>>152826

She can't have ever spoken to or had a boyfriend or friends. Do you guys even know the rules of Wizards?

nah

lolcow.farm now 302 redirects to reddit.com/r/8chan if you access it form 8chan. copypaste the URL into your browser to access it.

pitiful. this is wizardchan tier. that's the only other website i've ever seen try to divert traffic deceptively like this.

>>154365

Maybe it's a joke.

>>154370

"Some /r9k/ and 8chan users are currently raiding the site. There may be some spam. Sorry for the inconvenience."

>>152778

She is wrong. People who live to be a century don't live miserable lives. You really think someone is able to stay healthy enough to out live the average human while living in misery?

>>154375

I've seen some miserable old folks. Including holocaust survivors. Genetic lottery.

>>154376

Fair enough.

>>154376

I think it entirely depends on the old person. You have the miserable old person, but you also have the old people who still enjoy themselves. My Grandmother (mid 80's) has been traveling the world in the decades since she retired. She's done shit I would never think of doing. Hell, she went to Antarctica once and had to be rescued when the ship she was on got flooded in a storm.

>>154384

She sounds manic.

>>154365

>>154370

>>154372

This thing with r9k is really funny to me for some reason.

First someone called lolcow the female wizardchan so r9k hopped over to collect their NEET waifus.

Now robots are reading lolcow and getting pissed at the female supremacist shit or whenever one of them mentions that she has a boyfriend. Lolcow is pissed that the sanctity of their estrogen den has been defiled. The robots on safari are going to be pissed when they finally realize they aren't getting any sex out of this.

>>154393

I think that there are probably a few wizardchan users there as well. Let's ask them. Make a big thread there about it.

>>156538

Our admin has a stick up her ass about this. So long as you follow the rules, I see no reason why you shouldn't be allowed to post shit, but she is an asshole from my few interactions with her.

>>154393

I frequent both lolcow and /r9k/ and they are incredibly similar when you get right down to it.

>>156538

How knew are you? Just wondering.

>>156540

>but she is an asshole from my few interactions with her

Go on…..

Do you mean in the chat room? Is that really her?

>>156542

Not in the chat room. I've not personally interacted with her, but from seeing her around, my impression is that she can't take a joke and wants lolcow to be a very specific way for her own entertainment rather than the general user base.

>>156543

admin seems pretty great to me. lolcow is meant to be female centric so i get the cordoning off of robots… they have a thread to themselves to shit up and basically nothing else is censored there that i can tell. it's refreshing to have a female community that isn't run by sjw fascists (for now at least)

>>156543

I kind of get that impression too tbh. Farmhand is way more annoying though.

>>156544

I sometimes get shit for being rude or something when it's not warranted. You go to /r9k/ and there aren't many rules, while on lolcow there are a lot. I still like that we have this admin, most are shit.

>>156544

Well I haven't spoken to her.

I should mention that I am extremely cynical and hate pretty much everyone, so she probably is cool and I'm just a bitch.

>>156544

this

>>156548

FARMHAND

Farmhand is the one that pisses me off, not admin. I wasn't aware there was a difference. Excuse me.

>>156548

>I sometimes get shit for being rude or something when it's not warranted.

well that's kind of retarded. granted, there is a high rate of bpd crazyass bitches on lolcow who get really vindictive and gnarly out of turn, but the nature of the main board of the site is kind of cunty to begin with, so i'm surprised any staff would try to tamp down on bitchiness.

though i wish some of the mentally ill people there would self monitor their unpleasantness. it really drags down the quality of conversation and for what purpose.

>>151119

>They have a lolcow board, too, but it's mostly bitching about cosplay and makeup gurus.

pfff, our cows are a lot more interesting than yours.

>>156551

Ya, I think that farmhand is butthurt and that whoever moves the threads is very fast to do so.

>>151081

That looks like bizzaro /r9k/. Wizardchan is far, far more extreme. At least that's the impression I'm getting from skimming the screen caps.

Reading through these more thoroughly it does seem pretty tumblr. I'm not surprised given that it's a /cgl/ community off-shoot though.

So it's bizarro /r9k/ + tumblr.

>>152199

I mean, this part sounds like /r9k/.

>>151156

Even some of the first part of this, minus the tumblr bit. Still not wizardchan territory though.

>>156526

This is classic /r9k/ if you switched around the genders. They're right at about some points though. Women in our generation are pretty fucked up, and so are the men. I don't we've had such shitty gender relations in the West ever.

Mind you, I'm not whiteknighting, and you don't need me to tell you that you're free to laugh at them. I just think it's too far to say they're wizardchan since those fuckers are robots who went over the deep end.

>>152346

Desperate times, desperate measures.

>>156538

>retroactively banned

Yeah your fucked.

>>156683

Also: Wtf is up with their obsession with anorexics? You can bring up just about any girl on the internet with an eating disorder and they try to make her into a lolcow.

Admin is a male

>I have been ambiguous about my gender up until now, but to prevent confusion, I'd just like to inform everyone that I'm male. (Every other staff member is female.)

>I prefer to preserve my anonymity as much as possible, but it feels wrong when someone assumes I'm female and to not deny it, so I think it is best to let everyone know.

Well that's weird tbh that a male is trying to run a girl chan and working so hard to control conversation. Ok then.

>>156699

Eh, we haven't had good drama in a while. A bunch of cunts from PULL hopped on over and started making shitty drama-less threads about e-stars, so the admin got more picky over what is and isn't allowed in /pt/. All the thread in /b/ suck because they get spammed by 8chan fags so there isn't much else to do other than watch anorexics die.

lolcow is okay, a little liberal but the user base is predominately women so whatever. but man, they are savage when it comes to lolcows. "hell hath no fury like a woman's scorn" really applies there.

>>157252

They should make it redirect to 8chan /g/.

>>157252

>not sanitizing your referrers

Regular lolcow user here,I just wanna defend the board by saying that we've had an influx of sjw types from tumblr lately and that misandry thread is mostly considered cancer by the older farmers who know better.

I hope you don't think we're all bitchy man haters, but I'm certainly not and I tried to point out the stupidity several times in that thread but the feefees were too much. It's fine to vent about dudes, lord knows, I do it, but that misandry thread is literally toxic.

So yeah…idk, we're not all like that. I'd say the vast majourity are all anti-sjw and pretty cool.

>>157699

I fucking warned you

>>157694

>go to lolcow.farm

>topic I visit moved to /g/

I hope I don't get banned for having a penis

>>157849

Should be okay. As long as you're talking about girl shit.

>>157694

Maybe your admin should make a board for obese, hairy-lipped headcases with premature ovarian failure. Then ban anyone who gets triggered and doesn't go there to rant.

>>157694

>misandry thread is mostly considered cancer by the older farmers who know better.

Ya no. Fuck you. I've been there from day one. There is nothing wrong with man hating you fucking faggot. It sounds to me like you're that male user who always makes posts mentioning that your a guy who browses /pt/, gtfo faggot.

>>157694

It's okay you're a really cool girl and you're one of the guys and we like you and you're popular and you're not like the others you swear

>>157694

Why are you sucking up to these spergs who gives a fuck about what they think of our board

>>157854

It was just style thread. It didn't mention male or female only soooo.

Also, in a thread about health/fitness I replied to one girl about her being anemic and how girls need to pay special attention to and not starve yourself like a retard it I got bombarded with "wow way to constantly point out you're a guy" "what a special snowflake" and all. I'm sure it was just butthurt users, and I like a lot of thee conversation, but the put downs just for mentioning your gender in a relevant fashion is kind of ridiculous.

>>157890

>wheh wheh gf not letting me watch porn is aboosive wheh

>>157905

Porn is degenerate, but so is being so beta you let your woman control you.

But clearly, the screencap you're responding to is filled with insane harpies and abusive women who get away with it because they're women.

>>157905

The reactions to it are rather insane. Greentexting isn't much of a rebuttal.

>>157912

How is any of that abusive at all? Breaking up with a man because he would rather watch porn than have sex with you seems pretty normal. I broke up with my ex for that reason.

>Letting your woman control you

Fucking lol. All I'm gathering from this is that you want to do whatever you want without your girlfriend being allowed to have an opinion on it. Your gf wanting you to stop doing something for the sake of your sex life isn't fucking "abusive" and you clearly have no grasp of what real abuse is. Breaking up with someone isn't abusive, make dealings you fucking baby.

>>157905

It's porn. You don't jerk off to porn for any emotional reason, it's all physical.

Porn is just fantasy as well, I wouldn't get on a girl for reading erotic literature.

>>157936

Why do men think that women physically masturbate to romance novels? That's almost adorable.

>It's all physical

Then why be in a sexual relationship at all? Why not just be friends? Sleeping with hookers is justified by that logic.

>>157938

Men and women are much different. A man's sexual drive, generally, is much more nagging and it feels like a necessity. I know that If I go more than a few days without jerking off it gets really REALLY annoying. Porn is just a simple form of stimuli to make the masturbation process go smoother. I doubt many women, or even men, would want to fuck every day just to sate their partner unless they're a sex addict.

And oh please, people Both masturbate and have sex in a relationship. You're ridiculous.

>>157904

Psychological abuse entails, among other things; hypercriticism, domination, control, and withdrawal of affection.

The cap of that thread clearly has posts displaying some psychological abusers, as well as retards rattling off "muh social science study" about objectification of women.

>>157694

>Farmers

>>157890

>Formatting his hard drive

I'd stab a bitch

>>157935

>giving an ultimatum to either break up or keep what you have on YOUR computer isn't abusive

>controlling people through sex isn't abusive

>forcibly formatting another person's hard drive isn't abusive

>falsely reporting CP on another person's computer because they use encryption isn't abusive

Get the fuck out back to tumblr you fucking harpy.

>11 posts in the thread

>all defending the subject of the thread

That's some dedicated shitposting.

>>157941

meant to reply to

>>157935

For example, "if you don't stop watching pornography, I will break up with you" are, in fact, psychological abuse. If you have ever said that, you are an abuser.

Trying to pass off that shit as non-abusive, or non-manipulative on /cow/ is hilarious.

Just what exactly do you think we do here?

>>157944

If a girl did that to me, I'd probably sue for lost possible profits due to ideas/publishable writing/ blueprints id have made myself being deleted.

Plus I have like every fucking STALKER mod I like saved on there.

>>157941

>>157951

>"if you don't stop watching pornography, I will break up with you" are, in fact, psychological abuse. If you have ever said that, you are an abuser.

So, you always have to stay in a relationship with someone no matter what they do and breaking up with them for any reason is abusive? Fucking hell. Accusing someone of being an abuser for wanting to leave you is abuse as well by that definition.

>>157940

Why not ask for a bj? I like it when my bf wants sex and I'll always try to satisfy him, even if I'm not in the mood. And having sex everyday isn't a lot, the fact that you think it is just shows how ruined you are because of porn.

>>157948

If he's okay with it, then who gives a fuck?

>>157957

And nothing of value was lost

>>157940

>>157938

Can confirm

>Don't choke my chicken for a few days

>Try to sleep

>Boner

>Boner goes away

>KNOW WHAT WOULD BE GOOD RIGHT NOW, JERKING OFF

>Another boner

>Can't get comfortable

>Erections at odd times

>>157962

Who are you and y u so emotionally invested on the internet?

>>157954

Not to mention lost tax info and old photos of family and friends

>>157964

Then you can't do it without porn?

>>157969

What if some anon wants to jerk off to traps/gay porn?

Are they harassing women then?

>>157962

>no matter what they do

No, but you should actually communicate before putting down an ultimatum that's ultimately about dominating and controlling them so thoroughly that they become insecure about their eye movements in public. That's abuse. Deal with it. I'm pretty much just reiterating textbook examples.

"I love you, but…"

"If you don't, I will…"

You're not helping your partner, you're abusing them.

>>157972

Well, then they're fucking gay and that's a good reason to breakup.

>>157975

no way*

>>157975

not leaving, but threatening*

drunk as fuck

>>157973

Bruh. If a person is person is doing those power ultimatums, its very likely that they're narcissists. In which case, they're incapable of love. Narcissists only value someone for narcissistic supply, if they cant get that you're worthless to them.

>>157973

You're pulling assumptions out of your ass here. Obviously these people "communicate" before hand. If that communication doesn't work out, then why am I obligated to stay with him?

>>157975

What does fantasy have to do with anything? Fantasy is not a physical thing, it comes from within you. Porn is physical and it's been linked to sex difficulties and relationship trouble in various studies. If my boyfriend can only get off to other women, so be it. Why not just be friends?

>>157984

He can get off to a lot of things. he can get off to imagination. he can get off to 2D girls. He can get off to porn. He can get off to you. Just let a man fucking masturbate in peace before he goes crazy from being both sex and masturbation starved.

>>157969

Porn makes it a loooot easier.

>>157987

Why are you giving this retard anymore attention? Do you really think she is interested in anything that isnt her narrative?

>Blah blah blah, why can't I just be friends?

Do what ever you want.

>Why am I obligated to stay with him?

Do what ever you want.

We're people on the on an online christian fun posting website. Not wise sages or genius philosophers.

>>157987

>sex starved

Here is what I don't get. Why doesn't he just have sex with me? If I requested him to have sex instead of watching porn, then why does he still need porn? All that tells me is that he prefers porn to me.

>>157984

>only

I doubt hes your boyfriend if he can only get off to other women..

Maybe he wants a romantic relationship, where you kiss, cuddle and all that shit. I'm mentioning fantasy because that's what hes doing, thinking of an arousing nonexistent scenario which he wouldn't commit in reality. Fantasies with people he doesn't know are fine, you don't have to be completely devoted in your head, romantic relationships are all about mutual trust and understanding while sharing more close experiences, you can play around in your head, and with jacking off to fantasies hes not breaking anything.

Like, would you really break up with your boyfriend because of that?

>>157984

What a crock of bullshit.

Do you have any idea of what you're talking about? Like, really, do you?

I mean

>Porn is physical

Really? Just how much of a self centered "daddy never loved me" harpy are you?

Did we hurt your whore feelings by calling you out?

Porn is not physical because it's literally fucking images on a screen, presumably.

And even if it isn't on a screen, it's still just images.

You're stupid ass is treating a god damned NECESSITY for life as a male, sexual release, as owning a god damned real doll.

If it was a sex doll then maybe, MAYBE, your skank ass would be justified, and yes I say "your" because you're clearly from there.

But it's not. It's porn.

It's fantasy.

What about the impossible shit huh?

What if he's really depraved in his FANTASIES and faps to shit like shitting dick nipples?

Let me guess

>that's even worse because she can NEVER achieve that, and as such justifies any acts of jealousy

Gimme a break.

>>157994

maybe he's not willing to take the responsibility of getting you off, because if you get him off then he'll feel bad for not doing it for you, so he just wants to relieve himself

>>157999

load of barnacles. Men fall head over heels over pretty girls that want sex. If he isnt fucking her and sticking to her, it's because she's an unlikable egoist cunt. He's probably sticking with her because he doesn't want to be alone.

>>157935

Hey hot shit throw me a fucking bone here and listen

The function of a relationship is to have children, I know you like that warm feeling all up in your cunt, but it's physically related to the essence of the creation of a human being. How about you do yourself a favor and view sex as a procreative energy only to be done between those of a connection worth creating a human being over. Consider how your parents' relationship fucked you up and then progress from there when selecting a sexual partner, it's progressive that way.

Maybe then you'll participate in a relationship that means more than the mutual pleasure between the guy and gal. You want to tell a story about that any woman who wants to get fucked but can't must be in a state of abuse, fine by me, but you'd be doing yourself a favor to notice that true sexual pleasure occurs in the mutual understanding of what makes a person, and if you're going to make a person revolving around sex then I hope you're prepared to squirt out a kid who doesn't relate with you at all until old enough to want to fuck.

You can be a slut if you want, plenty of guys are unloving assholes, I'm sure you know. But if you really want to sit around pretending there is no greater love between man and woman than mutual masturbation through sex, you might be fucked. Enjoy your rage and suffering. No really, it helps us guys determine who's worth loving.

Any woman who would leave a man due to jealousy over porn has some very deep seated issues. You should see a shrink.

>>157984

>these people communicate beforehand

Did you view the same picture that I did?

Throughout the thread, it's all about dominating and controlling.

But, again, as another anon said, do whatever you want. Don't pretend that your trying to control what your partner watches, or threatening them so they become self-concious about their eye movements, or destroying something of theirs, or guilt tripping them, and most of all trying to make them believe that it's their fault that you're treating them this way, because your feel feels are right, it's all abuse.

Man, this is a tangent, now about your board…

>>158009

Oh man what an epic reddit meme.

Romance novels have been linked to relationship problems as well. When an adult woman starts comparing you to a sparkling blood drinking fairy then you have a problem. Talk about unrealistic expectations.

>>158000

>>158003

Hey now, I'm a very passive person. I don't speak up often and I don't ask for much in a relationship. I don't get upset easily and I'm very reasonable. If he refused to comply with my one, simple request, then fuck him. I don't ask for a lot, but I expect a significant other to respect what I have to say when I do.

>>158004

Sex and relationships should be for the sole purpose of reproduction, you sound like a great boyfriend. When did I say that my relationships revolve around sex? Again, the same argument could be made about cheating. "it's just sex, why do you care?" ect. Sex and love are not mutual exclusive things, there is a lot of emotions connected to it. All you've been doing is claiming that I'm not worth loving because I have a simple request relating to sex.

>>158008

Yes, and you can't control who I sleep with during our relationshit or it's abuse. It's all about domination. Threatening to leave me, guilt tripping me, or making me believe it's my fault is abusive and controlling, it's muh body.

>>158015

> totally.

>>158017

Then ask her to stop reading them and see what she says.

>>158020

Believe me, I have. Dumping someone over it is stupid though. It's abusive. Telling someone you are going to break up with them over what turns them on when you aren't around. That's just wrong.

You are a bad person.

>>158009

>and you can't control who I sleep with during our relationshit or it's abuse.

Cheating is also psychological abuse, dipshit.

Not sure if you're damage controlling or just want the attention. Not much of a difference regardless.

>>157994

Your insecurity is not anyone else's problem.

You just want to to be sex gateway for power and personal validation.

The fact is, jackin it is better than dealing with your shit tier bullshit.

jackin it is better than dealing with your shit tier bullshit.

Time to wake up when you aren't even worth it as a cum receptacle.

>>158025

Its only cheating if you agreed to be monogamous. Otherwise you're just imposing your world view on them.

>>158018

Don't you try to dodge what I said slut.

And stop lying.

>>158018

>very reasonable

>will create ultimatums about the cocks on someone else's computer

>very reasonable

>supporting people who format HDDs to remove porn or false report CP if the HDD is encrypted

>very reasonable

Tumblrina, your definition of "reasonable" is stretched so far you could almost use it as a belt.

>>157994

Stop masturbating to other men in bed. Sure it's just in your mind. You tell yourself it's different because "he's not real". You forget that the girl in the porn is just an actress. It's light and shadow. Nothing more.

>>158027

I agree with that. But the comparison was with things their partner views, thinks, and such. Better to say if it's an implied monogamous relationship from the beginning and then "totally not an abuser" starts threatening to cheat if she can't control what you view, think, or where your eyes move, then it's abuse. I suppose.

Oh well, done giving attention.

>>158037

>>158023

It seems like you people make up your own definition of abuse, so I wont try to refute weather or not it's abuse. I have no issue with him being aroused by certain things or having sexual fantasies, I just don't want him watching porn. Why do men consider porn to be such a huge part of their lives, to the point where a woman asking you to give it up is abusive? Why do you care more about porn than love and sex?

>>158028

How am I dodging anything you said and how am I a slut?

>>158026

>power

How am I trying to assert power over anyone? Isn't he asserting power over me by not taking my emotions into consideration? Isn't he emotional abusing me by making me into a cuck and jerking off to girls that he apparently prefers over me and expecting me to be okay with it?

>>158025

By that logic, porn is psychological abuse as well.

>>158037

>Threatening to cheat

The fuck? I wouldn't cheat period, I'm saying that your argument is shit if your only defense is "it's just sex, who cares?"

>>158052

>isn't he emotional abusing me by making me into a cuck and jerking

Nope. Unless he's deliberately shoving it in your face and going HA THESE ARE SOO MUCH BETTER THAN YOU HAR HAR HAR

What you are doing persecuting for thought crime because in the end porn is merely fantasy, high definition does not change this.

The image on screen cannot hurt you.

>>158052

Think of Jerking off like eating. Sure, I'll eat lettuce, but that doesn't mean that I like it more than something like pulled pork.

>>158052

Look, you make some good points, but if you're going to ask your boyfriend not to look at porn, you need to also accept if he doesn't want always to have sex. The willingness always to have sex is absolutely and directly the same desire to look at porn. If you want a boyfriend who's always ready and who won't say no to getting off, then you should be prepared for that boyfriend to be infatuated with porn. I don't know what your boyfriend was or wasn't giving you, and you have the authority to break up with whomever you want, but its supportive to the monogamy you want to allow a person you love to choose not to have sex with you.

There are of course balances.

>>158054

>thought crime

How the fuck am I forbidding him from thinking what he wants? I'm forbidding him from watching other women get fucked in the ass. If he knows how much it hurts me, and he does it anyways, then that's abuse (by your stupid definition). It means that he prefers other women, so fuck him. He doesn't want me in the first place, so I don't want to keep the relationshit up.

>>158055

So, sex would be the lettuce and porn the pulled pork?

>>158059

When did I say that I expected him to have sex whenever I wanted to? I want him to have sex instead of porn.

>>158060

Now you're being intentionally obtuse.

>>158058

You have shit for evidence. Telling us to Google it. You can't even defend your own arguements.

>>158062

When did I say that's what you said?

>>158060

>How the fuck am I forbidding him from thinking what he wants? I'm forbidding him from watching other women get fucked in the ass

His thought is he likes to fantasize and see women get fucked in the ass.

If he wanted to do it he would go out and do it.

You have a poor conception of fantasy vs reality and are projecting your insecurities. If you are so easily hurt by thought then you are the problem and he is better off without you.

>>158064

http://benthamopen.com/cocks/pdf/TOPSYJ/TOPSYJ-5-1.pdf

>>158067

Stupid filter.

http://benthamopen.com/ c-o-n-t-e-n-t-s /pdf/TOPSYJ/TOPSYJ-5-1.pdf

(remove the dashes)

>>158068

Pen and Teller is fucking stupid. Both of them are Hollywood kikes, so of course they're going to defend it. Jews rule the porn industry and they care more about money than life. They even had an episode proclaiming that obesity was totes healthy, despite the fact that higher BMI is directly related to an increased chance of death. Why? So they can thrive on the masses buying their shit food, of course.

>>158074

What the fuck? Tell us more about yourself and your relationship.

>>158052

Bitch, do I need to explain UID'S to you too?

Figures your free bleeding heart would need that spelled out as well.

Well whatever, I'm done talking to this brick wall. Your bitching requires too much out of me and the thing I'm typing on right now is a right pain in my rear to type on.

You've been schooled numerous times in this thread already you're battered enough for the oven.

>>158058

No way lame-o

>>158074

Implying Penn is Jewish.

>>158060

>forbidding someone from doing something

>anything but abuse

>guys why are you so opposed to me imposing my views on an unwilling "lover"?

>>158044

Only for you cutie.

>>158052

>It seems like you people make up your own definition of abuse

It's pretty much textbook example of abuse. It could fall under guilt tripping, controlling, and threatening. I thought this is someone you cared about, but I guess I was mistaken. Totally not abuse.

>Isn't he asserting power over me by not taking my emotions into consideration?

Talking about the /cgl/ thread cap, your feel feels about where your partner might lay their eyes, being hypercritical, destroying property, lying about them, unreasonable jealousy, etc. all abuse.

>porn is psychological abuse as well

>Porn is cheating.

muh sides

Maybe this is a fundamental misunderstanding, though I haven't really had a relationship with a woman that doesn't understand this.

Pornography is just a masturbatory aid. That's all it is. It's not comparable to cheating. You're fundamentally dishonest.

>if your only defense is "it's just sex, who cares?"

It's a masturbatory aid. It doesn't really mean anything, and it shouldn't be hurting your feels, other than the usual indicator of how fucked up our tastes in masturbatory aids have become after a decade or longer of exposure to the world wide web.

You're unreasonably jealous. If it's another woman on the screen you're jealous of, most usually don't fucking care who that woman is, nor would most people want to be in relationship with some person who gets fucked in the ass for hours upon hours multiple days a week.

How does your warped logic apply if it's 2d, by the way? Cheating with a drawing sounds interesting.

>>158074

Did you just ad hominem Penn and Teller with antisemitism?

So this is what feminist do when losing arguements on anonymous imageboards.

>>158074

oh my god you really do have absolutely no fucking idea what the words you're stringing together even mean.

Riddle me this then, do you think you're hot enough to warrant getting fucked?

Because I could name multiple pornstars that are better people than you.

Damn it. This isn't wizardchan. We don't have waifus.

>>158090

Sorry ;p

Spouting anti semetic memes, arguing with the internet about her relationship for this long. I'm thinking she's a he or a female wizard. Either way I say we burn her.

>>158092

I haven't read the thread but from your brief description the entire thing seems like it's probably a ruse.

>>158085

But I provided actual evidence while you provided a biased show.

>>158070

>>158099

Wrong, that's opinion bitch.

You're arguing with science.

>>158099

The only thing that study says is that in some cases exposure to violent pornography may increase violent behavior towards females versus non-agressive pornography or neutral stimuli.

>>157997

>Porn is a necessity to life

Funny how men lasted without high speed internet porn for so long.

>sexual release

I'm fucking offering him sexual release but he preferred other women and expected me to be okay with it.

>Durrr daddy problems durrrr slut

Lol

>sex doll

It's on the same level as porn. I don't get why one is more acceptable than the other, really.

Porn is not a fantasy, it's something that's recorded by old jewish men who exploits girls from bad backgrounds.

>really depraved in his FANTASIES

Oh, but I thought porn WAS the fantasy. Then he's a sick fuck and I would also break up with him.

I bet you jerk off to shitting dick nipples and are butthurt that no woman will tolerate it.

All you're doing is whining and bitching about a woman not accepting something that you revolve your life around.

>>158104

>Wrong, that's opinion bitch. You're arguing with science.

Are you fucking stupid or did you intentionally not read my link?

88.2% of top rated porn scenes contain aggressive acts.

Studies show that after viewing pornography men are more likely to:

>>report decreased empathy for rape victims

>>have increasingly aggressive behavioral tendencies

>>report believing that a woman who dresses provocatively deserves to be raped

>>report anger at women who flirt but then refuse to have sex

>>report decreased sexual interest in their girlfriends or wives

>>report increased interest in coercing partners into unwanted sex acts

You're the one who's fucking ignoring science. A porn video that does not explicitly set up a rape scene can still encourage sexual violence by depicting violent acts.

>>158111

>I'm fucking offering him sexual release but he preferred other women and expected me to be okay with it.

Was that what was explicitly said or are you just projecting?

>>158110

Sorry, "agressive behavior"

>With respect to exposure effects, the results did not reveal that repeated exposure to violent or nonviolent pornography had any significant effe ct on laboratory aggression against women. These findings appear to be inconsistent with previous data showing that exposure to violent pornography may increase males' laboratory aggression toward women (e.g., Donnerstein, 1980a,b; 1984; Donnerstein and Berkowitz, 1981; Malamuth, 1978).

>The most apparent explanation for this discrepancy is that earlier inve stigations examined immediate effects (i.e., in same session that exposures were presented) whereas the present experiment tested for relatively long-term effects. It may be that exposure to violent pornography might have an immediate impact on aggressive behavior against women but this effect may dissipate quickly over time.

http://www.apa.org/divisions/div46/articles/malamuth.pdf

>>158113

Lab agression towards woman? What does that even mean?

>>158099

Your only evidence that the particular episode in question is biased is your own hatred of Jews.

Irony.

>>158111

I'm just quoting the song I linked since I've stopped giving even half of a week old under the shoe dried up crusty shit about what you have to say.

It's just my special little way of saying you're full of shit.

>>158120

Jews have always dominated porn. They also dominate Hollywood. This is why they try their hardest to normalize porn (as well as moral degeneracy in general) in the media. They don't try to hide it, either.

http://www.jewishquarterly.org/issuearchive/articled325.html?articleid=38

>>158121

Violent crime hit a 30 year low right after your little chart cuts off.

>>158123

An actual feminazi.

Tell is how the jews have kept you down. Get it all out.

>>158121

it doesn't matter if methods have changed or not, all of the previous studies it referenced back up the claim you're making, that it *MAY* increase agressive behavior in the short term. In the long term, you have absolutely no evidence to back that up.

Your study was actually from 2011, fucktard. And it's just the same shit as the studies that are referenced.

Also, maybe you should stop shitposting in order to get replies and actually read the introduction to your own evidence, summarizing the literature and stating there is no evidence linking pornography, violent or not, to any crime. It's just "agressive behavior" which means whether they would like to push the button that makes a loud noise towards the person who won the fake money or whatever shit methods they've got going on in social sciences these days. It's not a real science.

Get some reading comprehension.

>>158124

As I said, crime as a whole has gone down.

>>158122

Great argument. The only reason you faggots are getting upset is because you want to believe that porn is good and healthy and hate that I'm telling you otherwise.

>>158125

Speaking truthfully about god's chosen people makes u a nazi. When you can't criticize those who are in power, you're a brainwashed slave. A race who possesses this much wealth and power does not have the right to accuse everyone of racism for criticizing them. Enjoy your anime porn and video games.

>>158127

*violent pornography

>>158127

No. Specifically violent crime. Including rape.

>>158127

You really think that the jews control everything?

Enjoy your Nazi circlejerk.

>>158127

Actually there's a lot of holes in you argument in need of a good fisting.

I'm not ripping into you like a virgin asshole because I'm posting without a keyboard.

Good job on proving me right by the way, actually going back to the post you skipped and replying to it after the conversation had gone past that.

The only think unhealthy here is your chunky vaj bitch, sorry to dissappoint but I'm not interested in hatefucking an angry tumblrina, as much as you so desperately want us all to ravage you.

>>158121

>His behavior would indicate it. When you ignore a woman who offers sex whenever you want it and prefer to watch porn instead, then you are picking porn over sex.

Sounds like the actions of an addict to me. Still not cheating however.

> Crime as a whole has gone down, due to better police force, less drugs, ect.

The reasons are many and varied but you can't ignore the fact the easy access to porn has shit his pants and done nothing to alter this trend. it *MAY* have helped not that I've seen any hard evidence to this.

>>158132

>The reasons are many and varied but you can't ignore the fact the easy access to porn has shit his pants and done nothing to alter this trend. it *MAY* have helped not that I've seen any hard evidence to this.

I am the master of the entire word typo

>>158132

>>158134

Did…I just find another word filter?

>>158126

>it doesn't matter if methods have changed or not

Actually, it matters a whole fucking lot and can illigitamize an entire study.

>Also, maybe you should stop shitposting in order to get replies and actually read the introduction to your own evidence, summarizing the literature and stating there is no evidence linking pornography, violent or not, to any crime

But it does link violent pornography to aggression. It explicitly states it. The study it referenced that did not show a correlation was the study you linked. It states that, since that experiment (which resulted in porn being legalized) that numerous other studies have been conducted, which have found a correlation between violent porn viewing and aggression.

>>158132

That means porn must have been responsible for the decrease in crime, right? Go look up "decline in crime since 90's". No respectable author will list porn as a cause.

>>158126

>stating there is no evidence linking pornography, violent or not, to any crime. It's just "aggressive behavior"

When did I say that it was directly connected to crime? Point to where I said this, please.

>>158136

>Actually, it matters a whole fucking lot

It doesn't really matter because it's just confirming the last six "studies" they've done about short-term aggression. You know, the same ones that were referenced in the actual long-term 1986 study I linked, they're the ones that are also referenced in yours.

Zero evidence for long-term "agression." It's like saying that because microwaves may inhibit sleep for an hour or so, that having a cell phone is bad because it prevents you from sleeping.

Social sciences aren't real sciences anyway, again.

>>158137

No idea, its certainly not made it worse.

Raylene Winkel what the fuck is your problem, you don't think i KNOW ITS YOU? why are you wasting your time posting on fucking /cow/ about a shitty image board, you're 25 fucking years old.

why haven't you grown past this shit yet? It's been 8 fucking years EIGHT YEARS and I'd still notice your posts anywhere. And you bitch about your BF on the farm? man what the fuck is wrong with you, I wish I fucked some sense into you when I had the chance, well no use crying over spilt milk, next time think about what you're doing before you fucking sperg over a bunch of autists trying to defend your circlejerk forum.

Be a good girl now, I'll be waiting for you.

>>158148

OH. SHIT. SON.

Ragin' Raylene's giving me a raging erection.

Ah, this thread is a fun reminder that men and women are equally capable of being completely and hilariously terrible in all aspects

>>158058

Yes. Porn is the blight of modern society. Not the symptom of a decaying nation. But the cause of it. Just like how Jeffery Dahmer.said he murdered all those people, fucked their corpses, and ate them. Of course he also blamed the Devil. And Charles Darwin, along with Evolution. But you know what? All those that doesnt matter. Its Porn that's the issue here.

>>158123

Tfw no qt insecure anti semite gf.

>>158119

The asha, quirky and tumblr shoplifting threads also came from lolcow

>>158132

Maybe he just can't stand her ugly ass anymore but is to much of a coward to dump her.

They hate us so much, they literally copy our threads:

https://lolcow.farm/pt/res/128373.html

>>158300

I thought /cow/ and /pt/ were cool with each other.

Why are we at each other's throats all of a sudden?

>>158113

I don't know why you are scapegoating porn so hard here when the problem is men. Testosterone increases violent behavior, it's a problem with the men themselves and porn really has very little to do with it other than maybe making them slightly worse. That's like blaming the heat for making it smell like crap outside, when there are a bunch of horses standing around shitting everywhere.

It's pretty clear you're bitter because of your ex and that really bothers me. I hate how women never realize men are shit until they've personally been jilted when this should be really fucking obvious in the first place.

>>158420

>like the kind of cocks normally found on /d/.

This wordfilter is creating more humor than most threads right now, for sure.

>anecdotal evidence

I guarantee you I can find, and in fact know, "normalfags" who perpetually beat off to depraved shit. Who are you kidding? This isn't anything exclusive to imageboards.

Also, implying /v/ is wizardchan. Even then you don't understand the mentality of actual wizard/jp faggots. Give them a cute assburger of the opposite sex who shares their interests and the façade disappears. They will do ANYTHING to fucking get someone like that.

>women are not being abusive catladies

The /cgl/ cap certainly is. Telling your partner that they should stop watching porn and fuck you more is fine. When you're threatening them or being hypercritical and wanting to totally control their eye movements, what they watch, what they think, etc, with thinly veiled manipulation behind the magic "love" word, that's psychological abuse.

We're telling the "GIRL" (I don't really even fucking care what gender they are) that the /cgl/ cap is in fact, filled with abusive relationships. Why they're so steadfast in defending it, is anyone's guess. Probably because they wanted some attention. Well, they got it.

>>156703

Men are always in control. They are like Jews. Sometimes they are both like with Femen.

>>158420

I'm a man. I need to beat off to something. If a fat Tumblrina has it in her head that she don't need no man then I'm gonna beat off to porn. Just don't come crying to me when I don't want to pay for your bastard kids. Sue me, then buy a sand-blaster to blast the sand out of your vagina you miserable cunt. Porn is a symptom of the Sexual Revolution which lead to a breakdown of the traditional family. Feminism is what makes porn sell.

>>151161

>I would argue there was the occasional poster pointing out how how the thread was cancer, which it is

someone, out in that shitpile… heard my pleas.

literally, i wish i could find the post, but there was a girl on there saying that white women cannot be raped and it should only be considered "a temporary removal of oppression" and then went on to say how superior asians were and that many of them have natural blond hair and blue eyes and how superior they are

it's fucking batshit crazy, the thread is probably deleted by now because they started shitposting asians with ~natural blonde hair~

like, it can happen. BUT it's very rare

>>157872

nice b8

>>158420

>imprying

4chan was just a place full of anonymous people discussing shit that they liked. Then you had the media calling 4chan this internet abyss of monstrosities. Naturally people that are drawn to that are going to migrate. So you get these tranny faggots, the waifu faggots, and all these other douchebags shitting up place. Not even discussing the cocks, just shitposting with their "boypussy" fetishism.

This is the case of bad stock pushing out the good stock.

>>158420

Your lack of self control isn't my problem, omegacuck.

>>157994

I just want to admit to start I haven't read through this entire thread so I might be missing something, but there's a conversation to be had here about gender dynamics in relationships.

First, as to why your partner may prefer to masturbate to you, sex is great, but sometimes you just want to get off quickly. Sometimes you don't want to feel exhausted afterwards or have to consider someone else's pleasure. This is true for both men and women. Sometimes one person has more of a libido than the other.

Personal anecdote, I dated a gorgeous girl who had BPD once. The sex was constant, and amazing, but over time she became more selfish about it. She cut off the oral sex altogether, and she started wanting to focus solely on sex acts and positions that turned me off or were exhausting. I tried to keep her satisfied, tried to meet in the middle, but before long we'd ended up compromising at just regular old missionary sex. It worked for me because I need to see her face, and eye contact, and it's one of the least strenuous of positions so I could keep pumping and remain hard without cumming for the hours it would often take her to achieve orgasm (and before you say anything, at this point this is in addition to her having a vibrating egg on her clit and another one in her ass with a plug behind it and clamps on her nipples and all manner of other excessive shit.)

At a certain point it just became too much work. I found myself sneaking off to the bathroom with my laptop and jerking off to porn. We went from fucking six times a day to three times a day to once a day and me sneaking to the bathroom to rub one out.

Now, your objection to porn brings up an argument I've had with many, many girls I've dated over the years. If a guy gets a pocket pussy or onahole or fleshlight or god forbid a realdoll, he's a loser. He's pathetic, he can't get laid. Now, personally I'd never get one because I had a friend in high school who bought a fleshlight and after using it found he couldn't orgasm with girls anymore and made a series of incredibly stupid, terrible decisions after that in order to get back the level of arousal he needed to cum (short version: guy was a scumbag and got off on slipping off the condom and cumming in girls without telling them, and he moved across country to dodge paying child support.)

That aside, it's perfectly fine for women to buy dildos and vibrators and hitachi wands, rabbits, butt plugs and everything else. A guy is somehow a pervert for looking at porn, but it's fine for girls to do it, and read and write erotic fiction.

Guys are scumbags for preferring women with larger breasts or bigger butts, but it's fine for women to drool over men who look more like girls, or are really tall, or because of their accents or some other equally superficial reason.

I've had so many conversations with girls where they'll go on and on about every celebrity they think is hot, every guy who is "cute" or "sexy" and "gets me so fucking wet" and then I'll name some girl I think is "pretty" or "has a nice figure" and then it becomes a fucking interrogation. "Her? You like her? But she's so ugly! What the fuck is wrong with you?! She's a stupid slut! You just like her because she's a SLUT! Men are so stupid! Men are so shallow! That whore should DIE!"

I wish I was exaggerating but for an example, my current girlfriend flies into a rage if Hannah Minx is brought up, and swears up and down that the reason Hannah Minx has disappeared from YouTube is because she personally murdered her. She's joking of course, but the rage is very real.

>>159649

Shit, I can't figure out any order to read this in where it makes sense. "I'll kill you" seems like it should be last but with it's positioning you can't just left to right or right to left or start in the top and go down the line before moving over. There's no way to read this that makes sense what the fuck,

i don't get what is so wrong with porn and masturbation

just because he jacks off or watches porn doesn't mean he doesn't find you sexually attractive or that he prefers other girls or anything. If that were true he would just cheat or dump you.

holy shit, i don't get why female wizards think this is manipulative or abusive

>>157994

I doubt you are receptive to sex EVERY time he is horny and nature has programmed us to seek variety when it comes to sex partners. I am going to assume you aren't too dense enough to understand a basic cost/benefit analysis of sex and reproduction with respect to our differing biology.

It has literally nothing to do with you, and I am sure he prefers sex with you over porn but even if you were a perfect 10 and your vagina was open to him 24/7/365, it would not erase his primal instincts.

This is what pisses off a lot of guys. Men have been trying to figure out and understand female sexuality since the dawn of time. Granted, its generally been with the goal of getting more sex that we engage in this pursuit, but at least we try.

Male sexuality is much, much simpler than female sexuality, but woman can come on forums like this and get honest, straightforward answers from real men explaining things in the simplest of terms. You may not like the answers, but your feels don't change the answers. The fact that men still get shit for watching porn, or "objectification", or any number of things that women use to demonize male sexuality is good evidence of the inherently narcissistic nature of women, in my opinion. It's like it is impossible for a woman to imagine that other people, even of the opposite sex, think differently than they do and they are unwilling to make an attempt to understand them.

>>158431

>I guarantee you I can find, and in fact know, "normalfags" who perpetually beat off to depraved shit. Who are you kidding? This isn't anything exclusive to imageboards.

That's part of my point, though. Porn use has become so normalized that everyone uses it, I was just using imageboard users as an example because the consequences of frequent, long-term porn use is more obvious and observable in their case.

There's plenty of research that's been published on the consequences of porn use, anyway, in the case that you're simply going to shoo away any anecdotal evidence I provide. Great Porn Experiment comes to mind.

>>158798

>Fuck, you have any idea how bad is the sluttiness in the western world? fucking biologists are saying the hormones from birth control pills are killing the fucking fish

AFAIK the main cause of male infertility and lowered testosterone levels in both the human and animal world is a result of plastic pollution, in particular Bisphenol A. Horrifyingly, BPA is mostly used in plastic designed for cups, bags, or other drinking implements or items for holding food, so it effects humans from an extremely early age (even baby bottles are made using this stuff). I don't disbelieve the idea that contraceptives have a hand in it - all those chemicals woman take and end up pissing out are gonna end up somewhere - though I think you are overstating its effect somewhat.

But anyway, whether or not what you are saying is 100% true, it's a bad argument to defend something because there is something else that is worse. Why can't someone be against both promiscuity and porn, even if their negative effects aren't equal?

>>159359

Not really going to argue with this (I've seen the various /v/'s and /pol/'s come and go in terms of quality userbases), but it's not really relating to my point.

>>159661

>>159009

>>159725

Not really disagreeing with these points, however bear in mind that you are all confusing masturbation and masturbation using porn. I'm sure 99% of the male population has jerked off at some point or another and the world hasn't ended, but throw in regular porn use over an extended period of time and you're going to see consequences, namely desensitization to normal sex acts, requiring more intense/depraved acts to get off, lowered testosterone and lowered motivation.

This line is also telling of this confusion:

> A guy is somehow a pervert for looking at porn, but it's fine for girls to do it, and read and write erotic fiction.

I think there is a pretty big difference between a woman masturbating to romance novels once a week and a guy beating off to gangbang cuck porn 3 times a day. It's like saying having a glass of wine once a week and being a heroine junkie are identical.

Not to say women are incapable of becoming porn addicts - I've actually known one, and it's a really bizarre thing to witness - but in general porn use is primarily a male problem, since it appeals more to male sexual desire and preys on the addictive complex that humans have.

And for the record, no, I'm not anti-masturbation. Pretty sure most men, single, married or not, jerk it any chance they get, given the hurried lives of early marriages.

My argument is against porn specifically.

>>159371

Not even sure what your point is, but lol at the irony of someone who masturbates while watching other people have sex calling someone else a cuck.

>>160179

>There's plenty of research that's been published on the consequences of porn use, anyway, in the case that you're simply going to shoo away any anecdotal evidence I provide. Great Porn Experiment comes to mind.

Yeah I've watched that video before, it's full of horse shit making scientific claims where there are none, misrepresenting studies and even at one point iirc citing a study without controls as confirming his pre-conceived bias.

Next time try not to be sold a crock of shit. There may be problems with porn habits, but you certainly haven't demonstrated any scientific studies that validate your assertions. And then it doesn't actually justify cat ladies abusing the sad sacks that they've picked up.

>namely desensitization to normal sex acts, requiring more intense/depraved acts to get off, lowered testosterone and lowered motivation.

Isn't lowered testosterone a good thing, seeing as you were the one rambling about the horrible aggression of males earlier? Or are you another faggot? Either way, of your assertions are are actually supported by any studies. Ones with control groups.

>>160179

is your boyfriend watching porn that big of a deal to you?

like, holy crap

>>160179

>I think there is a pretty big difference between a woman masturbating to romance novels once a week and a guy beating off to gangbang cuck porn 3 times a day.

Sure is, but what if he only beats off to gangbang cuck porn once a week rather than 3 times a day? Porn is not SuperHeroinMeth+, not all guys are instantly addicted to the stuff and unable to stop jerking off.

>>160179

>I think there is a pretty big difference between a woman masturbating to romance novels once a week and a guy beating off to gangbang cuck porn 3 times a day. It's like saying having a glass of wine once a week and being a heroine junkie are identical.

Now you're just attacking male sexuality. Women are just as likely to become masturbation addicts.

In my rambling mess of a post, I gave an anecdote about one of my exes. Instead of porn (though she did look at it on occasion) she desensitized herself with sex toys. This is ridiculously common with women. They buy a vibrator because they can't bring themselves to orgasm with just their fingers, then they find they can't orgasm from regular sex. Before long they're adding other things to try to achieve a greater sensation. Inserting larger objects, more clitoral vibration, stuff in their ass, vibrating nipple clamps. The most popular type of vibrator for women is the jackrabbit. What is a jackrabbit? Let's diagram this shit out. First off there's the shaft. The shaft itself is vibrating, but depending on the model it either pumps in and out on it's own, or it has rotating beads inside. Sometimes both. The main feature though is a small rabbit extended from the top (sometimes it's other animals, but this is the most common.) The rabbit has it's own motor which causes it's tiny ears to vibrate back and forth against the clit. Some models take this further by having a second appendage for anal insertion.

Even if it's just a vibrator, tell me, how many guys do you know who remain as hard as plastic and vibrate during sex?

Compared to a guy rubbing his dick to a video of a girl taking a load, what woman do is volumes more desensitizing.

>>160249

Not to mention that estrogen has the side effect of producing critical levels of unfunnyness.

>>160488

Woman have greater sex drives then men. Trust me.

>>152799

>ozma

Isn't that some SA mod?

>>157890

>when I started dating my boyfriend, I formated the HD, I don't put up with that sort of crap. I don't want my boyfriend masturbating for other women

I'm so glad I'm gay sometimes.

>>160207

>I think the barely-concealed bitterness

If my posts are bitter to you, you need to get your head checked out.

But since you want to keep derailing the thread and being a faggot about this, as a holier-than-thou rambling about porn addiction and desensitization (while not actually linking to any evidence to back up these assertions), you can take these, that actually prove you wrong on several assertions you made:

There is no evidence to suggest that your idea of "porn addiction" actually exists: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26095441

Feel free to actually point to point to something that presents a model of "porn" "addiction" comparable to actual addiction. Words mean things, big shocker.

2012 review of the literature, looking at the effects of internet porn on adolescents, found no conclusive evidence suggesting that "pornography leads to unrealistic sexual beliefs, more permissive attitudes and more experimentation." https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/view/25724267/the-impact-of-internet-pornography-on-adolescents-a-reuniting

Viewing pornography increased couples’ desire to be with their significant other, whether they’d seen the pornographic film alone or together: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23224749

There is no evidence that there's such a thing as "porn desensitization" i.e. the more porn you watch the more extreme the cocks needs to become, nor is there any evidence to suggest pornography is likely to impact sexual arousal responsitivity, in fact it's the opposite. Evidence suggests that watching more pornography increased arousal to less explicit material - AND INCREASED THE DESPIRE OF SEX WITH THEIR PARTNERS. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/sm2.58/abstract

> With these data from a wide variety of communities, cultures and countries we can better evaluate the thesis that an abundance of sexual explicit material invariably leads to an increase of illegal sexual activity and eventually rape. Similarly we can now better reconsider the conclusion of the Meese Commission and others that there exists "a causal relationship to antisocial acts of sexual violence and … unlawful acts of sexual violence" (Meese, 1986, page 326). Indeed, the data reported and reviewed suggests that the thesis is myth and, if anything, there is an inverse causal relationship between an increase in pornography and sex crimes.

http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/2005to2009/2009-pornography-acceptance-crime.html

>>160900

>>160657

>>160813

You don't get out much. Girls can be very sexually agressive and there is a reason why they make more vibrators than plastic holes to fuck. They also print a lot of "romance novels" and have you ever pondered the popularity of Justin Beiber?

>>160858

Oh man, look her up on ED or something, it's quite the read.

>>160179

>Not even sure what your point is, but lol at the irony of someone who masturbates while watching other people have sex calling someone else a cuck.

Because you plus the super butthurt dangerhair thats been posting in this thread cannot separate fantasy from reality.

Yes there is a problem with porn addiction but hows that different to any other addiction? Banning things just make it a thousand times worse.

But its still fantasy, all you virgins who keep saying watching porn is like being the same room with people having sex a clueless beyond belief.

>>160978

>Actually, I linked a plethora of published studies

None backing up any specific assertions.

>You know, I was genuinely curious at to what bizarre studies you were going to link me proving that the sky is green.

>So unless you're trying to convince me that the majority of porn users don't masturbate to it

You didn't refute anything. Addicts show increased brain reactions to the object of addiction. There's no model suggesting that what you call "porn addiction" is actually addiction to pornography. Perhaps hypersexuality, but not addiction to pornography. Feel free to prove me wrong, by actually posting evidence. Oh wait, you never make specific assertions. Silly me.

http://www.health.harvard.edu/mind-and-mood/the_addicted_brain

http://www.prlog.org/12469869-porn-problems-unlike-any-known-addiction-in-largest-neuroscience-study.html

>>160978

Also I love how you ignore the other studies that you can't refute, in your squirmy little brain with your holier-than-thou attitude, as if you know addiction better than fucking neuroscientists who study it.

>masturbating to porn regularly deteriorates the sex drive

That's just masturbating. What does the pornography have to do with it, other than an aid? I can crank one out several times a day using my imagination, where's the requirement for pornography? You have any evidence backing that up? Or is that just like everything else you post, in that you just post random studies that have nothing to do with the claims that you are making. :^)

>>160987

This isn't about fantasy vs. reality so much as it is about desensitization and novelty-seeking, things that could easily wreck a sexual relationship with a real person.

>Banning things just make it a thousand times worse.

Much like how making murder and rape illegal made those issues a thousand times worse.

>>161019

>None backing up any specific assertions.

Beep boop, none backing up any assertions, Captain.

From a study that was heavily referenced in the second link, regarding, desensitization and a depletion of motivation (it can be found here: http://archpsyc.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=1874574 )

>A representative Swedish study on adolescent boys has shown that boys with daily consumption showed more interest in deviant and illegal types of pornography and more frequently reported the wish to actualize what was seen in real life.

>In partnerships, a decrease in sexual satisfaction and a tendency to adopt pornographic scripts have been associated with frequent Internet pornography consumption. A longitudinal study following Internet users has found that accessing pornography online was predictive of compulsive computer use after 1 year.

>Similar to theories taken from addiction research, it has been speculated in popular science literature that pornography constitutes a prewired, naturally rewarding stimulus and that high levels of exposure result in a downregulation or habituation of the neural response in the reward network. This is assumed to elicit adaptive processes in which the brain is hijacked, becoming less responsive to pornography.

There's also this excerpt, which, while not entirely related to the argument, is interesting nonetheless, and supportive of the idea that skinnerbox systems and overstimulation are not restricted to human psychology:

>Interestingly, the phenomenon is not restricted to humans; a recent study found that male macaque monkeys gave up juice rewards to watch pictures of female monkeys’ bottoms

>>161019

>There's no model suggesting that what you call "porn addiction" is actually addiction to pornography. Perhaps hypersexuality, but not addiction to pornography. Feel free to prove me wrong, by actually posting evidence.

From a Cambridge Study, found here: http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0102419#s3

>Subjective ratings of desire and liking of videos were dissociated in which there was a group-by-rating-type-by-video-type interaction (F(1,30) = 4.794, p = 0.037): desire ratings to explicit videos were greater in CSB compared to healthy volunteers (F = 5.088, p = 0.032) but not to erotic cues (F = 0.448, p = 0.509), whereas liking ratings to erotic cues were greater in CSB compared to healthy volunteers (F = 4.351, p = 0.047) but not to explicit cues (F = 3.332, p = 0.079). The desire and liking scores to explicit cues were significantly correlated (HV: R2 = 0.696, p<0.0001; CSB: R2 = 0.363, p = 0.017) although the linear regression was not significantly different between groups (F = 2.513, p = 0.121). There were also no differences in the video-rating scores for desire and liking for each condition between the scanned healthy volunteers and an additional 25 healthy volunteers suggesting the subjective ratings to the videos were representative (p's>0.05). All subjects reported they had not previously seen the videos prior to the study.

In other words, people with Compulsive Sexual Behavior had a much greater desire to view erotic cocks, but their actual sexual reaction to the videos were weakened.

I actually read your articles, and while you do appear correct in that "sex addiction" does not fit the standard model of addiction that can be applied to substance abuse or gambling, it's likely that porn addiction (and sex addiction, for that matter) are different in terms of how they effect the brain, yet can still cause a compulsive desire, hence the term "Compulsive Sexual Behavior" ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2945841/ ). It's interesting to note that the article you posted, while measuring the effect of porn specifically, seemed to lump it in with CSB.

I suspect a reason for CSB having a different effect on the brain than addictive substances or other traditionally addicting things might be due to these actions being explicitly sexual, and thus involving orgasm, which could certainly effect brain chemistry in a more (or maybe less) radical way, however that is just a guess.

(continued from the previous post)

>>161031

>>161031

> as if you know addiction better than fucking neuroscientists who study it.

There's that bitterness showing through again.

This isn't some crackpot theory, as the links I have posted have proven, there are plenty of psychologists and neuroscientists pursuing research into this particular area.

The effects of porn on psychology are not yet fully understood, seeing as freely-available, easily-accessible HD internet porn is a relatively new phenomenon. I suspect within the next 10 years, the dysgenic and addictive (or compulsory) effects of porn will be much better understood, and there will be a greater movement by the medical community to combat its reach and influence.

>>161031

>That's just masturbating. What does the pornography have to do with it, other than an aid?

Porn specifically causes desensitization, read a few paragraphs north of this sentence.

> where's the requirement for pornography?

Of course there is no requirement (if there were I'd imagine we wouldn't have survived as a species for very long), however from the ubiquitousness of porn throughout the internet and its use among most of the population under 40, it's clear an enormous amount of people who masturbate also use porn as an aid.

This isn't directly related to your question, however it should be noted that part of regular porn use is the conditioning of the brain. This has two major effects:

1). premature erectile dysfunction

http://yourbrainonporn.com/research-confirms-sharp-rise-youthful-ed

>A 1999 cross-sectional study (based on data gathered in 1992) published by the Journal of the American Medical Association reported erectile dysfunction rates of only 5%, and low sexual desire in 5%. In that study, the ages of the men surveyed ranged from 18 to 59, so a third of them were over 40, which means the rates for sexually active men under 40 were lower.

>sing the IIEF-5, a 2012 cross-sectional study of Swiss men aged 18-24 found ED rates of 30%, and a 2010 Brazilian study of men 18-40 reported ED rates of 35%. A 2013 Italian study reported one in four patients seeking help for new onset ED were younger than 40. Astonishingly, the rate of severe ED was nearly 10% higher in younger men than in men over 40.

Maybe there's just something in the water, but these statistics coincide very nicely with the rise and availability of HD internet porn.

2). induction of fetishes and aberrant sexual behavior

http://yourbrainonporn.com/are-fetishes-innate

>This is where supernormally stimulating novel porn can really start morphing tastes. As desensitization sets in, the brain seeks more dopamine via novelty, seeking, shocking, forbidden, kinkier, etc. Pretty soon one can't get off to original tastes. Very scary, but usually reversible by stopping all porn/porn fantasy.

Here's a quote from a porn-recovery forum:

> I don't know if you check on a regular basis reddit, 'empty closet' etc… websites about the porn confusion/orientation, but there are just thousands of threads with people freaking out about why they want to suck cocks or watched wierd stuff after use of porn.

>Even the 'empty closet' forum is full of people, gay/bi/straight that are completly lost and confused about their orientation and they ALL mentionned their porn use.

>It looks like the high speed generation of porn users is now going online and asking for answers. On French forums, it's the same. So many don't know why they developed penis fetish or femdom addiction…there are litterally thousands of people reading the posts and the common factor of all those people is internet use (porn, chat, dating site).

As someone who at least casually uses the chans, you should have always been at least somewhat curious as to how people start liking dickgirl porn, or why furries exist. It isn't that some people are inherently that way, but rather that they were conditioned through porn, or they experienced some kind of misfired sexual imprinting, which porn allowed them to manifest more acutely.

Now in case that's too anecdotal for you, here's an essay putting forth a theory of sexual fetishes being acquired through conditioning, rather than as an innate part of the individual. While the essay is more about fetish development in general, rather than as they relate to porn specifically, it makes more sense in the context of the mass-availability of internet porn. I've always had a difficult time believing some people are just "born" being into traps or whatever.

www.reuniting.info/download/pdf/Pfaus_Sexual_Reward_2012.pdf

Oh, and by the way

>:^)

Ironic emojis and lmao's are always the last resort of some desperate poster shooting steam out of their ears but not wanting to appear mad. Might as well type "Look at how not-angry I am!" at this point.

>>161573

Sorry to burst your bubble, but wasn't that advert a fake?

>>161655

It's a satire of anti-masturbation faggotry.

>>161660

But is that still a thing though? I thought we drowned out that mentality a few decades ago.

>>162244

You still have anti-masturbation types out there, but they're mostly redpillers aka "No More Mr. 'Nice Guys'"

Because they can't feel anything because they jacked off to Black Lagoon too much Ah, who am I kidding, these closet cases probably beat off to G Gundam, they now have to tell us about how masturbation totally kills your sex drive or some bullshit when science could tell you that the amount of semen that comes (no pun intended) out after masturbation is nowhere near enough to kill your sex drive. Basically, a bunch of "Have No Fun" people running around.

>>162244

My girlfriends parents are hilariously anti masturbation. So no. It's still a thing with Baptists. Which is why she has me stash all her sex toys at my place. Like two drawers full at this point. Also since we have a lot of sex that sort of proves that one isn't going to sate the urge for the other. Though she hilariously hates porn. Basically she just masturbates in the tub.

Self-esteem issues tend to happen.

>>162313

Horseshoe theory strikes again. Hell, wouldn't it be healthier to keep the plumbing in use rather than let it get backed up?

I think a lot of problems here come from men and women having different sex drives in ways that are difficult to explain. But while most men in the internet age (or at least me) have pretty much gotten over 99% of hangups about whatever girls do to get themselves off, many women still have a LOT of hangups about sexuality, both their own, other women's and men.

>>160657

i never called you a fat crazy cat lady. I just said you are taking porn way too seriously

>>163398

Probably due to the toxoplasma Gondii she got from all those cats.

>>158111

>science!

>posts zero link to recent studies

BTW any studies from the 70s and 80s are shit

Can this thread be nominated for lolcow status?

Forum full of men pretending to be women (this is how all these places are) and the one token woman from there who is upset about /lolcow/ linking to it comes here to start a bitch fest on how shitty men are and how they shouldn't look at porn because it deprives attention from her.

/r9k/ might be pathetic, but at least it doesn't shit up a good milking.

>>158111

Violent acts of lovemaking? How terrible. Better throw out all my girlfriends bdsm stuff. She's turning me into a monster…what the fuck are you on about?

Out of all of you faggots who had to come to shit up our board it had to be the Revy avatar-fag

>>164106

We're not suppose to talk about her!

>>164138

I thought we weren't respecting pronouns.

>>164007

https://lolcow.farm/g/res/7363.html#7575

>>164106

>Out of all of you faggots who had to come to shit up our board it had to be the Revy avatar-fag

Really? That's hillarious. We got your jellous cosplayer, though, so it's a fair trade.

>>164007

I've seen squirting/peeing arguments before but the one in that thread is so much more entertaining.

>>160657

Dildos and vibrators are disgusting objects of hostility toward and objectification of men. Women who use them are desperate, misandrist, and entitled.

>>164077

are you kidding? this is a laugh riot

>>161486

>Much like how making murder and rape illegal made those issues a thousand times worse.

False equivalence, most people dont' get their rocks off on this. Likely an evolved trait so you know, we don't go around destroying our own race.

>>158420

best post itt. why cant people just be sane?

>>158130

Yes goy, us jews don't control anything, especially not porn and hollywood. :^)

>>165160

Shouldn't you be pretending to be a feminist or editing Ben Garrison cartoons in your basement? Maybe posting on wizardchan?

>>165189

I'm sorry, did I trigger you? Nice projection, faggot.

>>165127

nah its just dumb, don't understand why people have to be so sex-crazed (both men and women.) women are starting to watch just as much of that trash. its desensitizing. try not watching porn for a month and then watching some softcore shit, it feels like you're a new person. honestly if i dont watch porn for like a month im overcome with so much more lust that i could probably nut to a picture of a blurry titty

>>165343

>/pol/fag gets subtly BTFO'd by another /cow/boy

>uses the trigger and projection cancer

Yep, this guy really is a Jew himself.

Breathe some cyanide, faggot. We don't want your shit on /cow/

>>165471

What's funny is that the Jew actually btfo the /pol/tard. Happy Rosh Hashanah, motherfucker.

>>165348

You know what would work even better? If we made all the woman cover themselves up when not with their husbands. Or you could try not forcing your life style choices on others.

>>165471

All that subhuman butthurt.

>>165605

Yes, those white trash /pol/ tears sure are tasty.

>>156553

Do the psychotic jackasses here tone it down real often

>>165627

>Breathe some cyanide, faggot. We don't want your shit on /cow/

Keep pretending that you didn't get completely buttblasted back there.

It's all right to cry sometimes, I'd also cry if I weren't white.

>>165703

That wasn't me. Check post IDs. More importantly, that was definitely a white dude. Jews wouldn't tell other Jews to gas themselves like that. Jewish insults are a bit more colorful.

Why are you trying so hard?

>>165703

>>165605

>>165471

>>165343

>>165284

>>165189

Out of all these who seems the maddest?

>>165728

>Why are you trying so hard?

Do you feel that I'm trying hard?

Maybe you feel a bit butthurt, but you don't want to admit it?

Just let it out, my non-white friend.

>>165762

That's right.

Let the butthurt flow from your subhuman ass.

>>165763

If you're going make this thread about your feels as a white man we are going to need more about you.

>>165765

>No u

Well, that got boring pretty fast.

>>165767

I'm glad you see it our way, but there are more graceful ways to back out than this. For example, stop posting. Just leave.

>>165776

What's wrong?

Did someone hurt your feelings?

>>165865

>imgur picture of a shitpost from 4chan

Tip top bait, dearie.

>>165865

I don't think I've ever posted a may-may in all the time I've visited Chan sites.

>>165865

>>>/ints/

>>165920

You posted several in this thread, including "let the butthurt flow". Maybe its time to step.away from the keyboard.

>>165348

Sounds like you lack self control, and are confusing porn with

NOT JERKING OFF

for fucks sake I'm tired of you retards shitting everything up with your own warped perspective.

Of fucking course you'd feel like that if you never got sexual release for a month, it's fucking biologically hardwired into the male anatomy to need to beat off regularly.

Christ this isn't even about romance, it will literally interfere with your day to day life if you don't get sexual release.

It's to the point where your body will just do it unconsciously through raw imagination via a wet dream if you don't have any manual release consciously.

Why the fuck do girls think they get male sexuality in terms of living with it.

>>158183

Why do you fucking retards keep trying to imply that I'm blaming porn for all evil in the world? All I'm saying is that it's bad for a relationship and I don't want my bf to watch it. Why are men so buttfucking crazy aggressive about defending porn to the point of illogical stupidity? Porn make men less attracted to women they are in relationships with and it also make sex less enjoyable. It's bad for long lasting relationships and can give men disgusting/violent sexual fetishes.

You faggots are getting so, so, so fucking angry about me forbidding my boyfriend to watch it. It's like men can not function without porn and depriving them of it is unspeakable abuse.

>>158278

I broke up with him long ago, I have a new bf now and he doesn't watch it. It was the old boyfriend I was talking about.

>>158370

/cow/ has known about us for fucking ages. I don't know why they're suddenly pretending to have just discovered us.

>>166269

Probably because he jacks it to menudo, or some adult diaper baby shit stories. Or maybe he's just a run of the mill panty sniffer.

Is he allowed to talk to other girls?

>>166266

You were in the reserve. We keep one so we don't resort to board cannibalism. Learned that lesson. Let's us be at ease.

>>166266

You don't need porn to develop fetishes. An actual fetish by definition is something you can't get off without and usually develops a bit earlier than your late teens to early 20's. You mean kink. What's more you can't seem to grasp causation vs correlation. If a guy jacks it to some strange stuff, the wiring was probably already there. Otherwise you could turn someone gay or straight with porn. Which is just retarded.

This whole arguement has been retarded. Why are you so obsessed with porn? I personally hate romance novels, but you don't see me trying to ban them. I don't threaten to dump my girlfriend for reading twilight while I'm reading do androids dream of electric sheep or whatever the book of the day is. Today it was naked lunch for me and she was reading the Taking of Sleeping Beauty or some other Ann Rice trash.

The problem with your entire arguement is that it's based on junk science and feels. You have relationship issues. You need to see a shrink.

>>166266

>All I'm saying is that it's bad for a relationship

>It's bad for long lasting relationships

wew, [citation needed] :^)

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/sm2.58/full

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/sm2.70/full

http://www.researchgate.net/publication/233887342_Erotica_Viewing_Effects_on_Intimate_Relationships_and_SelfPartner_Evaluations

seriously though, you've never watched pornography with your partner? even for a laugh? I feel bad now.

>and can give men disgusting/violent sexual fetishes.

yeah and so can various experiences in anyone's upbringing or throughout their lives: you don't need erotic material for that.

>so fucking angry about me forbidding my boyfriend to watch it.

no one's angry, you're free to keep him on a leash however you want.

however, what was at issue earlier in the thread was a /cgi/ cap, which was filled with probable psychological abusers.

maybe it hit a little too close to home, and you went on the defense out of guilt?

perhaps because you're a tad too controlling and borderline psychologically abuse your partner? :^)

>men can not function without porn

but that's not really the argument. if you don't have a partner, men or woman, you fucking need sexual release to function normally.

you need to clean out the tubes occasionally at a bare minimum. in the case of having a sexual partner, I suggest reading >>159661

sometimes I just want to fucking release without worrying about getting you off. and I want to do it quickly, with an aid.

so I go jerk off. it's pretty simple.

alleging that pornography is bad for relationships, or that it gives anyone (men or women) "disgusting/violent fetishes" lays bare your preconceived notion. you have zero evidence to back these assertions up.

and here's the kicker: over-consumption of pornography may be an indicator of a bad relationship, but that doesn't suggest that it's the cause, especially in the general case. simply a symptom. you're free to present evidence suggesting otherwise.

>>166266

Nah nigga. Its yo stanky ass pussy thats stopping your boy from popping a stiffy. No amount of cartwheel midget tranny acrobat porn is going to stop men from being attracted to beautiful women.

>>166502

Midget acrobat porn? I really want to see this. Please tell me it involves clown makeup and props.

Quick story. I met an ugly blue haired girl on the bus while on her phone. I was planning to go pizza face tonight, till I saw what was on her phone.

It was wizardchan. Something about different breeds of norms, as if they were pokemon.

My sausage went soft and I never did pickups on the bus again.

I watch porn with my boyfriend and we are doing alright. A decade and counting. Haven't married yet due to financial reasons and personal mental reasons as in trying to let go of baggage since we both came from fucked up backgrounds but taking it slowly.

We don't have vaginal sex most of the time and just masturbate each other off.

>>151169

So far they're one of the least retarded female communities I've seen online. I mean the fact that they're an imageboard and not an attention-whoring social media site puts them ahead of most of the other women on the internet. Which is saying a lot seeing how most girls spend their time online

Like I said in >>158002 the combination of tumblrisms with racism is really rather bizarre.

It actually kinda makes sense, if you don't want to get raped, stay out of the hood

>>162349

Ever been on a tour of Pompeii? It's full of porn murals

>>165081

Is this Leigh Alexander? https://archive.is/Ae6Gs#selection-3173.0-3187.140

>>164019

I'm not picky, I'll fuck'em all to DEATH

>>162313 Mermaid's Scar, here! Masato is DA MAN!

>>158420

You can easily rewrite all of this with addiction to substances.

>>151081

I laugh, but then I'm sort of filled with a deep depression at the disintegration of western society

>>161486

Thanks for reminding me I need to masturbate btw, you authoritarian /pol/ack faggot

>>160485

>>160813

>>160249

As always, revyfag comes back for some more humiliation. Wanna get doxed again, bitchboy? Are you gonna make a new Steam account to keep roleplaying? Or are you too busy dealing with being a virgin unemployed lonely transfag? So many questions, so little time!

Well, at least they hate tumblr too: https://lolcow.farm/b/res/60529.html

>>151081

I swear to god my half sister has the same fucking story.

>>195681

minus the subway bits

>>195429

Well she has the wrong idea of what MRA is, but at least she doesnt drinks the feminazi koolaid about not teaching women how to avoid rape

>>162379

Is that fucking wil wheaton?

We should merge this with the wizardchan thread and link them both here. Can you imagine the internet slap fight?

>>158172

Replacement for children.

>>195424

It's a lot easier when everyone involved is not a hilariously broken person with no idea how a human being is supposed to function

>>197396

So you're saying it's a lot easier in fiction? Everyone I know is broken in some way. The trick is to roll with it, if possible. I mean in some cases you have to abandon ship but usually you just eat it knowing she's doing the same for you.

After a few years every relationship is more about convenience than lust or "love". You love your children, but you just put up with your wife because she knows where all the bodies are buried.

>>160900

> the more porn you watch the more extreme the cocks needs to become

And the wordfilter scores again

>>157694

Kill yourself you fucking whore.

>>157694

Then post swastikas until they leave

>>160657

You change your id's so much, nofap. Tell me again how all the girls want you and they can't keep themselves off of your rod because you don't think about your penis.

>>160978

Changing id's again! Why do you think it's so bad to fap? Are you from /pol/?

>>196992

Of courshe.

>>197409

And that's why the entire thing should have just been killed off as to spare us the indignity of it all. The entirety of life is worthless and all things must die.

Ashes and Echoes

>>158148

Did this meme come into play recently? Or has it always been imageboard culture to assume that some random ass poster is someone you know from real life.

>>198178

Jesus Christ, I'd hate to meet the bitch who fucked you over.

>>160904

We call that POZ.

>>198183

Don't lie! We all know that everyone who's ever posted on an imageboard is the worst of all people; who hates every single other poster so hard that their life would end if it had any effort behind it at all!

But, you have already met the whore who ruined my life…

Her name is Fate.

>>198187

It means that they are ruined sluts who should be thrown in the oven.

>>198189

This isn't the male wizardchan thread.

>>198190

>>198191

Nope; but it is a shitposting thread. Like every other thread on your board.

>>198197

Wrong poster there, Ser. I'm not bitching about men; I'm bitching about women being alllowed out of the house!

And I find your islachild abuserhobia triggering!

>>198200

Isla child? Huh. River child abuse phobia? That's highly specific. Omg. Susan Smith nightmares. How did you know? Ever since that episode of supernatural.

>>198203

I'd have gone with the killing, but that was a teenager. Probably what you were referring to though, in retrospect.

>>162379

Instead? You sir have no imagination.

Now you're picturing it. My girlfriend once tried to get one of those vibrating cuff ring thingies on me, but it literally wouldn't fit. It was excruciating. Never order that stuff from Japan. I heard one of her friends tried proposing that way with a large gold ring. Didn't work out. Wound up in the ER getting it cut off. I hear they keep a special saw just for that at hospitals. Someone should make an psa about it.

>>198204

Wait. Isla in Danish means island right? As opposed to the celtic for the waters edge. Is that a season 2 thing, cause I'm way behind. No spoilers. That's such a hard language that I have to watch it a couple times go really get it. Dyslexic, subtitles are the vein of my existence and the American remakes are just about never as good. I mean a fist full of dollars was pretty good as was the departed, but ordinarily we basically rape the works to death.

Evil wizards. Next you're going to ruin the making of a murder for me or paradise lost.

>>198200

damn! That's a funny wordbutter right there!

>>198207

Supernatural is a shit show that is only liked by tumblrinas because they want gaycest.

>>198206

>you sir

>my girlfriend

>ordering from japan

where do you obnoxious dipshits even come from? get the fuck off my board

>>198257

She's a weeb. Problem?

>>160978

Most of that shit looks like paranoia to me, but the metrosexual magazines and TV heroes' greatest skill and power being snark is spot on and needs to stop.