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There's no discharge in the war!

File: 242d27778f2eab4⋯.jpg (62.48 KB, 700x366, 350:183, bag.jpg)

File: 9cb30f672292451⋯.pdf (410.52 KB, Making Your Own Bug Out Ba….pdf)

780739  No.623388

So let's say hypothetically I have myself stuck in a major city in a blue state for a little while with no vehicle for familial reasons beyond my immediate control, and I want to construct a bugout bag in case there is a SHTF scenerio Or I just get disgusted by city life and want to walk away.

I understand the basics of emergency prep but I am looking for the ideal loadout for an urban kit tooled for escaping a city on foot and I know you guys would have some good ideas. I am especially interested in food/water suggestions, as lugging around a rucksack of beans and plastic jew bottles of water do not strike me as ideal when trying to quickly gtfo one of these hellholes.

tl;dr - Post bugout bag loadouts

f4aec6  No.623395

File: a6564a1bd0a3b50⋯.png (140.64 KB, 1350x699, 450:233, How2baton.png)

>>623388

>food/water

Cliff bars, protein bars, or some other form of compact, high-calorie food is going to be good for a bugout bag–your main concern is to just hold you over until you find a more permanent solution. If you want other examples try to find out the kind of thing backpackers buy or make, as their needs are similar to yours. Similar with water, you want to stay on the move and in a city you're surrounded by sources of potable water, so prioritize a hydration bladder over a purification system. However, if a filter system is really important to you I know Sawyer makes one that can fit inline to a hydration pack.

>pack

So to make your bag, I'd suggest looking for a cyclist's pack or day backpacker's pack that comes with a hydration pack to use as your actual bag. These also have the advantage of looking like packs that normies carry with them every day, so you shouldn't stand out carrying one either.

>other gear

Knife and multitool should be on your person, in your pockets as part of your EDC rather than in the bag. Besides that, a basic first-aid kit, that you know how to use. If you can't get a first aid kit, at least some bandages and moleskin for blisters. Rope or cord, ideally synthetic so it won't rot. Spare bootlaces, or just get a cord narrow enough to act as bootlaces. A flashlight. Your gun if you can't/won't carry on you. If the state is so blue you can't have a gun, a collapsible baton. Stormproof matches, or a magnesium fire starter if you know how to use one effectively. If you have room after all this, get a baggie of cotton balls or, dry bark, or some other firestarter material. And if you can afford to, stick some emergency cash in there. Not every chimpout is a total SHTF, after all, so you might need it.


74d111  No.623405

The best bug out bag I've ever seen by someone who knew what he was doing was a typical looking fannypack hanging on the wall within arms reach where he usually sits. Didn't look out of place and nobody would give a second glance seeing him wearing it out in public.

>>623395

>Cliff bars, protein bars

Enjoy your soy. A jar of peanut butter packs more protein and calories in a denser volume while costing next to nothing and I'm talking real peanut butter that has oil separation in it not the type that has 20% sugar by weight.

Agreed that a knife should always be on your person but I'd prioritize a lighter over a multitool.


07ef91  No.623409

>>623405

>A jar of peanut butter packs more protein and calories in a denser volume

I agree that protein bars are crap, but peanut butter, really? if you're eating just peanut butter, won't you get constipation? how are you going to eat it, with a spoon? what if you get peanut butter all over yourself?

how about some beef jerky and granola?


f8cd4a  No.623411

>>623409

>what if you get peanut butter all over yourself


a6d933  No.623412

>food

Pemmican, hardtack, and portable soup is all you need. Maybe homemade chili blocks too.


f219de  No.623416

File: c7dc59f4c0010fc⋯.jpg (23.82 KB, 557x525, 557:525, 7948520_164.jpg)

>>623411

I don't know what the poles put in them but Pancerwaffles are gourmet af.


584183  No.623417

Trail mix is a good, calorie dense food that keeps well when packed properly. That plus a couple packs of jerky and water is a pretty good way of keeping alive.


7fe629  No.623449

>>623416

They are delicious as fuck, try to use the jam on them or maybe some canned meat and its god tier meal


b67fc0  No.623452

>>623416

Good taste.


f7cbf5  No.623515

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>623409

>>623411

>what if you get peanut butter all over yourself?


138404  No.623516

File: 8db30f77d066452⋯.jpg (37.99 KB, 600x326, 300:163, 1294905914770.jpg)

>>623515

You've done us proud once again, Serbia. Peanut butter autist is best autist.


ec8c61  No.623528

File: 2467683b2cb8084⋯.jpg (44.08 KB, 600x394, 300:197, Russian Ratnik.jpg)

File: 2979d7ed1041ab9⋯.jpg (60 KB, 640x426, 320:213, download.jpg)

>the ideal loadout for an urban kit tooled for escaping a city on foot

You better grab yourself some plates that will stop an entire magdump of 5,56 or else it was good knowing you. Burgers had difficulties fighting in simple sandnigger towns against 70 IQ monkeys armed with AKs. Imagine what it would be like being stuck in an american mega-city against competent turboautists armed with $6,000 custom rifles, level IV armor plates, explosives, etc.

Food and other shit should be the least of your worries in a city. Number 1 priority is to arm yourself as if you were preparing to wrestle with a tank.


ec8c61  No.623530

>>623528

also make sure to not be retarded and leave your back exposed. Stick a plate there too. You never know when a little bitch will attempt to unload an entire mag on your back


138404  No.623564

File: eb57680b6fbef5e⋯.jpg (17.94 KB, 620x348, 155:87, Deathwing.jpg)

>>623530

Don't forget to wear a ballistic mask and cover your shins and forearms as well. You're no use to anyone with a busted wrist or tibia, after all. In fact, the closest to this that you can get, the better.


ec8c61  No.623580

>>623564

This but unironically


a645c6  No.623601

>>623564

>Mask

They make breathing and vision poor.

Ballistic masks will only prevent pistol calibers from destroying you and at that point it's still basically game over, you'll at best be likely knocked unconscious and left vulnerable.

Helmet for nods and basic front back plates is what you need, side plates if you're in a vehicle.


5948e4  No.623635

>>623515

Autist Chan! Been too long since I last thought about her.


54546f  No.623678

HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.

I just saw this guy’s take on it and I like a lot of what he proposes.

>No more than 10% of your body weight

>Main objective is to put distance between you and the happening

>Carry what you need to accomplish that

>Be incognito


54546f  No.623680

>>623678

>Obviously it’s going to be more than 10% of your body weight…the point though is for it to be as light as possible

I carry 1/4-1/3 of body weight and am definitely not incognito, but I do appreciate some of his points.

Sage for PS post


780739  No.623730

File: db0ae68688f32d3⋯.jpg (49.65 KB, 820x546, 410:273, db0ae68688f32d3cea986be7cb….jpg)

>>623412

>pemmican

Oh fuck, good idea. I'll make a couple of bricks of that shit this weekend.

>>623528

>Fuck your bugout bag, buy plate armor

Posts like these remind me of why I love this board. Sadly, if I could afford that shit, I wouldn't need it, because I could use that money to gtfo of this shithole long before things even went pearshaped.


584183  No.623749

>>623564

If I could have a terminator suit of armour I'd be willing to fucking live in it.

>Carry all your shit in it

>You can lock your gauntlets so that any weapon you own is protected from niggers while you sleep

>Total care of bodily needs

>Multiplication of everything about you

>Completely proof from all but the strongest of modern weapons

Imagine just walking down tha streetz after bustin caps in asses with yo' homies when you hear a big ass thumpin' and suddenly yo' homeboy's head is turned into clam chowder by a huge metal fist. You'd turn to put a bullet in him only to find seconds later your hips and legs are 50 meters away from your upper torso courtesy of his bolter.


c2efac  No.623766

As for a strictly urban situation.

>Get MRE's and strip them down

>add things to your liking, remember things like moist towelettes, utensils, paper napkins/tp

>vacuum pack the dry goods in daily portions after puncturing the original packaging with a pin

>store the main meals/heater packs/wet goods in cellophane in meal portions, remember to label them.

>get a 3 liter hydration bladder that will fit in your bag

>grab a 1.5 liter bottle of your choice, if metal and not a vacuum flask you can boil in it.

>1 inch webbing, 50-60 feet.

>First aid kit

>2x 250ml bottles of high proof alcohol.

>8x8ft or 10x10ft dark but neutral colored tarp.

>100 feet of 550 or 750 cord.

>3x Bic or other simple flint lighter. Store these in different places on your pack, consider one of those lighter lanyards for one.

>Storm proof matches

>A good 6 inch or similar, fixed blade knife

>Good 3.5 inch folding knife

>Depending on level of SHTF, quality bolt cutters 10 inches long and a couple of coats of flex seal over each handle for added electrical protection.

>Personal preference includes a shovel but you may not need one

>Foot long pry bar, again depending on SHTF

>Personal protection, scale to need and availability.

<Collapsible baton (like others have mentioned are great if you can't carry a gun), machetes, pistols, TOTALLY NOT SHOTGUN firearms, ball peen hammer (hit with the ball end) to name a few.

>Use your judgement for ammo, 3 reloads ready and ten or so in reserve may be too much or too little for you.

>Sleep pad, people make homemade versions using balloon animal balloons as the insulators, very light and a bag of replacements will weigh nothing.

>Good sleeping bag for your climate. Get a compression sack for it as well.

>Garbage bags, largest and heaviest duty you can find. 4 or so will do.

>Flashlight that takes AA or AAA batteries, carry more if you want but one should be using easily sourced batteries.

This is for someone with a plan. Someone that knows where they need to go, how long they can expect to take to get their via different routes. What is between them and escape. And keep in mind, if it is a fullblown chimpout and you expect confrontation, a much more offensive approach is needed. Smokebombs with or without irritants, molotovs, crowdpoppers (Old JLabs, glue a large marble or ball bearing to the bottom of a shot shell, throw it into a crowd, could add glued pvc jacket as well). Again, if scale dictates a need for that shit, you need a rifle and a rig to carry ammo, and you better as fuck have a plan.


780739  No.624123

File: 7c0a5cb322b9eb2⋯.jpg (16.19 KB, 440x440, 1:1, 9efad7e4e1aab9c5c2dc1eb8f1….jpg)

>>623766

10/10 would operate with.


3debc5  No.624177

I'm in the people republic of california and things are getting strange. Almost open season on conservatives, more and more foreigners everyday, lots of Chinese, very noticeable from 2 months ago when I left, now I'm back and honestly on edge.

My go bag is ammo, water, medical, food, misc(phone charger, cash, gun oil) in that order. It's a 15lt backpack and I can hike forever with it.


a645c6  No.624178

>>623766

I agree on the AA and AAA standard batteries, I've tried to avoid any "exotic" but my steiner takes a cr123 as well as a few watch batteries for illuminated optics.


776d93  No.624181

>>623766

>>A good 6 inch or similar, fixed blade knife

>>Depending on level of SHTF, quality bolt cutters 10 inches long and a couple of coats of flex seal over each handle for added electrical protection.

An AK bayonet with its scabbard could work well for both of these uses.


c2efac  No.624461

>>624181

I love AK bayonets, but they are not great knives nor are they good for cutting thick or hardened lines. I would recommend AK bayonets for folks running inna woods, mostly because its a great trowel. OR you already have an AK to mount it on.


e0a437  No.625765

Peanuts are the ultimate bugout snack


a3c525  No.626079

File: 8e094a94f4ae1fe⋯.jpeg (41.24 KB, 480x480, 1:1, AE708ABA-D307-4F83-9C52-0….jpeg)

>>625765

Raw peanuts? In shell? Butter? Explain yourself please.


88b545  No.636027

Bugout should have enough compact food to last a week


9830e4  No.636028

>>623580

This but ironically


7e8376  No.636075

>>636066

Clawhammer works on niggers but opening a door with a pipe wrench is much easier


fbd560  No.636109

>>623766

Basically this.

I would ass however

>hydration

depending on physical exertion and the climate/temperature you may need up to 3 gallons of water a day to stay properly hydrated.

now 3 gallons is likely to run ~24lbs which is a bit much, but try to aim for at least a gallon or a half if you gotta go fast.

another idea that could serve you well is to use a wheelbarrow style contraption to help you carry lots of shit far and fast. think along the lines of what ww2 mortar teams used to carry their shit.

>clothing

depending on temps you may need to dress lighter or thicker, if your stuck in LA somewhere your best bet for clothing is going to be something reminiscent of a rhodie's outfit, very light shorts/trunks (like marine corps silkies) and a light button up cotton t-shirt, also make sure the color scheme goes with the palette of your area. also you will want to dress relatively light anyways if you will be moving a lot as you will quickly overheat if your wearing too much shit. another note is to remove every reflective/neon shit from your clothes, tracksuits often come with these, either cut it out or sharpie over it, the last thing you need to be is attention catching.

>shoes

light combat boots would be best. running shoes are good for obvious reasons, but they provide little protection and support for your foot and ankle, if you step in a hole your gonna want something that is resistant to ankle snapping. plus a good pair will help vent your feet so you don't get trench foot after days of travel

>maps/navigation

know the area, know what resources are available and where in case you need to re-up on things like water. know where the niggy parts of town are, they may or may not be safe to travel through, although that depends if the nig horde moves to other areas,

>food

just remember to get calorie and protein dense foods, canned meat and fish serves this purpose well, but try to avoid spam as it will dehydrate you and it is rather bulky for its level of protein. also keep in mind the smell, a can of fish will reach many noses, even those seafood averse.

>tools

a shovel can always come in handy, typically for hitting nigs and of course digging, most urban areas have SOME level of diggable land, sub-urban has even more, use this in case you need to hide something valuable/a body, or if you need to fortify a position. consider a set of utility keys, or tools which can act in effect of those. pliers, screwdrivers, hex keys and other things can work wonders for accessing places. also consider a 3 or 4 pronged throwable hook with rope attached for elevating your position quickly.

>fire

you can bic lighters for about ~1 a piece, so you can easily carry several lighters, keep a stash in your pack incase your feeling generous (this applies subjectively as generous may imply helping a fellow white or burning down city blocks, its really up to your best judgement)

>protection

protect your vital areas, primarily your neck, groin, and gut, these are where the worst wounds will occur and are most likely to occur. you can easily do this with some kind of thin metal plating/leather or thick cloth. it will likely still hurt like a bitch if you get hit, and it probably wont stop a bullet, but if your a poorfag, its your best bet for preventing abrasions and punctures from knives, shrapnel, or just sharp and ragged objects in general, also consider your wrists and joints, as there is major bloodflow in those areas aswell

some other common tips would be avoid crowd of any size, avoid open areas, including long stretches of roads, stick to concealed areas, such as in between structures and somewhat wooded areas where people wont be able to see you for at least 50yds, also try to look like normalfags by wearing a basic bitch school bag in subdued colors


b86213  No.636171

For waterproof matches

>Light candle

>Stick match heads in melted wax

>Let dry


58e492  No.636184

>>636171

Clear nailpolish.


89d184  No.636198

>>636171

>>636184

>the only way to make fire is with matches

???????????//


68ecb6  No.636199

>>636198

>a fucking leaf

but for real, where did they say that? or even imply that?


5c7f23  No.636408

File: f1b92fb648da48b⋯.jpg (5.41 MB, 3500x2333, 3500:2333, autogyro.jpg)

File: d1f34f3ee8e6159⋯.pdf (332.99 KB, Lightning 01 2015.pdf)

>bug out bags

>not just obtaining an autogyro

>not just flying away on your autogyro

>not bombing your city with your autogyro


37335e  No.636420

I don't live in a city, but I do have to commute to my workplace which is in one, and I keep a "Get Home" bag there. It's a little different than a Bug Out bag in philosophy because while the BOB focuses on long term survival in a situation where you can't expect the niceties of regular civilization, the GHB focuses on quick movement by foot to a location where you have supplies or a proper BOB stored. The distance I commute would take 1.5-2 days to travel by walking given terrain, population density, and a focus on avoiding major throughfares, so I plan for that.

>Nondescript 21L backpack that blends in to the average populace to avoid attracting attention; excessive MOLLE straps, "tactical/military" logos, and morale patches are just a good way to advertise "DOG PILE ME AND KILL ME FOR FREE SHIT"

>said backpack sits high on the back, for better weight carrying

>simple survival bivy to sleep in overnight, it won't be as comfy as a sleeping bag with a proper bedroll, but it's extremely lightweight, fits entirely inside the bag, and is good enough to keep me warm and dry throughout the night

>1600 calories of Millenium bars which have a lifespan of 5 years so I don't have to change out food every couple of months which could draw attention to it at work

>2 sticks of jerky for 300 additional calories and protein

>2x1.5L SmartWater bottles instead of hydration bladder, because hydration bladders require you to either have a backpack with a sleeve for the tube (which draws attention) or keep the zipper partially open for the tube (which could come all the way open and drop all your shit everywhere), and not only are the bottles durable enough to sit there in the bag for months, but the threads fit a Mini Sawyer filter to get more water

>Yeah, yeah, I know about xenoestrogen and all that shit, but two days of exposure isn't enough to turn you into a soyboy and I don't drink out of plastic otherwise. I already bring a 16oz steel canteen to work daily for drinking water, so I can use that if I absolutely need to boil something over the course of those two days and the squeeze filter won't cut it

>Waterproof poncho in case of rain

>Headlamp for hands-free lighting if I need it

>Folding knife for various purposes

>Storm matches in a case with a striking patch and a cheapo Bic lighter

>First aid kit with vitamins, electrolyte mix to add to water, antiseptic, rubbing alcohol patches, mole skin, gauze, and both regular and quick clot bandages

>Skivvy roll for spare t-shirt, socks, and boxers

>Watch cap for head insulation during cold nights

>Monocular to observe forward conditions from a distance so I can reroute if necessary

>Map of local area

>Mechanix gloves to protect hands in case I'm dealing with debris

>3M N95 dust mask, two so I have a backup

All of these fit in the bag I mentioned earlier with a little bit of room to spare. Weather rarely changes drastically from day to day where I live, so if it's cold I'll already be bringing a jacket to work and I can layer with the extra shirt if need be. I can walk out the door without having to throw shit together at the last minute with a backpack weighing under 18 lbs that looks like the average bookbag college students wear around here, with my canteen in a side pocket and get home without people immediately noting me down as "Mug this man for military gear and survival goods".

Also OP, whatever plan you follow, make sure you do test hikes with said bag on. There's no point having the bag if you can't even hump it a third of the distance you'll need to walk. I go on monthly hikes with the pack to make sure I can carry it for long distances and which also help me to go through it and see if anything's expired or needs changing (Smart Water bottles are like 1.50 for the 1.5L so it's pretty cheap to throw out the old ones and put in the new ones).


7c37ff  No.636502

>>636408

This…This seems to be an interesting solution, as my bugout plan has always been to get to the family cabin in the mountains, but this would certainly expedite the process, not to mention be fun as hell in the mean time.


4562d4  No.636514

Why has nobody here considered lockpicks? I know it's a lot easier to just smash into a place and get the shit but keep in mind that you can use lockpicks on every kind of lock, even tumblers for lockers. It's a quieter, less strenuous way of getting into a place and you can even save the locks and chains from gates or lock the door behind you to make it harder for people to follow. It takes 30 seconds to 2 minutes to open a lock using the rake method but if you practice you can get consistently faster using a lifter of your choice. Not only all of this, but they take virtually no space at all.


9362d7  No.636649

>>636514

Just get an electric lock pick m8


4562d4  No.636657

>>636649

Why the fuck would you ever carry something electric in a SHTF scenario when you could spend 2 weeks of your time reading a book on how to use the actual tools?


8076ad  No.636676

>>636514

Just use ther,ite, m8. Fits in any lock and has more uses. Not a waste to learn lockpicking and carry them but they really can be made with some wire and a hammer extremely easily.

>>636649

Or just carry both. Or just the wiggly one thing and a tensioner, they work just as fine in cheaper locks. Also, shims.


4562d4  No.636678

>>636676

So what you're suggesting is to carry around thermite, which is a moderately hard to source consumable resource and does the same job as breaking the lock with a pry bar or cutters? Why? Why would you ever use thermite for anything but burning through a shitload of metal? The whole reason you learn lockpicking which we both agree on is so you can carry the basically weightless 3 picks and tension wrench you actually need to open most locks. It conserves a lot of space compared to bolt cutters and even a jar of thermite.


8076ad  No.636689

>>636678

>which is a moderately hard to source

It's literally rust and foil mixed together. Really dude. There's more to it but these are its basic components.

>does the same job as breaking the lock with a pry bar or cutters

A stick full of termite capable of burning through any chain, most lock shackles and door hinges weights 1/10th of that and takes less space. Plastic cases from sharpies work great, as well as drug bottles/containers. Unless you're going to devote time to search and keeping a stockpile somewhere you won't haul a bulky steel thing around.

>Why would you ever use thermite for anything but burning through a shitload of metal?

A shitload of metal requires a shitload of termite. Though now that i think about it, some coolant spray(or whatever the thing's called) and a hefty hitting tool would work great too. Just freeze the shackle and then smash it with your hammer when it gets brittle. Also works for lock pins and other insides but that can be complicated.

>you actually need to open most locks

I don't know what about you but where i like most people keep either lever type of locks or disc tumbler ones, with the type you're going to pick being common only among hanging locks that are used for garages and suburb or rural houses and the disc ones are still being more common. For disc locks you could get a pick, ok, or a ram thing that pulls the mechanism out like in these lockpicking videos, but it's a bit bulkier and heavier, while lever ones i'm unsure about at all.

It's for you to decide what to carry but if you know you'll be able to get some use of breaking in you might want something more than a thing that can hopefully open some of the cheaper locks you encounter you might want something to help you in all other situations, especially if it works universally and can effectively aid destructive measuers.


4562d4  No.636690

>>636689

>It's literally rust and foil mixed together.

And this is how I know you don't know how to make thermite. It's a lot more complex than rust and foil. Reactions require an oxidizer and a fuel and the impurities matter a shitload. You're trying to make a high temperature mixture not a fucking party trick.

>weights 1/10th of that and takes less space.

Still not as little as a set of picks, I don't even know what picks weigh because I'd need a scientific scale.

>especially if it works universally

If you knew as much about locks as I did you'd know that it doesn't matter what kind of mechanism it has. If it opens with a physical key, it can be opened with a pick. It's just a matter of construction and manufacturing inconsistencies that makes this possible and barring some space-alien technology this won't change.


8076ad  No.636697

>>636690

>It's a lot more complex than rust and foil

Bruh https://invidio.us/watch?v=H-PubIM6O_4

>Still not as little as a set of picks

Where did i imply that you shouldn't carry picks, you dense motherfucker?

>If you knew as much about locks as I did

What a douche

> it doesn't matter what kind of mechanism it has

In theory, it doesn't. In practice - go on, try to pick a disc lock with your shitty picks.

>If it opens with a physical key, it can be opened with a pick

Looks like someone who doesn't know shit about locks is you here. Clearly not all locks currently existing are pickable with modern tools and clearly most that are aren't pickable by some stupid fag like you.

>It's just a matter of construction and manufacturing inconsistencies that makes this possible and barring some space-alien technology this won't change.

Go on then, go try to pick a lock you don't know with the tools you don't have.


4562d4  No.636703

>>636697

>Bruh https://invidio.us/watch?v=H-PubIM6O_4

Yeah, see how pure that rust is? You couldn't just grab a random pipe off the ground and shave it. It takes a little refining.

>Where did i imply that you shouldn't carry picks

The implication is made in your argument of superior tools but fair, maybe I'm too autistic for this one.

>What a douche

It's 8chan man everyone talks like a knowitall.

>In theory, it doesn't.

In theory it does. While I will concede that a disc lock is harder, if it relies on pins and opens via a key they CAN get stuck on the shearline. A different tool like an 8-pin finger pick or a disc-picking tool might help you, but the fundamental process is similar and can be achieved with regular lockpicks if you have the patience and understanding on how to manipulate the individual pins.

>Clearly not all locks currently existing are pickable with modern tools

Barring some ridiculous shit I don't know about, if it uses pins it can be picked.

>go try to pick a lock you don't know with the tools you don't have.

I relish the opportunity to learn from a challenge, so I think I will.


4562d4  No.636707

>>636703

I'm gonna double post here so I can correct myself a bit: Discs and pins are different, but I moreso meant the general idea of a pin which is that they align with a mechanism to allow entry, meaning they can be individually manipulated. If you had the know-how of a false gate's feedback or even just bypassed the copper structure piece at the end of the lock by force you could get through even an Abloy with a little luck. I am talking about the fundamental design of a mechanism's ability to be manipulated.


8076ad  No.636710

>>636703

>You couldn't just grab a random pipe off the ground and shave it

I never said you can, my sttement was that these are the basic components. It doesn't mean you'll do it like that - you won't be able to ignite it without that torch, for starters. Still, to get your basic termite you'll only need some rust that you can refine into perfect reagent using nothing but fire and some soda and file some aluminum scrap turned into small pieces with a file. Al rich alloys will do too. This one will be hard to ignite so you can add some al powder for your convenience. From that the possibilities are endless: use superphosphate instead of rust and you'll get cooler mixture that creates highly toxic gas if you add water, make transitioning mixture that ignites easier and then ignites hotter stuff in turn, tightly press the thing in the container for more intense reaction, etc.

>The implication is made in your argument of superior tools but fair

Destructive methods are superior to non-destructive as they are easily scalable, don't require special skills from the user and can be applied universally. The only reason to not use them is lack of appropriate resources or need to preserve the obstacle - be it stealth or convenience. It doesn't mean you shouldn't use what fits better.

>the fundamental process is similar and can be achieved with regular lockpicks if you have the patience and understanding on how to manipulate the individual pins

Sure, it doesn't mean that you'll get through a quality lock with your handmade picks in a lifetime. Especially since some locks require a special tensioner that you won't have. Check this out https://invidio.us/watch?v=1jSHwaOR_eo .

>>636707

Yeah, there are no "unpickable" locks like there are no "unguessable" passwords, but cyber security proves it even better - to achieve the desired result you'd very likely to need around few hundred lifetimes of the current universe. But you can try to, the infinite monkey theorem does apply.


8076ad  No.636711

Invidious embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>636710

Also, to all streloks interested, here's a great example of a practical solution to applying termite. It actually was mentioned in the book i use but i never git to it in discussion and found this vid. Just ignore the annoying music.


4562d4  No.636713

>>636710

>you won't be able to ignite it without that torch

Because we're thinking of a light-weight bugout situation, things like crowbars and cutters and torches should only be carried if they are going to provide you with an immense advantage such as in an urban environment. My problem with seeking thermite at all is that its hard to source and compose, then ignite those materials and they don't last forever so they're not reliable. I mean you're right, you could grind down iron and aluminum foil into thermite but I'm thinking from the perspective of someone in the field and the sort of materials they would find. Some stray pipes and kitchen aluminum foil is all you could get your hands on and there's no way you're carrying a torch around just in case you get to use it.

>don't require special skills from the user and can be applied universally.

You are right, breaking a window is always easier than picking the front door, but preserving the obstacle is helpful and knowledge weighs nothing. Gear is great for the man that doesn't know what he's doing, but /k/ommandos SHOULD know what they're doing. I think learning about mechanisms and machines is worth the effort.

>require a special tensioner that you won't have.

The special tensioner makes it easier but its still doable, I learned from a video called 'lockpicking for the new millenium' that demonstrated the difference between opening special locks with a tool vs not using the tool and just using a lifter and tension rod. The good news is both the disc lock tool and finger pick are lightweight. Not only that, but disc locks are also super rare. Most people don't bother picking locks because like you said, destructive methods require no training and that's what most thieves have, no training. Otherwise they could be a locksmith instead of a thief. We mostly use 6 pin tumblers in america and they're on virtually everything. Even cars are just 6 pins but double sided and can be opened either with normal picks or you can commence the jiggling.

>infinite monkey theorem does apply

I'll concede to you, because time is of the essence. If I saw a disc lock in a field situation I'd forget about stealing the motorcycle without an anklegrinder or something.


8076ad  No.636715

>>636713

>My problem with seeking thermite at all is that its hard to source and compose, then ignite those materials and they don't last forever so they're not reliable

Not really. Only if you don't know what you're doing. Get some al powder, bake some rust in a pan with soda and you've got good termite that will ignite well without any rare stuff like magnesium. You can ignite it with some easily made powder out of sugar and potassium nitrate. All can be bought without any suspicion or prepared at home with no special tools. We could even make some pic guidelines. I've got some excellent material for that, unfortunately it's in Russian only so it's not of much use for you even though i did once post it in the pdf thread.

>/k/ommandos SHOULD know what they're doing

It's useful but you can't expect a man to be knowledgeable, ready and for anything. Lockpicking does deserve more attention though.

>The special tensioner makes it easier but its still doable

https://invidio.us/watch?v=-cEVatzkAO4

https://invidio.us/watch?v=h1cCtApECOE

>If I saw a disc lock in a field situation I'd forget about stealing the motorcycle without an anklegrinder or something.

Watch first video - the guy will tell you about one common weakness of these type of locks.


4562d4  No.636716

>>636715

>sugar and potassium nitrate

So you're suggesting a 2-part ignition train a la demolition style rather than an oxyacetyline torch? That wouldn't actually be that bad but I tend to stay away from one-use items. Biggest issue with the idea of painkiller pills and water purifying tablets. Everyone uses them but I'd rather have a sawyer straw and ignore the headaches because they're reliable.

>It's useful but you can't expect a man to be knowledgeable, ready and for anything

I don't expect normies to, but I kinda expect /k/ommandos. We're the autists of the internet and we have a reputation to uphold as always unique. It might just be me but I love learning about anything that involves machines or mechanisms, they run our world and we treat them like magic.


bb681f  No.636717

>>636711

couple of those thermite pens would be a nice addition to an urban bugout bag, thats for sure. might have to try and make some, does thermite take well to epoxy or glue suspension?

>>636716

willow bark my dude. multiple types of willow have the same anti-inflammatory chemical known as salacin. course, you gotta be in an area with willows.


8076ad  No.636718

File: 9be071302642e22⋯.jpg (100.92 KB, 1280x853, 1280:853, Rebar-Cutter-7.jpg)

>>636716

>So you're suggesting a 2-part ignition train a la demolition style rather than an oxyacetyline torch?

Yes, the go-to recipe i've got is using filed aluminum pieces as main charge and using al powder mix as an initiator, as the powder mix, while burning faster, catches up on fire easier. It's actually got 3 steps that way - initiating fuse using some hot powder, then "thin" termite that initiates the main charge that burns hotter and deeper.

>I tend to stay away from one-use items

Reasonable, but one-use items for one-time visits seem appropriate to me.

>painkiller pills

These are fine as you actually use them only when needed, not as a constantly consuming irrecoverable source. Think of it like ammo - you carry it and only use when need it.

>I love learning about anything

True, but the scope of our interest might differ. You won't find the most autistic autist to posses all the knowledge and not be a normalfag in at least one sphere.

>>636717

>does thermite take well to epoxy or glue suspension?

I think it's alright as it doesn't need air to burn, though it's recommended to press it really tightly, like with car jack tightly. Otherwise, some glue shouldn't be much of a hindrance for such a nuclear mixture.

Actually. there's a more reliable and efficient alternative to termite, though it's pretty hard to find - shaped charges, especially the linear types or rebar cutters like picrelated. They are loud but fast, predictable, autonomous and probably lighter.


4562d4  No.636720

>>636718

> initiating fuse

Safety fuse and a match. Just put it upside down and strike the box against the match while its in the fuse, it'll light every time.

>>636718

>one-use items for one-time visits

>These are fine as you actually use them only when needed

I believe you get reliant on them after a while, and you end up having to source more but that's my opinion on the matter.

>posses all the knowledge

Unfortunately impossible but having overlapping skills helps. For instance I do electrical and engine stuff so anything involving explosives or mechanisms is typically in my zone of easy understanding. Might just be a sperg though.

>shaped charges

You can make explosives but, the problem is you can't really say you keep them in a bug out bag and if you get caught with them without an ATF demo card you're in trouble.


8076ad  No.636722

>>636720

>Safety fuse and a match

Yeah, that works. Or just use a good fuse that's easy to ignite and will burn well and slow. It's not that hard and gas lighters last too long for what they worth and weight, too OP.

>I believe you get reliant on them after a while

More options are more options - you just can enter some places you couldn't otherwise. It's not like you'll have the right amounts of the stuff to get used to it, it's more of a "plan B" option that offers a backup and more freedom to move.

>You can make explosives

From my understanding, there's another problem with it - tannerite and some other weaker explosives don't really work in shaped charges, is that true?

>Unfortunately impossible but having overlapping skills helps

Absolutely, even if ideal is unreachable it's never wrong to strive for it.

>you can't really say you keep them in a bug out bag

Well, some are 2 part ones and others have long shelf life. I personally know at least one recipe of a plastic explosive, though there are better option for storage, though it's not recommended at all for the reason you mentioned. Great SHTF tool though.


4562d4  No.636723

>>636722

It'd be better to start making the explosives during SHTF to make yourself useful and use your practice recipe results ASAP on private property and tell no one. I might just be a sperg but I prefer consistency.


8076ad  No.636724

>>636723

Well, as a burger you're free to manufacture explosives for personal use anyway so there's not much preventing your from training, aside from being blown up. Otherwise, i'd stock up some rarer resources and/or tools. If anything, aluminum powder is easy to get and can be used for both really hot fuses and explosives like tannerite, as well as termites and even hotter molotovs. Potassium nitrate is openly sold in large quantities in agricultural stores and is a main element of a wide array of propellants, reactives and explosives. Anti-pipe clogging stuff can be a source for making some high concentration acids which are used in some of the more potent explosives. All of these things can be bought easily during all the time things can be bought and won't draw any attention to you due to their main use. Chemical equipment too, it can be invaluable for the hotter stuff, though it's not really necessary unless you mess with things like shaped charges, otherwise stuff like igdanite(ammonium nitrate+diesel) or ammonal(tannerite) will do the job just fine.


4562d4  No.636725

>>636724

>sold in large quantities in agricultural stores

I'm not sure but I think in america you need a license or some sort of proof of being a farmer to get that high nitrogen content shit, but I've never tried. I know some chemicals and compounds are hard to source and usually require business connections.


8076ad  No.636728

>>636725

It's basic fertilizer, used for anything from potted plants to growing vegetables. It might be ammonium nitrate that is regulated but you'll still be able to get it piss easy by trying to do farming. The thing that's hard to get is different acids an similar reagents and such while this is the most basic stuff you'll get from anyone growing stuff. At worst, find a friend that has some property and grows shit and ask for a bag or two to "try farming" or something, if he can get it he'll probably sell it to you too.

Yeah, ammonium nitrate is regulated after some city bombing but you can easily get it from a farmer that buys it in tons or from some sellers that have a more expensive but pure one. It's really hard to control and with such an arsenal i'm unsure why doesn't rural ever explode the hell out of any fucks, they've got literally tons of both components for 1 working explosive.

“farm Co-op’s for 50lb bags of AMMONIUM NITRATE 34-0-0 cost is from 9 to 15$ a bag."

"You can wash out the bentonite clay using methanol, which can be bought at hobby stores. It's used as RC car and plane fuel.

Water (and methanol) can be evaporated out of the AN by drying it in an oven. AN's melting point is 250 F, so water can be evaporated out of it pretty efficiently."

Careful with this method. Most methanol in hobby stores is actually glow plug engine fuel and contains 5-15% nitromethane. The methanol will evaporate, leaving nitromethane and castor oil (or synthetic). Nitromethane greatly increases the brisanance of AN and can sensitize it.

Info from ar15.com/forums/general/Fertilizer_and_homemade_tannerite/5-317835/


4562d4  No.636729

>>636728

I've learned to source explosives from distilled drug store goods, if I could get my hands on fertilizer it would be easier but that would require contacts with farmers that wasn't too red flaggy. I could definitely try and get my hands on it but since I can get it myself for small experiments it doesn't really bother me all that much to build it from scratch. I tend to enjoy the challenge.


58e492  No.636730

>>636729

Find work with a lab. They can have all the fun shit and nobody is gonna give two shits.


8076ad  No.636732

>>636729

> distilled drug store goods

Good but you don't usually buy this stuff in large quanities, so you'd look weird buying 50 bottles of H2O2 or activated charcoal. That draws attention. In agriculture though, you'd draw attention if you buy too little of it fro its intended use. The stuff is too cheap and is used too often and in too large quantities to regulate it, aside from just causing a mess some wouldn't get in, like they always do.

>that would require contacts with farmers that wasn't too red flaggy

If you have a lawn, start growing something. Even grass would be ok, and trees need even less attention. Get some apple saplings, or grow mint, i dunno. You get the benefit of having the grown stuff too and won't probably use the amount of fertilizer that would matter.


4562d4  No.636733

>>636732

>Good but you don't usually buy this stuff in large quanities,

No you source it slowly over time, throw one in your cart every time you go to the store like when you're trying to get canned food for a bug in sitch. You don't rush it all at once that's susp af.

>If you have a lawn, start growing something

I might try this honestly, there are some farms nearby I could ask for supplies from and there's co-ops where I live.


8076ad  No.636736

>>636733

>I might try this honestly

Good luck. Also, the grown stuff is nice, especially the green one - you always have it as fresh as it gets, which can really change things a lot. Having an apple tree is cool too. The best part is that it's a completely valid and legitimate reason to get the stuff so you'll learn specifics along the way. The best type of lie - the one that is not one.


ef8f60  No.636794

File: 8406bc81ba27834⋯.jpg (30.62 KB, 352x500, 88:125, Jo is the Japanese stick w….jpg)

Don't forget your "walking stick" which is actually a hardwood JO martial arts staff. People for some reason don't see a person using a walking stick as a threat.


37335e  No.636841

>>636794

This only works if you either work in a very lax company with a bunch of outdoorsmen/hippies who will treat your walking stick like a lifestyle accessory, or if you fake having a leg injury that requires support and can come up with some reason you're using the hardwood stick instead of a proper crutch or cane. I guess you could keep it in your car though, and a five-foot solid stick combined with proper training can make for decent close-combat prep.


59c2d2  No.636891

>>636841

im all set, i have shitloads of steel and arthritis in my ankles. as to why im using a 1.3 meter long ash or japanese oak walking stick, its because i prefer wood to aluminium when it comes to beating minori- sorry, bearing my weight.


953e49  No.636894

>>623405

>Of where he usually sits

This was the second indication of an unprepared man

The first was

>Fanny pack

I was surprised entirely that somebody would think a Fanny pack is enough space for an emergency go back. It's literally the size of a first aid kit. "Where he usually sits" means the dude doesn't do much. There's no usual seat for a busy man. Even your desk would be less than a fifth of your free time.

SMH fam sounds like a wannabe prepper 2 me


ffc5de  No.636901

File: 358a73e3555d515⋯.jpeg (1.33 MB, 700x2622, 350:1311, 1352791616527 (1).jpeg)

>I love how we went from: "I need to open some locks, maybe," to "we should practice sourcing and making explosives to open locks"

>Never change

OP, you "buggin out" to a defined place? Got preps once you're there? Any major things preventing stashing/caching extra gear along the way? All that will influence what you need/want to take with you.

If you're just planning to pick a direction and plot a course and "go away" for a while, you're gonna fail, and fail hard.


99e36f  No.637080

Here's what I carry for longer trips

Small hatchet or a machete

Long but not very wide gardening shovel (for collecting roots and making shelters)

Scissors(for foraging and cordage)

A mora

A good few meters of rope

A repair kit, with small bits of metal, wire, tape, etc

A small fishing kit

Food- usually some smoked meat and some trail mix, with some emergency soup powder if I don't find any edibles and some spices

Lots of water

A big pan

And whatever sleeping system is appropriate


c58911  No.637082

>>623515

I'm pretty happy about the internet being around.


a7ee46  No.637088

>>637080

I guess brazil is as close as we'll get to a post-apocalyptic situation right now.


4d8a5f  No.637293

File: 3bf664ca306b4a2⋯.png (504.61 KB, 933x438, 311:146, Killdozer.png)

>>636408

>shitty autogyro every nigger with a rifle can shoot out of the air

>not building your own Killdozer

>not being invincible in the shit hit the fan world

>not hunting down bug out fags from the safety of your moving fortress of doom

>not collecting their bags on the outside of your Killdozer and living comfortable from your war spoils

>not being courted be every warlord in the region for the power you possess

>not having the most beautiful women selling their body to you alone for the privilege of riding on the outside of mighty mashine


8731e6  No.637358

>>636723

I can't help but think there's been a failure in planning somewhere if you need plastic explosives to reach your bug out location.


99e36f  No.637374

>>637293

>Thinks the roads are going to "b just lyke da world rite now" and he isn't going to get stuck

Good luck germ


7d3b47  No.637392

File: 50ad0a4de06d5d8⋯.jpg (27.24 KB, 324x200, 81:50, IMG_1948.JPG)

File: 0797873bf7e4b3f⋯.jpg (220.49 KB, 1024x768, 4:3, IMG_1947.JPG)

>>637293

An autogyro is cheaper, uses normal fuel and doesn’t get stuck in ditches.


d53c51  No.637396

>>637358

Very un-American mindset lad.


2f3cd7  No.637424

chad's guide to long-distance travel:

>pedal-powered paraglider

>cross-country rollerblades

>skis

>ice skates

>ultralight inflatable kayak

>legs

if you can't carry your mode of transportation on your person, you're basically a dumbass.


a7ee46  No.637472

>>637358

It's not for the bugout bag. My whole point in my post was that knowledge is weightless and the best thing you can bug out with. I personally study a lot about chemistry, infrastructure, machining and engines. These skills overlap with one another and are vital to survival in a grid down situation. Once you start learning about electricity, it's easier to understand explosives, cars, architecture, radios, so on. Our society and infrastructure is all built on very basic mechanical skills made complex by specialization.


a7ab4a  No.637481

File: be9f88e4d626c90⋯.jpg (130.47 KB, 612x344, 153:86, 1695.jpg)

File: 7b743901d5e3e71⋯.jpg (81.92 KB, 600x358, 300:179, mountain-course.jpg)

File: 9a53adc53e50865⋯.jpg (85.27 KB, 504x334, 252:167, army-horses-mules_21c_01_7….jpg)

>>637424

Yes hello I would like to direct your attention over here to remind you that horses, donkeys, and mules are a thing that exists and people have been using them as a primary mode of transportation for over two thousand years.


b9cb75  No.637489

>>637293

No true Killdozer design provides a mechanism for the driver to exit the vehicle alive.


f8d9c4  No.637900

File: 37dcf2668d15715⋯.jpg (53.37 KB, 634x719, 634:719, packing light.jpg)

>>623678

I've probably watched 50 BOB videos and this is the first I've seen that wasn't pants-on-head retarded. Good find anon.

My bag is fairly different from his, but most of the differences are minor.

Biggest thing he gets wrong is food. The idea that you'll be able to trap, fish or forage for food in the wilderness is basically a meme. You may be able to get some, but more often than not you'll burn more energy than you gain.

>>626079

Nuts are the most calorie dense food. Don't think you can eat them exclusively though. Radically changing your diet can lead to problems like cramps and liquid shits. Not show stoppers, but if you're bugging out you already have enough problems.


3676ac  No.637903

>>637481

They're also cute


1dfa0c  No.637995

File: 1d551a0a247cbe5⋯.jpg (233.57 KB, 1300x971, 1300:971, ab906112d31a59888269a27a43….jpg)

>>623678

CONS:

>ultralight bug out

>"20% of body weight is ok"

>"my bag is only 18lb"

What is he talking about? Does he think he can sprint with that on? Move from cover to cover in an urban scenario?

His bivvy sack, bedding, tarp and poncho liner are useless if his clothing is good, and they're probably 60% of the weight of that pack. Just add a single shopping bag or sack with good outdoors clothing, then change clothing ASAP. No need for the tent stakes either.

Fire kit is overcomplicated. He buys a $0.50 bic lighter, and then complains "it can leak" or "it can get wet", so he BUYS A $20 SPECIAL MADE SLEEVE FOR A PLASTIC LIGHTER!

https://www.amazon.com/Exotac-fireSLEEVE-Ruggedized-Waterproof-Lighter/dp/B01C97H2ZM

This retarded piece of mall ninja technology is so popular that it's literally sold out almost everywhere. Why the not just buy a Zippo that costs $13 and can be modified to last more than a month of regular use?

https://www.amazon.com/Zippo-Pocket-Lighter-Black-Matte/dp/B0017T2LQY/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1546699531&sr=8-3&keywords=zippo+lighter

Get a canteen of lighter fluid and stick it in your pack, it takes up no space and can prove useful in a pinch.

His water treatment kit is also ridiculous, it seems to be designed for drinking sewage water, because every single method he has can only filter microorganisms. For some reason he showcases a muslim rag as a filtration method. Wha?

Just dig a hole below the water table and gird it right, the clay around it will filter it and you'll get water clean from microorganisms.

The main problem with water in north America is that we pumped out a fine layer of lead and mercury over all the soil, which has to be filtered with activated charcoal, his tablets and boiling does absolutely nothing for heavy metals. Only activated charcoal works, nothing else does, those quick mini filters are garbage.

His map and pencils aren't waterproofed, he needs to get a grease pencil and a greased map. It's also clearly a gas station map, not a map which shows relevant terrain features. Pic related the kind of map you need.

PROS

I liked the knife and multitool, I liked the SOS rations, the wilderness card, and the paracord. I also would have liked the medkit but he doesn't go into detail with it, a lot of extraneous stuff in off the shelf kits.

The goal is 5lb not 18lb


b9cb75  No.638050

>>637900

>Nuts are the most calorie dense food.

I carry nuts too, but I must correct you insofar as the most energetically dense food: the most dense is pure fat (solid fat slightly more so than liquid). That isn't palatable to most, but bear it in mind while planning. Compare the energy in, say, avocado oil (which doesn't burn the throat as much as olive oil when it is drank "straight up") vs an equivalent mass or volume of the nuts of your choice.

>Don't think you can eat nuts exclusively though.

Why not? Sure you can. I have eaten nothing but nuts for several days.

>Radically changing your diet can lead to problems like cramps and liquid shits.

No argument there.

>>637995

>>"my bag is only 18lb"

Kek.

>Pic related the kind of map you need.

A topo map, yes. You can find free topo data online, print out just your applicable area of interest on a few double sided pages of regular paper, and get it laminated at an office store.

>I also would have liked the medkit but he doesn't go into detail with it, a lot of extraneous stuff in off the shelf kits.

Yes, I made my own. I argue everyone should have a CAT7 tourniquet and know how to use it (note that practicing with a tourniquet can wear it out). Spend a few hours on your day off to take a local Stop the Bleed course. They are usually free… just ignore the political shit in the curriculum regarding Sandy Hoax and whatever.

https://cms.bleedingcontrol.org/class/search


b5a294  No.638063

>>637392

>normal fuel

Diesel?


f8d9c4  No.638228

>>638050

> I have eaten nothing but nuts for several days.

This is something I see often. "I ate nothing but freeze dried meals all weekend, no problem!"

I've tried various "survival" diets for up to a month. Nothing but trail mix. Nothing but freeze dried. Nothing but what I could catch or forage from my local area.

The only one that was no problem for a month was "nothing but canned food and rice."

fish/trap/forage: I lost 12lb in 3 weeks and didn't have the energy to continue.

Trail mix: liquishits after 4 or 5 days. I don't remember exactly. Gained weight tho.

Freeze dried: Couldn't stand the taste after about a week.

Survival cookies like in the video: Needed real food after 3 days.

MREs: Potentially doable, but I was pretty sick of them and didn't do the full month

Energy bars/protein bars: Massive constipation after a few days.


b9cb75  No.638230

>>638228

>>I have eaten nothing but nuts for several days.

>This is something I see often. "I ate nothing but freeze dried meals all weekend, no problem!"

And, as the thread topic is "bug out bags" not "long term survival bunker stockpiles"… QED: yes, you can eat only nuts for the several days that your bugout bag is designed to be used for. My choice of what to carry in my bag is different than what I stockpile in a fixed shelter.


1ae07a  No.638308

I cannot emphasize enough how important it is for you folks to go look at backpacking forums. Look into what ultralight backpackers bring with them when they through-hike the entire Appalachian Trail carrying 10lbs or less on their backs (pack included.) This will give you a great starting point for any bug-out situation, as these people are actually out there living it.

I'm not saying you have to pare down your loadout to these levels, but remember that you'll be carrying guns and these people usually don't.

For food/water, the recommendation is usually:

- water filtration system rather than carrying large amounts of water (personally, I only have 8-12 fl. oz. of water on my person at any given time depending on how close I am to water sources… I also carry powdered electrolytes to add to it so I can squeeze every last bit of hydration out of smaller quantities of water)

- trail mix usually has the best caloric density per weight out of all edible foods (discounting things like pure olive oil); peanut butter, protein bars; energy gels/candy; I carry a small quantity of instant rice, maybe a brick of ramen; stock cubes as a comfort food for those cold, rainy nights

- if you can forego a camp stove entirely, that's the best option - just build a fire every night. If you want one for short-term bugout purposes, something like an Esbit stove is a great choice; for longer-term (a week or more) journeys, alcohol stoves reign supreme.


1ae07a  No.638310

>>638308

I almost forgot; I like to keep a pouch of tuna or chicken in my pack as well. There's nothing like a tiny packet of buffalo chicken (from Starkist) to boost morale after being out in the elements for a few days and having nothing to eat but trail mix and rice.

Also, when I say "build a fire every night," I do not mean a full-on campfire. Your fires during a survival situation will be tiny, consisting mostly of twigs and small branches and the occasional larger branch. There is a difference between a survival fire and a camp fire; you will not (should not?) be carrying a hatchet, so you can't split wood for a camp fire.


4562d4  No.638311

>>638308

I looked at this and people who were homeless for long periods of time to see how they make long-term arrangements. Something I often think about is bag or leaf insulation under a poncho so you don't have to haul around clothes or a sleeping mat. Just pile up trash.


1ae07a  No.638312

>>638311

If you have the money to spend on a quality air sleeping pad and a quilt/mummy bag, it can really improve your comfort in cold weather. My sleep system is pretty luxurious, weighs less than 3.5 lbs, packs down pretty small, and keeps me toasty on chilly fall nights without a fire or tent.

But you're absolutely right - any insulation you can find will keep you alive. I've slept on a bag of leaves before in milder climates, with nighttime temperatures dipping down into the 40s. Any less than that would be uncomfortable, but I could throw together something that would keep me alive below freezing.


1ae07a  No.638313

>>638312

Another savior in cold weather is thermal underwear/socks. They're totally worth the weight. Now that I'm thinking about it, the aforementioned 40-degree night was accomplished without thermals because I didn't expect it to get so chilly… thermals would have improved my experience drastically.

Another thing about warmth: people underestimate how uncomfortable it is to be cold. If you don't believe me, turn the thermostat in your home down to 55 degrees for a few days during winter. I actually do this to condition myself for winter hikes/camping.


1ae07a  No.638314

>>638311

One more important thing to remember is that involuntarily-homeless people are NOT living comfortably. Every year thousands of homeless people freeze to death. Voluntary homelessness is different - you can afford to plan for it, and it'll increase your comfort and survival chances drastically. Apologies for the multiple posts.


4562d4  No.638320

>>638312

> it can really improve your comfort in cold weather.

It can also weigh you down when you're trying to move.

>turn the thermostat in your home down to 55 degrees for a few days during winter.

I don't use heating, at all, ever. It's something like 50 degrees right now and I'm fine, I even notice that I can see my own damn breath inside my house. Thermals ain't a bad idea though.

>One more important thing to remember is that involuntarily-homeless people are NOT living comfortably.

Neither will apocalypse survivors, it's not exactly voluntary to bug out. It's not about comfort it's about managing resources, I wouldn't want to carry around a sleeping pad when I can make it out of readily available leaves.


b9cb75  No.638321

>>638312

>If you have the money to spend on a quality air sleeping pad and a quilt/mummy bag, it can really improve your comfort in cold weather. My sleep system is pretty luxurious, weighs less than 3.5 lbs, packs down pretty small

I have a lot of quality backpacking equipment. I generally don't include those things in my bugout bag I keep with me in my vehicle. For example, you will destroy your expensive sleeping bag if you store it stuffed and compressed.


1ae07a  No.638323

>>638320

My entire pack plus firearm when I'm on a hike weighs 11.63 pounds. I train with a 30 lb pack. My sleep system isn't weighing me down.

>50 degrees right now and I'm fine

You're also dry, well-fed, protected from the wind, and unstressed. Hypothermia can set in at as high as 50 degrees. It's 55 in my house now and I'm fine, but when I first cranked down my thermostat from 68 degrees a few years ago, it was a shock, and it can really fuck up a person who's not used to it.

>It's not exactly voluntary to bug out

Yet you still have the sense to put together a bugout bag to make it easier to survive. I could walk out my door with nothing but a knife and a Bic lighter right now and successfully survive for 7 days while covering 100 miles, nestling myself deep into the woods. I'm not going to do that though, because I don't HAVE to. I have the option to prepare, and I'm taking it.

>>638321

I keep my pad and quilt in my car with my pack, uncompressed. I don't generally use the stuff sack… I just shove it into my bag when I want to go. Also, I was mistaken about the weight… I meant 2.5 lbs, not 3.5. 39.72 oz, to be exact, for both the pad and the quilt with their stuff sacks.


b9cb75  No.638324

File: c41b0a1990e2bc9⋯.jpg (267.24 KB, 1250x1250, 1:1, e9deae743012a8a59c36f28a66….jpg)

>>638321

This is what I have in my bugout bag in winter conditions:

https://www.surviveoutdoorslonger.com/survive-outdoors-longer-escape-bivvy.html

Mylar mummy bag. Adequately durable for reuse. Crucially, unlike the simple mylar blankets it is breathable so you don't wake up soaked and cold thanks to your own trapped humidity. Half a pound.


1ae07a  No.638326

>>638324

That's actually pretty neat. I don't know that I trust it to be as breathable as a quilt/bag (I opted for a quilt rather than a bag specifically so I could vent myself better in mild weather), and it certainly wouldn't be as comfortable, but I may pick one up.


1ae07a  No.638327

>>638320

BTW if you can see your breath inside your house at 50 degrees, you should probably ventilate a little bit, because that kind of humidity is going to cause you some mold problems down the line bud.


1dfa0c  No.638561

>>638050

>the most dense is pure fat (solid fat slightly more so than liquid).

That's why foods like pemmican or salo/slanina are top tier survival foods, they're basically solid blocks of fat, sometimes marbled with protein. It's also rich in tannins which destroy parasites, which means you don't have to filter water as much. My BOB sustenance is basically just vacuum sealed pemmican blocks.

The only other things you need are water and occasionally some roughage which you can forage anywhere.

>>638228

>plant proteins/carbs

>animal proteins/carbs

Your problem seems to be a lack of roughage. Roughage provides fiber, vitamins and minerals needed to keep you alive.

You sound like some guy dumb enough to get scurvy. Humans aren't carnivores or herbivores, we're obligate omnivores. Meaning we get sick if we don't have variety in food.

The fiber is especially important, it provides the "volume" which is the cylinder that pushes out your shit, and also it serves as a "sponge" that picks up toxins and byproducts your body can't absorb.

Fiber is the reason why we can't make food pills.


1dfa0c  No.638563

>muh bivvy

<what do when something bad happens?

<retreat to a safe area, construct a bivouac, wait for help

This is a meme for tourists popularized by british adventure novelists.


1ae07a  No.638655

>>638228

>fish/trap/forage

I'd like to know more about specifically what you were eating during this time and what gear you brought with you. Availability of food is the only thing stopping me from being able to live in the woods indefinitely, so knowing where you failed could help me greatly.


1ae07a  No.638656

>>638655

>what gear you brought with you

In regards to fishing/trapping, that is. Were you line fishing? Were you constructing traps out of material found in nature? Did you hunt at all (firearms, bow, etc.)?


ffc5de  No.638777

File: 12dce3bcadeb78e⋯.jpg (10.79 KB, 188x268, 47:67, images(6).jpg)

>>638324

Life pro tip, most of tue heat retention will come from the loft of whatever insulating layer you use. Vapor barriers and heat reflective things like mylar sheets and the like work great to extend the temperature range of your main sleeping insulating layer, but you should absolutely not rely on them as a primary shelter/solo element. As an emergency bivy for 1 or 2 nights to shiver inside of, fully clothed but out of the wind and rain? Theyre great for that (I have several of the smallest SOL bivy's myself), but absolutely not appropriate to consider for a ling term sleeping system, especially in northern climes.

https://andrewskurka.com/2011/vapor-barrier-liners-theory-application/

In fact, much of the community that is bug out minded should take a good hard look at the ultralight/thru hiking community. Concentrating on easy to prepare, nutrient dense foods, lightweight but effective shelter and sleep systems, lightweight, multi purpose gear (that obviously gets used and tested on the trail) all crosses right over to the concept of a successful bug out bag.

Skurkas site has quite a bit of useful information if you look back through the pages of it.

Sily nylon and sil polyester (arguably better, higher waterproof rating vs nylon) come in all sorts of colors and patterns, there are even off the shelf options for camoflauge patterned tarps. A 10x10 or 12x12 sil tarp is configurable in a lot of different ways, can offer multi-person shelter from the elements. You can use one and some mylar blankets and plastic sheeting to build a super shelter to keep warm and dry.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wVJIjpsx5y8

>pic related 9/10 BOB dump videos on the youtubes. Always with an overweight dude huffing and puffing through a heart arrhythmia going on about how they're going to cover 100 miles with 65lbs of quadruple redundant crap in a hostile environment.


48f812  No.638782

>>638777

>As an emergency bivy for 1 or 2 nights to shiver inside of, fully clothed but out of the wind and rain? Theyre great for that (I have several of the smallest SOL bivy's myself),

Nice. That is why I selected it for my bugout bag. Far more compact and light than my down sleeping bag I use backpacking.

>but absolutely not appropriate to consider for a ling term sleeping system, especially in northern climes.

Yeah, my EDC bugout bag isn't my "escape into the backcountry of the Rocky Mountains to overwinter there" bag, which is also why I am happy to load the bugout bag with an imbalanced diet of nuts, nut butter packets, protein bars, +/- a bit of avocado oil. That is the diet I would want to keep my energy up for the few days my bag is intended to be used for. I prefer to use the right tool for a given job, and my EDC bugout is targeted for that.

But hey, this is /k/. I expected more debate on which armaments are in the bag/loadout as opposed to "sleeping bag vs bivvy" and "nuts vs well balanced diet". Is anyone packing a suppressed 22LR? Has anyone selected a short AR w/ pistol brace?


1ae07a  No.638790

>>638782

>armaments

I imagine this is where /k/ theory will diverge from that of the ultralight backpacking crowd.

When I'm on a hike, I carry bear spray and a Ruger LCP. No extra ammo. This is what I would have in a bug-out scenario, and I'd be perfectly content with it. Most backpackers carry less than that.


48f812  No.638799

>>638790

>I imagine this is where /k/ theory will diverge from that of the ultralight backpacking crowd.

It really all depends on your expected scenario. If your bag is targeted for an extended "man vs wild" backcountry engagement in the far north in the winter, then that's vastly different than targeting for having to bugout several days, possibly on foot, across urban/suburban territory in the southern US with possible chimpouts underway. No one bag/loadout is going to be universally ideal.


1ae07a  No.638802

>>638799

Very true. It's almost pointless to debate. In the area I'm in, and for the situation I anticipate, I'm totally fine with very little in the way of firepower. Different hypothetical situations and locations would change that, to the point where I could see myself packing several rifles and thousands of rounds of ammo in some scenarios.

However, the basic surviving-in-the-wilderness-while-remaining-mobile loadout IS pretty universal, with some common sense allowances for differences in climate. I think that's the point of this thread. That's where ultralight backpacking comes into play, and I think that even for many city-dwellers their bugout plan is "escape the city, live in the wilderness."


ffc5de  No.638808

>>638782

>nuts, nut butters, avocado, short term

I've got a 750mL ti pot and lid on order. I'm going to be experimenting with cold soaking quinoa (much higher levels of essential amino acids and fatty acids than rice, more fiber as well) to figure out how much I should prepack in zip lock bags to make 2 square meals a day. That, plus the mylar packs of tuna or spam will make up the "heavy" meals for each day. Can be eaten cold or with minimal heated water depending on the weather/environment I find myself in. I have found the lemon flavored RX bars to be very good, dense and nutritious. I eat those regularly enough to rotate through the pack for freshness, and so that they are a regular part of my diet. Fiber is key, a small ziploc bag of fiber certainly wont hurt you on the trail.

I posted the homemade protein bar recipe earlier, forgot to mention that the recipe can likely be improved with casein protein rather than whey (if you have IBS, whey concentrate doesnt bother me most of the time, regular whey does, casein does not at all) and with adding a small quantity of calcium propionate to the dry mix to act as a preservative. Then vaccuum seal in mylar as individually wrapped ration bars.

http://bakerpedia.com/ingredients/calcium-propionate/

>>638790

>armaments

I live south of a major city, reasonable commuting distance. Will buy me time if there is a major event, especially if vehicles are damaged (grid down/CME or EMP). I have a few glock 19's, plenty of mags and ammo. I also have a keltec sub2k in 9mm. Need to pick up another one, honestly, theyre quite fun to shoot. I would like to say a fn5-7, as the ammo is so small and light, but I am not man who wears hand sewn suit of italian fascists. I have an mpa5-7, but I dont have the cash to stash nearly as much 5.7x28 as I can 9mm or 5.56, so it is a range toy for now. Maybe if I hit the lottery.

>Question for everyone:

<Has anyone bought the compressed "toilet paper/paper towel" pods and had success with them?

I find the concept tempting. I currently have about 3 weeks of tp individually vaccuum packed, and just have 3 boxes of shop towels as my paper towel back up. I have some mild GI issues, so even with a stable diet sometimes its unpredictable, so being able to pack a literal shitload of tp equivalent into small spaces would be helpful.


479828  No.638899

>>638802

> and I think that even for many city-dwellers their bugout plan is "escape the city, live in the wilderness."

I'd say that there is some merit to bugging in or making a go home bag vs bugging out to innawoods. IMO unless someone already has a fairly good innawoods location to go to and already familiar with it and ideally already got their ass innawoods cabin.

If the risk of a chimpout in your area is low to miniscule, there's a good chance someone can survive if they have a minimum of 2 weeks water, food, medicine etc. If it's something like an impending natural disaster then yeah of course try to avoid an Escape from NOlean's Katrina hellhole. If it's really large scale as in outright war, for most people it's not innawoods time but time to get in a plane and go to another country that is safe(r).

I say most because some of you fuc/k/s here would relish "oh shit it's habbenig tiem", can't say I blame you either just remember that the majority of people would rather go elsewhere than go full Doomguy. But there are days, that I really understand why some would rather rip and tear the huge guts.


1ae07a  No.638910

>>638899

>bugging in or making a go home bag

Yep, absolutely. It just seems to me that if you have the tools to live in the woods, then you have at least enough to live in an abandoned building, under a bridge, on the street, etc., although you'd probably want more firepower on hand. Maybe I'm just talking out my ass here though because I don't live in a major metropolitan area… if I had to leave my home on foot right now, I could be several miles into the woods with camp set up and meat on the fire in about 8 hours.

My easy access to and familiarity with the wilderness means it's always going to be my first choice for any fairly localized disaster. Hell, there are days where I think I would prefer living in the woods even without a disaster.

Anyway, what would make a good "get home bag" for someone living in a more urban area? What kind of scenario are we talking? You're at work when you hear the news, then all of a sudden the power's out, the roads are clogged, there are riots in the streets, trigger-happy cops are all over the place, and all you want to do is get home?


36e1e0  No.638920

>>638910

>what would make a good "get home bag" for someone living in a more urban area? What kind of scenario are we talking? You're at work when you hear the news, then all of a sudden the power's out, the roads are clogged, there are riots in the streets, trigger-happy cops are all over the place, and all you want to do is get home?

Emergency bivy in a drab color, change of socks, bodyglide or bodypowder, assortment of small food bars, water bottles and a means to filter then purify, flashlight, headlamp and batteries, map of the area. Gun and lotsa bullets.


1c9cf5  No.638923

>>638920

Some camouflage may be in order too, depending on what the environment is. Especially since the idea is to avoid conflict and people as a whole when you leg it back home.


479828  No.638927

>>638910

>Anyway, what would make a good "get home bag" for someone living in a more urban area? What kind of scenario are we talking? You're at work when you hear the news, then all of a sudden the power's out, the roads are clogged, there are riots in the streets, trigger-happy cops are all over the place, and all you want to do is get home?

Good comfortable shoes and socks that someone can walk or run in, it does not have to be specifically sneakers or running shoes, just something durable yet something you can still move in, but definitely avoid the overly Military Look. For those who have female loved ones, try to at least make them pack some sort of sensible shoes and socks. Those with workboots, go for wide toes version. Change of sensible clothes or at least pants with some pockets, apply mostly to the females of your family and loved ones but can apply to males as well. Regular stuff like your wallet including whatever IDs you usually carry, but some cash never ever hurts in an emergency. It doesn't have to be a thousands, just as a rough ballpark to start say a taxi ride home's worth plus a few more dollars or so, or for a night at a motel. By the way that is more likely to happen unless you are in the middle of a ground zero chimpout tornado.

Re-usable water container, this does not have to be some spec-ops prepper stuff. A stainless or insulated stainless water bottle is good enough for most 90% occasion. A bag that does not scream out"MILITARY WANNABE", christ even a laptop type bag can do. Nothing that will draw too much attention, you're not that crazy "prepper" guy that talmudvision tries to smear, you're just Steve the guy who always brings his large water bottle because you think hydration is important. And you carry a basic first aid kit somewhere in your bag because hey shit happens, even a papercut can be annoying and the workplace kit doesn't always have everything. And who doesn't like a few extra snacks just in case of a long commute. No one has to know that you may or may not have a lifestraw, or have a firearm because it's none of their business.

Swiss army knife or multi tool, a mini AA or AAA led flashlight preferably single mode, 2 mode maximum. There are singe AA, angle flashlights with a clip that can be used as a makeshit headlamp with a baseball hat brim. A hat. A lighter, even a BIC can do. Zip ties, you know the stuff you already carry for fixing small things or for cable management. FM radio, if your cellphone is not equipped with one. No one will believe any story you come up with regarding your full size gasmask. Your surgical mask or N95 mask that fits in your bag because you have lingering hayfever and dust allergies though. A plain colored but not welders mitt level thick, leather work glove, mostly because how dapper it makes you look but thick enough to protect your hands.

If it hypothetically comes down to "holy fucking shit Pissrael and Mecca exchanged nukes, shit is really going fucking down everyone remain where you are until further notice", and you are stuck at work for a while. The stuff you normally carry anyway can stil be useful. IMO that's the main goal for urban area, aim for "normal" Steve that does not draw attention, you are just a countless face in the crowd. That's the type of camo you want in an urban environment because the hyenas are kinda different.

Again unless you are in the middle of a chimpout ground zero, most of the time your biggest danger is panicked lemmings and (((merchants))) jacking up prices during an emergency.


479828  No.638928

>>638927

>FM radio, if your cellphone is not equipped with one.

If it has AM or other band, even better. There are compact ones and hey you just like those retro things, imagine a compact device that you can listen to stuff on without needing internet access. But if there is a big enough emergency then there is a good chance that even that info will be broadcasted on FM.


1dfa0c  No.639323

>>638655

>>638656

Always wear pantyhose stockings, they are impromptu fish nets. Simply take them off, put the open end upstream and the legs downstream, into a really fast river. Keep it there for awhile. Fish or crab will eventually get in and be trapped.

And if you put a billiard ball in it, it becomes a massive flail which you can use to take down larger animals.

>>638777

>>638782

>sleeping bag vs bivvy

Nigra…

GET GOOD CLOTHING

You can literally sleep on the ground.

Fucking think about it, if you need an extra layer of clothes, it's because you weren't clothed right when you walked out.


b9cb75  No.639374

>>639323

I genuinely want to see what's in your bugout bag. A change of your fishnet pantyhose, a billiard ball, perhaps a rubber chicken, cosmoline, and a vibrating dildo molded after a grizzly bear's penis…?


ffc5de  No.639401

File: 1b71b5cf0445f4e⋯.jpg (134.5 KB, 525x1024, 525:1024, 1540821884463m.jpg)

File: 0072b9e2f332465⋯.jpg (194.53 KB, 791x1024, 791:1024, 1540823391995m.jpg)

>>639323

>advocating wearing so much clothing you sweat your ass off moving during the day, to be sufficiently warm at night.

Bruh, a mylar bivy or one of those tyvek sol bivy's is worth its small weight and bulk to have a weather resistant shelter to sleep in. I'm not wearing hardshells to be able to sleep in 12 hours.


b9cb75  No.639404

>>639376

So, you're saying that in your bag you have a rainbow clown wig, a grizzly bear penis dildo, a billiard ball, cosmoline, the full series of original edition The Fantastic Adventures of Captain Sweden issues, a change of fishnet pantyhose, tampons (for the bullet holes), stiletto heels (doubles as a melee weapon), and some plastic drinking straws (the kind that bend, obviously)?

How much does it weigh?


1dfa0c  No.639423

>>639374

I don't have a rubber chicken in my pack, it's a rubber

>>639401

If that's happening, your clothing is garbage. LAYERS negro, a bedouin wears the same clothes when it's -10C and +50C. And it's simple as fuck to carry a liner or padding for a jacket.

>dressed in tshirt

>carries around a bivvy

>hot weather during day when moving, pack the liner away

<yay im happy

>cold weather during night, cover up with bivvy

<yay im happy

>have to move at night rapidly, cant get out of bivvy, if you do its too cold to move

<sad panda

>cold weather during day when having to move, and ends up carrying bivvy sack wrapped around the body like a toga

<sad panda

OR

>dressed in light summer jacket

>carries around felt liner for winter

>hot weather during day when moving, pack the liner away

<yay im happy

>cold weather during night, add felt liner, and sleep on the ground always ready for action

<yay im happy

>cold weather during day when having to move, add felt liner and keep going

<yay im happy


1ae07a  No.639498

>>639423

Totally agreed about the layers. I use a lightweight, packable puffer jacket as a liner for my rain jacket.

I would still not sleep on the ground unless I had to - during the summer I don't bring my quilt or air pad, but I do bring a cheap, lightweight foam pad just to stay comfortable and dry.


743b69  No.639509

>>636901

I tried that recipe some years ago and those bars taste like shit and you need a lot of water to swallow them down.

Its like some retard on a vegan trip googled the most protein dense plants his stupid diet allows him and threw it all together.

The majority of the ingredients have their own heavy taste and the maple syrup basically exist as a desperate attempt to mask the awful taste when they are combined.

Also flax/linseed can give you diarrhea if eaten too much.


1dfa0c  No.639784

>>639509

>Its like some retard on a vegan trip googled the most protein dense plants

That's more or less what happened, I think I was in that thread, on the /fit/ board. Fucker kept shitting on everyone suggesting meat.


1dfa0c  No.639792

File: 6201486ecd04de9⋯.jpg (49.92 KB, 800x800, 1:1, Fashion-Men-Winter-Duck-Do….jpg)

File: e0739494c15102c⋯.jpg (322.78 KB, 800x800, 1:1, Clothing-Suppliers-China-M….jpg)

>>639498

This thing is magic, its basically a modernized vatnik suit.

In dry hot weather it acts as a layered jacket, wicking away sweat and letting wind through. In rain the water mostly slides off of it. In cold weather it protects as good as a jacket twice the size and five times the weight. Can be compacted into something the size of a pack of cigarettes, and weighs only 200 grams.


056e06  No.639812

>>639423

Dog I don’t know what kind of winters you get where you’re at but without 2 pretty solid jackets here you’ll die from exposure during the winter here in about a day.

Most people get away with a single winter jacket in the day to day because they are outside for like 10 minutes between their car and whatever building they are in. So I see where you are coming from with the layers argument but you need dedicated gear not some kind of universal fleece liner thing


ffc5de  No.641452

>>639812

I'd love to see this guy roll around with his felt liners.

I tend to plan for worst case scenario: soaking wet, worst seasonal temperatures, high winds, low activity level. So, base layer, midweight insulating/lofting layer(s), preferably some sort of hardshell outer layer. Remove hardshell layer while sheltering in bivy. Insulate/elevate from the ground as much as possible.

If its cold and dry(in my area, generally below 25*F) and you can maintain a relatively steady level of activity (e.g. steady walking pace over uneven terrain while laden with gear), you can stay survivably warm with silkweights, good socks, shorts, longsleeve tshirt/lightweight fleece, and neck gaiter/buff and thin gloves. You should keep an insulating layer very readily accessible for when you stop for more than a few minutes.

Seasonally we will see short periods where temps drop to around/slightly below 0*F. If you can keep moving, silkweights, grid fleece mid layers and a softshell outer layer will keep you warm.

Were I bugging out, I would try to move during the night/early morning hours, as it will be coldest during this period, and rest in the mid morning hours. A warming/drying/cooking fire is less likely to give you away with its light during the day. The smoke will be easier for you to keep an eye on, you can set up a shelter to take advantage of the heat from the sun (to the extent that is possible).

If my activity level is going to be lower, I'm going to wear more even at warmer layers.

My clothing system reflects my weather and environment, as should everyone's.

Realistically, my bugout will be with family to either another family members house, a hotel or a shelter. Worst case is I am walking across country in the cold/damp weater between 40*F and 25*F.


f67026  No.641584

>>639792

>This thing is magic, its basically a modernized vatnik suit.

Its actually older than the vatnik suit. The padded jacket was invented by US american Eddie Bauer in the 1930, the vatnik suit was first issued to the red army in the 1940.


cbcc17  No.642499

>>636408

>not personal_helicopter.webm


b98448  No.643054

File: cd5af40ad98366b⋯.jpg (82.34 KB, 625x466, 625:466, cd5af40ad98366b97f9826e98e….jpg)

>>642499

Calm down there Bill Burr.

Alot of people here seem to be conflating their bug out bags and their range loadout.

>To bug out: to abscond, flee, leave, scoot, remove yourself from a suddenly hostile environment

Does noone here anticipate getting rounded up by whatever remains of FEMA? Dropped into a shelter, if they see you loaded with gear and weapons, 1- you'll be loved tenderly, 2- they're probably just gonna gank your entire bag. Now what do you do? Whereas the guy with the hiking bag and snack bars is probably sliding right through.

<Really though, is there a single anon here who has been through the recent mass bugouts because of the fires in Cali, Katrina or similar?


3ac474  No.643075

>>641584

Actchuahlly, the jacket was invented by Ugg Rock. He also invented a type of warm leather boot.


b39509  No.643166

File: 2b61dc4e102f20c⋯.png (176.1 KB, 1000x750, 4:3, best killdozer.png)

>>637489

Obviously that means the solution is to build a killdozer large enough to house an entire self-sustaining society.


3ac474  No.643395

File: 7933846296df910⋯.jpg (72.65 KB, 900x329, 900:329, KSC09.jpg)

File: f39e2df3cfb7bf2⋯.jpg (1.06 MB, 2659x738, 2659:738, wallpaper-219075.jpg)

>>643166

Fun fact, the Schwerer Gustav cannon fits perfectly on the NASA Crawler.

I once made a maquette for science class with a scale model of schwerer gustav glued to a nasa crawler, and I got forced to see the counselor for an entire semester.


3ac474  No.643400

>>643395

actually the crawler transporter was designed by a nazi immigrant, so maybe its that way for a reason?


0d4083  No.643891

>>623405

Cliff bars are not made with soy products


6c5bb3  No.643892

File: 3e4d03002feec4b⋯.jpg (35.65 KB, 512x423, 512:423, gondola_sweating.jpg)

>>643400

So NASA uses that thing instead of a railcart because a German took out some blueprints for the Landkreuzer P. 1500 Monster from his bag, and they rolled with it?


eac269  No.643898

>>643892

NASA was for the most part ex-SS scientists, in particular von Braun. Imagine the insane shit they've got locked away.


3ac474  No.643906

>>643892

Worse yet, imagine if germany had enough steel to build it.

The main drawback of the Schwerer Gustav were the railroad tracks, which limited where it can be aimed and how well it can avoid bombers.

If it was free to move around…. with RAP shells this thing can sit in France and bomb Britain, with no way to counterattack. This ensures that Germany would have a ready beachhead whenever it wanted, they could have overran the isles in 1941 which would mean American bombers couldn't reach Germany. German Western front would be safe until 1946, they could take their time and consolidate there.

Instead of Schwerer we get his retarded brother Karl.


01390e  No.644091

>>623528

>Burgers had difficulties fighting in simple sandnigger towns against 70 IQ monkeys armed with AKs.

That they weren't allowed to shoot at until they were shot at first.

Scorched earth is the only way to win.


e6b91f  No.644095

>>636281

I mean you can just put the wrench on the knob and twist the opposite way of how it normally turns and the door knob breaks and opens. But I am unaware of how to open a deadbolt with one as I have only used this trick on doors without.

>t. Former junkie


3e2092  No.644284

>escaping a city on foot

Hop on a freight train, I hear USA has a very large and complex network of rail lines, With enough planning you can hitch a ride anywhere in the country


ffc5de  No.644518

>>644284

All of which will be promptly shut down if there's widespread chaos.

That being said, it's a good idea to at least have a map that includes railways in your area. Personally, I'm hopjng there's a coal train stuck on a siding thats just down the river from me if the shtf. I'll at least have a ready source of fuel if that's the case. There are also coal storage yards a few miles in either direction, though, obviously the greater the distsnce the greater the risk of being interfered with while transporting it.


ace23e  No.644527

>>644091

That's not what scorched earth is.

Scorched earth is a defensive guerrilla tactic used to put the odds of attrition slightly more on your side when you have a lot of land and are being invaded by an overwhelimg force.

It was developed by Vercingetorix's confederation to counter Julius Kaesar's looting of the gaulish countryside.

Scorched Earth showed its drawbacks once Kaesar started taking gaulish cities before they could burn or move their winter grain storage.


ace23e  No.644529

>>644518

If freight trains shut down, then half of the country will starve within three weeks anyway. Most of the food being delivered to the US west coast relies on only two rail shipping lines.

It's the same problem with Canada; if only a handful of railroad shipping lines shut down, the provinces outside of the prairies would rely on trucks and boats for food shipping, which cannot possibly suffice for feeding everyone. Importing from abroad would not suffice either. Famine would ensue.


ace23e  No.644531

>>644284

Hitching a ride on a freight train is hard. Convenient empty wagons are actually extremely rare because of optimized shipping efficiency; you can't take this as a reliable method of transport. And it's definitely not a safe method of transport either, because you can bet that other people will also have the same bad idea as you. And trains do not stop between loading/unloading centers, so you'll be holding on for your life for hours on end.

There's a reason why at least a third of the hobos found trying to hitchhike on a train are found dead, not alive. The others are arrested, because security will rigorously check the whole freight train when it arrives at a destination.

Then there's the risk of train hijacks if the area is really plunged in utter chaos and completely disorganized. Some railway pirates in poorer countries have been known to outright derail trains just to loot whatever could be salvaged/enslaved from the crash.

Trust me, you are safer just going on foot or on a bicycle. A good mountain bike is best, it goes everywhere, doesn't make much sound, and can go between tightly-packed cars to pass through traffic jams, which is where most people will get stuck at the moment SHTF unless they already live innawoods.


ace23e  No.644540

>>637900

>>>623678

>I've probably watched 50 BOB videos and this is the first I've seen that wasn't pants-on-head retarded. Good find anon.

YES. Gray-bearded green beret is great. Another true expert on youtube is Dave Canterbury. Most "survival" youtubers are either idiots or larpers trying to shove affiliate links down your throat and telling you to buy tons of gimmicky crap.

>My bag is fairly different from his, but most of the differences are minor.

Same here, basically; except I pack a whole lot more thermal insulation; because northern winters. "Ultralight" becomes only "light" when you have to plan for subzero temperatures literally half of the year.

>Biggest thing he gets wrong is food. The idea that you'll be able to trap, fish or forage for food in the wilderness is basically a meme. You may be able to get some, but more often than not you'll burn more energy than you gain.

Also this. People somehow think that nature is idyllically filled with woodland critters, while in fact they are getting rarer and rarer. I've seen a lot more squirrels and racoons since I moved to a major urban center than during all my time growing up and hunting in rural nowhere. The only relatively abundant thing left in the woods here is bears, because they don't have predators (except for car and truck bumpers) and they're omnivores that eat basically anything. They've also started breeding with all the polar bears that are migrating southwards; which makes them extra bloodthirsty. The other thing that we have a lot of are deer, but the fuckers are moving further north every year, away from where all the humans are, and unfortunately away from the places where you'll be needing them when/if SHTF.

>>>626079

>Nuts are the most calorie dense food. Don't think you can eat them exclusively though. Radically changing your diet can lead to problems like cramps and liquid shits. Not show stoppers, but if you're bugging out you already have enough problems.

This, it is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT that your body be acclimated to the stuff you're going to eat while your life is on the line.

Also, beans/chickpeas and rice are altogether pretty good as far as caloric density goes, and form a complete protein. It's also really cheap to stock a lot of this stuff at your bugout location, with dried spices and long shelf-life seasoning or stuff to make sauces.


ace23e  No.644543

>>623405

Soy, especially when fermented, is an economical and efficient source of protein and vitamins.

Just how much rigorous research about nutritional science did you do?

In case you were scared of eating stuff that contains plant hormones; just know that pretty much all meat (even the hippie organic "no hormones added" meat) contains about as much estrogen as soy does phytoestrogen; *except it's actual mammalian estrogen*.

Phytoestrogen does interface with your body's estrogen receptors to some extent, but it usually doesn't register as estrogen at all; meaning that most of what it does is block the estrogen receptor; therefore slightly inhibiting the actual effects of your body's normal estrogen.

If anything, phytoestrogen virtually tilts your effective testosterone/estrogen balance towards comparatively higher testosterone.

You'd have to drink dozens of 2-liter cartons of soymilk per week , like, 4 liters of soymilk per day, in order for it to maybe make a difference in the very long run, after years of this very unbalanced diet. Now, consider that most ridiculously-unbalanced diets like this one would also have effects on your hormone levels, regardless of what you're eating.

Also, cliff bars don't even contain soy at all. But most of the bullshit "manliness-enhancing" "supplements" sold online to gullible beta cuks do contain soy, ironically.


39d127  No.644546

>>644543

Cliff bars, the regular variety, do contain soy. Soy protein isolate, roasted soybeans, soy flour. Their protein bars also contain soy. But, most protein bars contain soy and a lot of protein powder brands use it too so you're not that wrong, you're just not right.

If you're looking it's not hard to find a supplement brand that doesn't use soy. They are usually a bit more expensive though.


ace23e  No.644551

>>644546

You are correct about the clif bars ingredients list, I dropped the ball on that last part. Their granola bar and a couple others don't have soy or soy protein as an ingredient though. I was thinking that only their protein bars had soy protein isolate and flour in them, like most protein bars do, but that extends to most of their other products as well.

As for the supplements thing, I was referring to products like infowars' "Brain Force" supplement, which contains soy even though infowars itself claims that soy should always be avoided like the plague (except when they're the ones selling it…). I have friends who wasted a lot of money on this stuff.


ace23e  No.644555

Pack lithium batteries, not disposable crap. They last longer, are more reliable, and are RECHARGEABLE.

You have to rotate out disposable batteries every once in a while because they go bad even if you don't use them, which is a waste of money and resources.

At least you can eat the food that you have to rotate out of your BoB; but you're not gonna start using flashlights every 6 months instead of turning the lights on in your house just because your AAA batteries need to be rotated out and you don't want to waste the money you paid for them.

Keeping a crank-charger or small solar charger at your bug-out location makes long-lasting rechargeable batteries even more cost-effective in the long run. Most of the stuff that runs on lithium batteries has a USB-standard charging port nowadays, so you don't need a bunch of different chargers.


1da48a  No.644567

File: b6bb98952d4a75e⋯.pdf (4.6 MB, vug_pcu.pdf)

>>639401

Full res pdf of that first image.


a645c6  No.644580

>>644555

I have rechargeables for all my battery types except coin watch batteries and cr2's because no reliable ones seem to exist.

I also have multiple usb chargers and a fast solar panel.

I plan to burn through disposables and then have rechargeables as a last resort.


d73f61  No.644597

File: 99fa627ef8c8761⋯.jpg (78.46 KB, 1280x720, 16:9, maxresdefault (2).jpg)

File: 775ab03f9cf9e38⋯.jpg (175.16 KB, 1000x1000, 1:1, 7_1500_1027548646.jpg)

>Anyway, what would make a good "get home bag" for someone living in a more urban area? What kind of scenario are we talking? You're at work when you hear the news, then all of a sudden the power's out, the roads are clogged, there are riots in the streets, trigger-happy cops are all over the place, and all you want to do is get home?

Recognize that, in the example situation, getting home safely will involve going over, around, or through obstacles.

-A compact set of boltcutters like pic related will allow you to take shortcuts that would otherwise be unavailable to you. The ones in the pic are ones I use every day in a professional setting: Absolutely buy cheaper ones if you'll only be using them in a bug-out situation (8-10 inches is the sweet spot- too long and they aren't concealable, too short and they won't have enough leverage to cut well).

Being able to cut through chain link, chains, and lower-security padlocks will let you take side routes and minimize your exposure while moving. Also, depending on how your city is laid out, cutting a few of the right locks might even get you rooftop access.

-Eye protection. If that's been mentioned in the thread before, then I must've missed it. This is a cheap purchase that should NEVER be overlooked in these discussions. Buy good, well-fitting safety glasses. They cost less than $10 a pair and there's no excuse for not having a pair in your glovebox, a pair in your desk at work, and a pair at home. You can even buy ones that look like regular eyeglasses for extra stealth. If OC/CS gas is being deployed en masse, swim goggles will prevent you from being blinded but you'll look like a dork.

Mainly, you don't wanna be the guy who goes blind on day one of the apocalypse and misses all the fun just because you got some shrapnel/glass/dirt/blood in your eyes.

>1/?


d73f61  No.644598

File: 2e19cddeca1adef⋯.jpg (471.67 KB, 1920x1080, 16:9, coast_tech_inspection_beam.jpg)

File: 6a57aca2ff4a4e5⋯.jpg (50.6 KB, 620x302, 310:151, wpid-20140314084918.jpg)

>>644597

-A decent quality penlight. You can have cool lanterns and weaponlights and bright-ass maglights and stuff too, but you'll want a good lightweight penlight you can clip in a pocket and can also hold in your mouth to free up your hands for certain tasks. Try to get a spot-style beam and not a flood beam; penlights are best for illuminating things only within a few meters and you want minimal beam spread to avoid drawing attention to yourself with excessive light throw.

-A few pairs of latex gloves, just in case you have to render medical assistance to someone (or loot a corpse) or if you cut your hand and want to minimize further contamination of the wound. Or if you have to open a door that's been smeared with shit or whatever.

You can even roll them up and vacuum seal them in plastic. They'll take up practically zero space in your kit.

1/2


d73f61  No.644599

File: f79c15d39c45a01⋯.jpg (133.26 KB, 687x700, 687:700, 4435.jpg)

File: 088461152a79417⋯.jpg (49.45 KB, 504x371, 72:53, quikclot_700.jpg)

File: 587403761e2fb58⋯.jpg (12.86 KB, 340x270, 34:27, il_340x270.1046499620_h4sn.jpg)

>>644598

>>644597

-Mechanics gloves. Cheap, inconspicuous, durable, and good general PPE for climbing, fighting, and not leaving fingerprints on things.

-Compact first aid kit. In this sort of escape scenario, long-term treatment materials are unnecessary weight since its assumed you're doing e&e to get back to your main kit. The primary concern of this aid kit would be to stop the bleeding from cuts, slashes, and nonlethal gunshot wounds. If you need to, say, splint a broken bone in the middle of a solo 1-12hr high intensity e&e, then your best bet is to find a veterinarian or doctor and bribe, coerce, or threaten him into fixing you.

With that said, I'd recommend simply packing a bandage, a gauze pad, and a small packet of quick-clot: enough to treat a single stab wound or ricochet injury. And a couple band-aids in case you cut a finger, just so the blood doesn't interfere with your dexterity.

-A bic lighter. You can start dumpster fires as a distraction, light a friendly stranger's cigarette, or heat up either your blade to sterilize it or cauterize something.

>3/?


d73f61  No.644600

File: 61e9599b7f1510f⋯.jpg (54.34 KB, 657x527, 657:527, 61e9599b7f1510f4307937da91….jpg)

File: 87e668a8d7d6e5f⋯.jpg (36.67 KB, 657x527, 657:527, 87e668a8d7d6e5fa5c1c7d6ff8….jpg)

File: c154f4a19488170⋯.jpg (62.2 KB, 1328x764, 332:191, ufkub2tmpz321.jpg)

>>644599

>>644598

>>644597

-Go pills. Adrenaline can only take you so far, and if The Big One hits right at the end of a full workday you're already going to be tired. Avoid amphetamines and other conventional "uppers": They don't play nice with adrenaline or adrenergic metabolites and the resulting hypomania will make you reckless and get you dead.

I recommend nodoz or any generic store brand caffeine pill, but take care to avoid formulations and anything with theanine added. You want just straight-up caffeine in 100mg or 200mg pills. A 90ct Wal-Mart bottle of 200mg caffeine pills costs $5 and takes up very little space in your bugout bag. Take one of the pills as a test when you buy them as a dry-run to learn your dosage so you don't take too many when SHTF and have a heart attack and die and miss the apocalypse like a fag.

-Ziplock bags. Just some empty ziplock bags. For real, you can put all kinds of stuff in them and they weigh nothing at all. Zipties are another thing that are very light and low cost that, if you need one, you'll really fucking need one.


d73f61  No.644601

File: 34474d90289ecce⋯.jpg (37.7 KB, 610x508, 305:254, tonyon-universal-lock-the-….jpg)

File: ab9b7bd0fb4d11a⋯.jpg (87.53 KB, 1500x1165, 300:233, Use-a-Padlock-Shim-Step-4.jpg)

File: ccab10de1be09f9⋯.jpg (90.58 KB, 1024x1024, 1:1, 1655euro17-us-1.jpg)

>>644597

>>644598

>>644599

>>644600

-A u-shaped bike lock. The most inconspicuous item an urbanite can carry, yet it can be used to lock up exits/entrances to buildings and gated alleyways, disable potential pursuit vehicles like bicycles and motorcyles (and cars, if you're creative), and can even be used as a melee weapon or prisoner restraints.

-In that same vein, carrying a padlock is also not a bad idea. If you cut a lock off a gate or alleyway and enter it, you can lock it behind you to prevent threats from the rear.

You can also buy padlock shims or lockpicks online that will let you shim or pick the bog-standard masterlocks you see everywhere with only a few minutes of practice. You could shim the lock open, enter, then just relock it with the same lock. Those are valuable skills if you have the time and interest to learn, but I personally don't like dicking around with mechanisms. If I can't cut it or climb over it, I'll either shoot it or just go somewhere else.

-Small toolset. There will always be a use for good pliers, a few screwdrivers, and an adjustable wrench in any urban situation. I recommend a 10-12" hammerhead adjustable wrench: That'll handle any wrench-related task with the added benefit of being a great smasher of windows, door handles, and ethnics.

The pliers/screwdrivers can be a leatherman type tool you edc, or a backpack'd bicycle-style kit since those are usually very compact and won't look unusual if you're also carrying a u-lock.

A decent bike toolkit will also come with a schrader valve tool, which will allow you to effectively and quietly deflate the tires of stationary vehicles you deem to be potential future threats (anything with 24" rims, "stanced" hondas/acuras, escalades, black SUV's, cop cars, etc.)

>4/[almost done]


d73f61  No.644603

File: 91e3179ed05f137⋯.jpg (30.19 KB, 500x375, 4:3, 43924-duct-tape-rules-repa….jpg)

File: a982ad15867a7f9⋯.jpg (4.87 KB, 220x220, 1:1, S69-2283.jpg)

File: 7c618cf59f3c58c⋯.jpg (25.93 KB, 880x660, 4:3, 517337.jpg)

File: d440f435f05420a⋯.jpg (62.07 KB, 980x600, 49:30, Morakniv-Pro.jpg)

>>644601

>>644600

>>644599

>>644598

>>644597

-Duct tape. This has a million uses. It can patch up tears in your bag/backpack, cover up reflectors, black out windows, tape additional weapons to yourself or even temporarily silence any newly-acquired battlebrides.

It's also useful for breaking non-car windows if you need to b&e to get roof access, find a back door, or just hide out in an empty building till some heat dies down. You tape up the entirety of the target window (you've been wearing your safety glasses, right?) and whack it with your wrench or a rock until it gives. This muffles the sound and prevents shards of glass from getting fucking everywhere.

The other option when it comes to hreaking windows is to just buy a glass breaker punch. Theyre very cheap, but very loud.

-A gun, obviously. It might make things easier, but in this scenario it would likely be your concealed carry piece and thus not something you'd want to bring to a sustained firefight or chaotic situation with panicked people being mismanaged by overwhelmed local police. If order breaks down in the way this example is presuming, gunshots would draw lots of unwanted attention you'd be unequipped to effectively deal with.

-A sharp boxknife or just a plain old sharp knife. This is for cutting the duct tape and paracord, opening boxes, cutting clothing off injured people, cutting things for makeshift bandages or bandanas, and other general cutting tasks. Also works as a last resort self defense weapon or silent wetwork if it actually comes down to that.


d73f61  No.644607

File: 11388d8e700d43e⋯.jpg (9.67 KB, 500x500, 1:1, 10-312_Sharp-500x500.jpg)

File: 77be11a40bb048d⋯.jpg (105.86 KB, 526x1000, 263:500, 152029_2.jpg)

File: 3498cfef3ed6e36⋯.jpg (101.07 KB, 1154x1154, 1:1, 207251_ts.jpg)

File: 652c0c63f905a79⋯.png (99.36 KB, 746x512, 373:256, 2fgddzmaqgj11.png)

>>644597

>>644598

>>644599

>>644600

>>644601

>>644603

-Paracord. Several dozen feet should be enough, just make sure it has a high weight rating. You can tie it to your pack, climb something, then pull your gear up. You can hang yourself if that veterinarian refused to fix your broken leg. You can tie people up. You can tie doors shut if you already used up your bike lock. You can tie it through the hole in your wrench's handle so you don't drop it while running or climbing. Alternatively, tie it to your wrench and wield it like a flail.

-A good stainless steel water bottle. I usually carry two full 40oz steel canteens in my personal bag when i go to a jobsite. 8-10 hours of labor later, I've drank the first one and am about a third through the second one. In suburbia, I'd throw some water purification tablets in my bug out bag and ideally plan to refill the canteens at garden hoses or park fountains as need and opportunity arises. In an urban environment, water purification tablets and public fountains might be a good bet. Or breaking into fast food restaurants and refilling at the water station there.

Ideally you'd be out of the area and back home before water shortages become and issue.

But above all, remember to have fun out there.

The real bug out bag is the friends we make along the way.

>6/[done]


5fb0af  No.644687

Invidious embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>636514

90% of doors you come across are much easier/faster to open with standardized maintenance keys or sliding something thin along the bolt for improperly installed doors. You can carry lockpicks too but they shouldn't be your main priority. Embed for more.


ec1a72  No.644701

File: 5321841420f6daa⋯.gif (160.13 KB, 800x450, 16:9, 5321841420f6daae442b227a6b….gif)

>>644600

If you want pills that actually fucking keep you awake and aren't going to make you piss out everything since caffeine is a diuretic, a bottle or two of 2mg and 4mg nicotine lozenges (or patches) would take up about the same amount of space. It would be 10x more expensive and you'd get half the count unless you combine bottles, but as someone who's borderline narcoleptic at work, I can assure you that nicotine is actually effective at giving you that immediate alertness that lasts a couple hours whereas caffeine pills will just make you shit/piss everything out.

If still insistent on caffeine as your stimulant of choice (it's just as addictive as nicotine so don't play the >"muh addiction" card), I advise getting a few packs of caffeinated gum, preferably the "military variety" sold on Amazon (the cinnamon one doesn't taste like cinnamon, fair warning). It comes out to like $0.20/piece, but your gums absorb caffeine 20x faster than your stomach, so the same 100mg will kick in within five minutes instead of an hour, and you won't get the diuretic effects as much as from digestion/that 100mg will go a lot further than some pills.


c2efac  No.644756

>>644701

Just a thought for you, from an adult sucking on a technopenis nicotine delivery device. Buy some vape fluid. 120 ML of 9-12mg nicotine will run about 30 bucks. You can find higher nicotine content in juices ment for RDAs, highest I've seen was 22mg.


a0f17b  No.644757

>>644756

I only use nicotine when absolutely necessary to get through my days, otherwise I'd consider it. In terms of bug-out bags, fluids are much more "dangerous" to keep on hand than solids.


47acd6  No.644778

>>644701

>but as someone who's borderline narcoleptic at work

Does anyone else have that problem? I've always been extremely prone to falling asleep if I'm not busy. I've had days with 14 hours of physical labor where I get home and don't feel a thing, and I have days where I'm in an office chair either forcing my eyes open or catching quiet ZZZs between 2-3PM. Am I just lazy or undisciplined?


a0f17b  No.644779

>>644778

I think it's just the natural human sleep schedule- when our needs are met, our bodies want to sleep if we aren't actively busy in order to preserve energy. I have the same problem, though for me it hits about an hour later.


47acd6  No.644780

>>644779

It's probably that. My body is just trying to maximize what I get out of downtime. But how do you counter it without stimulants? Pushups every 30 minutes?

>yeah you don't seem to be doing anything important at that computer, it's naptime

>yeah you stopped eating fatty foods, I guess I'm going to store every piece of fat I can since the supply is dropping

Thankfully keto fixed the second one for me.


3e2092  No.644840

>>644531

It is dangerous, but you do not need an empty wagon to ride a freight train, just need a grain hopper style one that has a cubby hole you can cram yourself into. Also; shift changes occur often between loading yards and are great times to hop on or off.

I agree a bicycle is a great mode of transport, I would prefer gravel/cx over mountain because I like the drop bars and slim tires.


24fc75  No.644889

>>644529

>If freight trains shut down, then half of the country will starve within three weeks anyway. Most of the food being delivered to the US west coast relies on only two rail shipping lines.

Purely out of scientific curiosity, which two rail lines are these? Could one hypothetically find maps of these two lines, and perhaps locate some choke-points?


01d6d5  No.644930

File: 03e1bdaf0eb0cae⋯.png (187.13 KB, 500x500, 1:1, ClipboardImage.png)

>>644599

QuikClot granulates can be washed out in heavy bleeding. Celox Rapid much better


ace23e  No.645145

>>644889

>Purely out of scientific curiosity, which two rail lines are these? Could one hypothetically find maps of these two lines, and perhaps locate some choke-points?

Burlington Northern and Santa Fe Railway (BNSF) and Union Pacific are the two. Their whole lines are a gigantic, country-wide, chokepoint.

Anyway, it's NOT top secret information, and shutting down a freight line is not something some lone sod on the internet can do either.

We're only talking about economic or natural disasters if we're talking about train shipping lines being disabled; they've got effective contingency plans against terrorist attacks, but not against stuff like earthquakes, floods, volcanic eruptions, etc. And they have ZERO protection against worker strikes, economic collapse, or just simple bankruptcy.

The point I was making about food is that trucking heavy, high-volume and low-value goods long-distances just isn't profitable, so it's entirely dependant on railways for economically-viable cross-country shipping. This has fun and unexpected effects, such as, if Union Pacific and BNSF suddenly went out of business, probably owing to mismanagement or some kind of hedge fund shenanigans, then we'd all starve.

Propping up a new railway consortium to pick up the slack would take longer than the time necessary to deplete store inventories, because warehouses are pretty much no longer a thing these last couple decades.


cf7c07  No.645155

>>645145

>Burlington Northern and Santa Fe Railway (BNSF) and Union Pacific are the two.

West of the Mississippi they're the big boys, yeah, but even limiting ourselves to the Class 1s you're forgetting the Chessie&Seaboard, Norfolk Southern, and the Kansas City Southern, plus the lines that the Canadian Pacific, Canadian National, and Ferromex operate in the continental united states.

>Their whole lines are a gigantic, country-wide, chokepoint.

You understand that, even when considering a single corridor like Seattle to Chicago, and even confining yourself to the network of a single railroad, there's still more than one way to get from point A to point B, right? And railroads share crews, equipment (see: TTX), and right-of-way all the time, if taking a detour through another company's territory is what they need to to get trains moving, they make the call and get it done. The operations of these railroads are a whole lot more interconnected than you realize or give them credit for.

> if Union Pacific and BNSF suddenly went out of business

Because when a company goes bankrupt, all of their assets vanish into thin air, right? It's not like there aren't a dozen or so regional railroads that wouldn't love to grab a bigger piece of the pie.




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