/cyber/ - Cyberpunk & Science Fiction

>despite the fact none of you are even worthy of being spied on

0/10 do not respond, this is a troll, i repeat, this is a troll.

>>39594

But you're not.

I know google and so on do spy on people and file it all away to be sold to the highest bidder but unless you're this super prolific cyber criminal I don't see why you'd be bothered. It's a problem of time required and what you gain.

Why put in the time to make sure no one spies on you when in reality people like us don't gain anything from it? Why not spend that time on more productive things? Yes being spied on is bad and shitty and given a yes/no choice I'd choose not to be spied on but the fact is it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.

>>39598

>more productive things?

What do you mean?

not sure if troll, but I'll bite

there isn't much to be done. at all, really.

so we'll have our privacy. we'll give our middle fingers to the big corps. we'll learn to live without them. what more do you expect us to do?

>>39600

You have other interests outside of making sure you're not being spied on right? Why not spend more time on those things instead? You'll actually get some enjoyment at the very least.

>>39601

You say there's not much to be done but half the board is bitching about things that could be changed if people actually wanted to. Take that normalfag thread about how web 2.0 ruined the internet and turned it into a hugbox where everyone gives their opinion no matter how little they're educated on the subject. Why not start a site/series of sites that goes against that and encourages people to follow the etiquette and standards of the past?

That's just one thing people could be working on right now.

>so we'll have our privacy. we'll give our middle fingers to the big corps. we'll learn to live without them. what more do you expect us to do?

Help other people to see the light, actually try to accomplish something outside of securing your own freedoms.

>>39591

>For a board about the future you all seem to be living in the past.

It's almost as if this is a board dedicated to an outdated vision of the future.

Are you honestly surprised that a community around 20-30 year old sci-fi is enamoured with 20-30 year old technology?

Not going to speak for everyone here, but that web 1.0 nostalgia is the future that I wanted, had, and will forever pretend never ended. Even if the only way I can express that is by drokposting about how great xfce's redmond theme is on taiwanese crockery websites.

I'm not here because I have any hope for or want to change the future, I just want to be among like minds who are also dissatisfied with the future we got.

>>39602

>You have other interests outside of making sure you're not being spied on right? Why not spend more time on those things instead? You'll actually get some enjoyment at the very least.

Have you ever considered that avoiding mass-surveillance is in itself a fascinating topic that a technical minded person, or say, some hypothetical community of such people, might find enjoyment in discussing? >/cyber/ is technically minded

Besides, some people just enjoy complaining, and chan culture is loaded with those.

>>39598

We avoid being spied on by principle, Mr. Smith. It's not that I'm about to go tear down a bank, it's that I don't like people looking over my shoulder–especially people who have plenty of reasons to be upset if they read the words "THE GOVERNMENT IS SHIT" on my screen.

>>39591

Specifically with regard to the computing asepcts of /cyber/ I don't think it's outdated at all.

I'm guessing you're primarily referring to the love of terminal based applications. Well to those who have used them long enough to develop familiarity, it's not easy to overstate just how amazing they are and how much control they give you.

I'll never forget something I once read about "user friendliness". There's a huge difference between new-user friendliness and experienced-user friendliness.

For example, just yesterday I looked up how to stream audio from one application into another on my Linux machine and it boiled down to a couple of terminal commands, that I didn't even have to understand if I didn't want to and could just copy paste them.

Then for kicks, I looked up how to do it on Windows and it involved downloading several applications one of which had a complicated GUI that looked like something skrillex would use.

I guess if that's you're idea of "futuristic" then all I have to say is your idea of the future is probably more about appearances than function.

>>39591

Nice try, NSA. You won't get my data!

You seem to be under the impression that we spend all our waking hours here. And sure, we certainly love the imaginary of old tech, but pretty much any technical thread that has gained traction is about current tech.

>>39591

I disagree on the privacy point but do agree that we aren't really "progressing" cyperpunk as a way of life, whatever that means.

OP, aside from just going back to our own hobbies, how do you think we can make our lives more cyber? I'm not just talking about wearing /r/cyperpunk fashion but I mean using technology to our advantage - making out computers work for us rather than the opposite. Especially in improving quality of life and ease of living.

>>39646

Well there's jobs for one.

A lot of IT jobs can be done from home. Let's say a company puts out an ad looking for data entry people with a contract as short as 1 day or as long as several months. I see it and say "I'll do that", they check out my profile and it shows previous employer feedback, statistics and so on and they say "ok you'll do". No interview, no waiting, it's all set up within 5 minutes of me clicking apply.

So say I'm shit at my job, they'll have other people on hold ready to take my place. You get kicked and you don't get paid. What's to stop them from kicking me off 5 minutes before my contract ends and leaving me with nothing? Just as employees will have profiles with feedback so will employers. So if employers want to keep getting employees they have to play by the rules.

But what about taxes? The government gets their share when you get paid and any yearly tax stuff uses the data from your online work and compiles it with your real life work (if you have any). It's a huge change and I know it wouldn't be easy to implement right now but it could do away with people getting jobs based on their race, age, gender or disability. The best man for the job would get the job, productivity would increase by untold amounts and both parties would benifit. No more getting up at 6am to catch a train for an hour to get to work, no more brouzouf wasted on commuting, roads would have less traffic, there'd be less pollution as a result. The benifits are too many to list.

This is too big for /cyber/ itself to start but we could easily start a small site where indie game devs advertise for programmers, college students advertise for someone to write a paper and so on. Sites like that exist already but they're stuck in the past about how they do things.

>>39654

>Sites like that exist already but they're stuck in the past about how they do things.

What do you mean, "stuck in the past"? What sites are you even talking about?

I agree, OP. The shazbots here aren't looking towards the optimistic side of cyberpunking. Just the pessimistic. Then they circlejerk each other's cocks and sing lalalala whenever something new or different comes around. I assume it's because no one here wants to be the sore thumb so they all stick it like sheep pretending they're better than the larger herd of sheep. Not everyone, though. Some users are cool. But cyberpunk is dead.

>>39674

Craigslist is one of them.

Anyone can put an ad up for a job but it still relies on the age old interview, reviewing the candidates then choosing the best one and it takes days if not weeks to set up a job even if it's something you can do from your computer. Then when it comes to getting paid you're reliant on banks or your employers trust to paypal it to you.

It's all so slow and inefficient.

>wouldn't it be more productive to forge a better future?

>wouldn't you like to work towards ways to use technology to spread knowledge and intellectual discussion instead?

I renovated a board for that. Its called /hover/

>you have this paranoia about not being spied on despite the fact none of you are even worthy of being spied on.

You're an idiot.

There is not precedence of worth. In the first place. Everything is always recorded at all times.

https://www.eff.org/nsa-spying/nsadocs

>>39855

There's a difference between a computer taking your google searches and storing them away and a guy from the FBI wiretapping your phone.

One if not as bad as the other, I'm not saying that it's not wrong in both cases I'm just saying you're paranoid over something which has 0 effect on your life.

>>39865

That's right, just write off new ideas as trolls and shills. That's absolutely the way to go, I'm sure that'll help us evolve as a species.

Cyberpunk is already well defined as a theme, so anything outside the norm that would innovate would just get shouted down as "not /cyber/". Its hard to innovate a culture while protecting its purity.

OP, and anybody with the same conclusion, should read this:

https://www.openrightsgroup.org/blog/2015/responding-to-nothing-to-hide-nothing-to-fear

Point is, you can be a literal fetus and have information revealed you'd rather not. Somebody out there has value in your data. Everyone deserves the right, within reasonable law, to choose who and who does not have access to their personhood. Current technology has limited our ability to choose where our thoughts and information go to an extent where it seems more reasonable to just give up the fight at times.

To roll back to OP's myopic perspective, we actually are 'worth' being spied on, for the simple fact we do support subversive technology. Have you ever seen government watch list keywords and websites? While we know now that list is no longer, if ever was, relevant, I would guarantee that every single one of us has said or visited something covered by one of those lists.

To counter even further in the trenches of your ignorance: are you really okay with the people you consider 'interesting' to be subject to this panopticon? Journalists and politicians that dare threaten the establishment are now putting their, at best, career… at worst, their very lives at risk, because they are unable to protect their life's details.

>>40079

We live in a scary world. I would hope it will be improved sooner or later…

>>39591

Telnet and irc back some of today's most widely used software and telephones still use the same infrastructure as the internet. Oh yeah, the great firewall of china is also run by a highly sophisticated AI. In the 1980's this stuff was still 'cool' and somewhat futuristic… so it made its way deep into popular culture. As a result , people came up with entertaining media depictions of the future that this stuff was setting us up for.

Then it all actually happened, but instead of being 'cool', all the tech making the magic happen got buried underneath so many layers of abstraction that the end users ceased to care and just accepted that this was now the way the world worked.

Today we come here to discuss and circlejerk about 'old' cyberpunk media because in some ways it depicts the workings of our current society in a manner more accurate than that of contemporary media.

>>39594

I'm no anarchist but I'm going to quote some of their propaganda because relevance.

>The riot lasts for one night but metadata lasts forever.

Sure, none of us are worth spying on. Statistically speaking, very few individuals on this planet end up being worth the brouzouf necessary to spy on them. That said, those in power collect data anyway and, if such events ever occur that you, an individual, fall out of favor with the powers that be, all the the innocuous information gathered about you can then be leveraged against you in a impressively devastating manner. FFS, this doesn't even have to do with information technology. Try growing up around lawyers.

>you have this paranoia about not being spied on despite the fact none of you are even worthy of being spied on.

No one is arguing/discussing about worthiness, all your/our data are being collected regardless of target. This is just common sense and i don't know why you're still peddling this age old (pre-2001) myth.

>>39895

There is a difference but computers spying on people is still spying. And I don't care if it has no (obvious)? effect on my life.

Are you seriously ok with being spied on by computers if it has no noticeable impact on your life?

>>39591

Everyone harps on infosec, but I have a say on this part of OP:

>obsessed with outdated and forgotten technology

99% of today's CS is digging up old papers from sixties and republishing them. Srsly, we are currently in a mini dark-age when it comes to tech, despite the fact that everyone and his grandma has a supercomm in a pocket.

Come on chummers, aren't most of you anarchists?

Fuck this notion of rights. It's about how hard you're going to fight for what you want, whether that's protecting your own privacy, invading someone elses, or both.

You can want privacy for yourself and not others, which I believe is a very "cyb" position to hold.

>>40307

Privacy works best in big numbers. Try disappearing into a crowd of people without privacy, if you're the only unknown you're fucked.

>>40307

Anarchism sounds interesting but I would rather not live in an anarchist "state," the current system with rules that can be broken if need be is at least slightly better than a free for all.

Call me a commie or whatever but I like public healthcare and knowing that I probably wont go hungry if I lose my job.

>>40307

I like your style. It's funny how wrapped up people get about the arbitrary when by definition the way lines get drawn is never objectively defensible

>>40307

I agree. People talk about rights like they're inherent and a simple fact of the universe. But its about whether your group is strong enough to take some power for yourself, whether its a quota or exemption or whatever. The notion of rights is just a bullshit cover for naked power struggles.