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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

A collective of people engaged in pretty much what the name suggests

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/caco/ - Azarath Metrion Zinthos

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File: caf7e16f45ffb8b⋯.png (51.82 KB, 260x279, 260:279, 1522168186278.png)


Comrades, my friends are fucking anti-feminists and want to convert dem to anarcho-communism. Any tips n tricks for dis?

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File: 353fcea4400db02⋯.jpg (65.06 KB, 609x586, 609:586, feminist_imperialism_drone….jpg)


It, is, as it is not a contradiction with capitalism - unlike proletarian revolution.



Fucking read this: printage.wordpress.com/2011/08/04/friedrich-engels-theory-of-the-origins-of-patriarchy

A communist has to be a feminist.



>x does not contradict captialism

>therefore x is imperialist




To summarise: patriarchy arose when private property arose, so with the abolishing of private property, patriarchy has to be abolished too.



You do sound like a trot: that because Engels said in Principles of Communism that a revolution has to be global, so it HAS to be global. But people like you don't want to investigate into what conditions Marx and Engels had in mind when they made the statement, and what conditions do we find ourselves in.

File: dbd59649cd56247⋯.jpg (84 KB, 1280x720, 16:9, zizekpeterson.jpg)


Now that the dust is starting to settle, what do you think we should do to capitalize on this debate?

Here are my impressions of how various people are viewing it:

>Peterson got BTFO by Zizek who showed the audience how intellectually unprepared Peterson was to talk about the topics

This view is prominent among the leftist circles on Youtube, especially clearly seen in the comments section of Muke's video of the debate.

>it wasn't a debate, it was a civil discussion between two intellectuals who agree a lot with each other

I can see this in the comments section of the most popular video of the debate. I think this is how most regular people are framing the debate.

>this "debate" was a disgrace and the "intellectuals" who participated in it should be ashamed of themselves

I've seen a couple of articles describing the debate this way. I think they're correct but I don't think they know that Zizek fully intended never to debate in an academic manner, instead opting to win over Peterson's fans through SLICK ENTRYISM. I think Zizek pulled this off masterfully (which shocked me, he was more coherent than usual and completely controlled the debate).

How should leftists on Youtube approach this in order to win over people and get them interested in leftist thought? Of course there's the angle of showing how much Peterson is a hack and how he badly he did in the debate but there's another angle to consider.

Take that moment in the debate when Peterson was listening to Zizek as if he's fascinated by him. That I think is representative of some of Peterson's fans who just got introduced to Zizek who was expecting someone else entirely, probably some caricature of a marxist. If we play our cards right and approach in a friendly manner, showing how much we hate the idpol obsessed SJWs and how they're not representative of our side I think we have a good chance of winning people over.

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I think Zizek really ingratiated himself to JP fans and made JP look retarded. The consequence (probably intended) is likely going to be a bunch of JP fans turning Asserite.


File: 4de5cadaaa7509d⋯.mp4 (4.82 MB, 1280x720, 16:9, the Zizek VS Peterson deba….mp4)



This is a discussion of the debate from the "rational skeptic" side of Youtube.

I remember Friended from the second Jack Angstreich vs The Academic Agent debate. It's a good debate if you haven't watched it but only the first part is up (because TAA deleted the second part the sneaky bastard). A completely different style from Zizek where the marxist absolutely clinically dismantles the anti-marxist.



Has Jack Angstreich done anything else other than that debate? I would definitely watch his YT channel if he made videos


Rightists embrace post-modernism as their rightful ideological clay (remember that Jacobin article). A whole new wave of "NazBols" read up on Zizek, Foucault, Baudrillard.

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/br/ - Brazil Thread - Never lose your faith edition

Loyal to our shitposting tradition, we probably already made it through more than 3000 posts spanning several Brazilian Threads. Here's to many more!

Fio anterior:


Lembrando do nosso board, que algum dia será muito movimentado:


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Ah sim, a previsão de crescimento do PIB, que começou o ano perto de 3%, já caiu pra 1,71%.

E vocês provavelmente já devem estar sabendo que o governo decretou sigilo sobre os cálculos do famigerado trilhão da reforma, se é que eles existem. E vale lembrar que só os milicos ganharam aumento.


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Rapaz do céu, está um dramalhão no circo. OLAVO fez um vídeo falando as asneiras dele de sempre, mas dizendo que as forças armadas não fazem nada, criaram o comunismo, Mourão é um FDP e o caralho a quatro. E o Carlito espalhou pelas contas presidenciais! E depois apagou! O cara é líder da oposição.

Aliás, a nova fase dele durou 18 horas, e logo depois, voltou pro Twitter.

Dizem as más línguas (ou seja, a grande mídia) que o próprio Bolsonaro está falando pros seus aliados atacarem o Mourão.


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quem não apóia esta proposta é inimigo do povo



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Primeira pica, reforma sendo aprovada. Segunda pica, mostra que a compra já estava sendo paga a prazo desde fevereiro. Terceira pica, nada de novo. Quarto, já veterano de golpes, Moro prapara-se pro terceiro e pra pedir música no Fantástico. Quinto, secretário de desestatização comprova que Brasil inventou mais uma sandice política: decretou sigilo sobre vento

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I just wanted to bring this old thread back.

75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75 75

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File: 44f069788e57b73⋯.mp4 (7.91 MB, 640x360, 16:9, Assad speech War is Not Ov….mp4)





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Bump from the dead.


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File: a10c5949fc143e7⋯.png (279.55 KB, 960x893, 960:893, ClipboardImage.png)


>Let us now picture to ourselves, by way of change, a community of free individuals, carrying on their work with the means of production in common, in which the labour power of all the different individuals is consciously applied as the combined labour power of the community. All the characteristics of Robinson’s labour are here repeated, but with this difference, that they are social, instead of individual. Everything produced by him was exclusively the result of his own personal labour, and therefore simply an object of use for himself. The total product of our community is a social product. One portion serves as fresh means of production and remains social. But another portion is consumed by the members as means of subsistence. A distribution of this portion amongst them is consequently necessary. The mode of this distribution will vary with the productive organisation of the community, and the degree of historical development attained by the producers. We will assume, but merely for the sake of a parallel with the production of commodities, that the share of each individual producer in the means of subsistence is determined by his labour time. Labour time would, in that case, play a double part. Its apportionment in accordance with a definite social plan maintains the proper proportion between the different kinds of work to be done and the various wants of the community. On the other hand, it also serves as a measure of the portion of the common labour borne by each individual, and of his share in the part of the total product destined for individual consumption. The social relations of the individual producers, with regard both to their labour and to its products, are in this case perfectly simple and intelligible, and that with regard not only to production but also to distribution.

Here, in the first chapter of Capital volume 1, Marx is clearly talking about communism - "a community of free individuals, carrying on their work with the means of production in common, in which the labour power of all the different individuals is consciously applied as the combined labour power of the community." What I find interesting is this:

>Labour time would, in that case, play a double part. Its apportionment in accordance with a definite social plan maintains the proper proportion between the different kinds of work to be done and tPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

1 post omitted. Click reply to view.



>So what, then, does "to each according to his needs" mean? If not free distribution

It does mean free distribution.

From CotGP, like one paragraph after the one you referenced:

>In a higher phase of communist society, after the enslaving subordination of the individual to the division of labor, and therewith also the antithesis between mental and physical labor, has vanished; after labor has become not only a means of life but life's prime want; after the productive forces have also increased with the all-around development of the individual, and all the springs of co-operative wealth flow more abundantly – only then then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be crossed in its entirety and society inscribe on its banners: From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs!


read the whole thing



What Marx was talking about in the first chapter of Capital Volume 1 is lower stage communism. This makes a lot more sense if you also take the Critique of the Gotha Program into account.

>Here, [in lower stage communism] obviously, the same principle prevails as that which regulates the exchange of commodities, as far as this is exchange of equal values. Content and form are changed, because under the altered circumstances no one can give anything except his labor, and because, on the other hand, nothing can pass to the ownership of individuals, except individual means of consumption. But as far as the distribution of the latter among the individual producers is concerned, the same principle prevails as in the exchange of commodity equivalents: a given amount of labor in one form is exchanged for an equal amount of labor in another form.

>But these defects are inevitable in the first phase of communist society as it is when it has just emerged after prolonged birth pangs from capitalist society. Right can never be higher than the economic structure of society and its cultural development conditioned thereby.

>In a higher phase of communist society, after the enslaving subordination of the individual to the division of labor, and therewith also the antithesis between mental and physical labor, has vanished; after labor has become not only a means of life but life's prime want; after the productive forces have also increased with the all-around development of the individual, and all the springs of co-operative wealth flow more abundantly – only then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be crossed in its entirety and society inscribe on its banners: From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs!

So in other words, within lower stage communism, products are distributed based on labor time. While in the higher stage, communism operates according to free distribution. After Marx's death, people began to use "socialism" as a shorthand for lower stage communism and "communism" as a shorthand for higher stage communism.





Late reply, but fair points. Reading back through everything after the initial "huh, idea" moment wore off, free distribution does seem to be the implication. I did a little digging in the meantime and found this in Anti-Duehring as well:

>Secondly, with Owen the labour-notes are only a transitional form to complete community and free utilisation of the resources of society; and incidentally at most also a means designed to make communism plausible to the British public.

Think I'll bring the question up with Cockshott next time he uploads a video, if I remember to. Be interesting to hear his reasoning for keeping labour credits into full communism; I think he justified it on grounds of practical planning in one of his videos, but I don't remember.


I think this is an interesting theory OP, it does seem that even in full communism there has to be some kind of protection against someone ordering 1000 superyachts just because they can, it seems to me that labour vouchers would always have to exist in some sense for goods that are necessarily limited (maybe not digital, public transport etc).

File: f3c988b8fe0cacc⋯.jpg (92.59 KB, 630x429, 210:143, free market.jpg)


>Orangutans face complete extinction within 10 years, animal rescue charity warns

>Burning forests to make way for plantations to support the world's insatiable demand for palm oil is one of the main causes of the astonishing decline in numbers of this species


>We produce enough food to feed 10 billion people. So why does hunger still exist?


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Mental determinism will be required for basic compatibility.



In a lot of cases I'd agree, but these are hominids. They're like our cousins.


>It will not be able to transition to sustainable societies even if it wanted to, which it, like all life, fundamentally does not want to do.

Pretentious asswankery.

>The current age is an unprecedented era of death in this planet's history. Most people are unaware of this, because they are so far removed from the natural world

Bollocks. Everyone is aware of mass extinction. It's common knowledge. At most they lack the historical perspective to see the radical implications.


FUCK boons to society





>In a lot of cases I'd agree, but these are hominids. They're like our cousins.

It seems like the opposite.. Apes are in the uncanny valley. Big Cats, Elephants, Wolves, etc. All seem like cool animals that I wouldn’t want going extinct. But Apes, they seem like a failed human that should be euthanized for their own good.


File: f9c894806a592de⋯.jpeg (74.13 KB, 582x626, 291:313, 593df2d19295d.jpeg)


Fuck apes


>Orangutans are basically humans




File: b759e1fdc9550dd⋯.jpg (63.9 KB, 474x355, 474:355, garden.jpg)


Having all or most necessary resources (food, water and electricity) provided within a small distance is a policy that all socialist societies should support. This could be achieved through solar panels, rain collectors, food gardens in every neighborhood, and small urban gardens in apartments. The advantages of this policy are clear and numerous. A self-sufficient socialist country (or any country) would find it much easier to defend itself than one with centralized food and energy production as there is no single place for an enemy to strike, meaning that attempts at counter-revolution would be less successful.

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File: cb0fa17eba16457⋯.jpg (19.87 KB, 500x500, 1:1, dog l.jpg)


>scale back urbanization so that cities aren't so dense

oh shit dude what are you doing

more uniform distribution of farmland to residential area isn't what we need at all, you want economy of scale gains for both

suburbs, small scale agriculture, artisanal production etc. are a blight, more dense urbanism and improved industrial agriculture would actually leave space for wilderness again



>more dense urbanism

You want to make people commute even longer?



>you want economy of scale gains for both

you really don't

the nature of scaled agriculture is not sustainable what you want is pretty much what op said and more uniform distribution f farmland to res would help a lot with that

if res/urban was crossed with agriculture you would increase air quality, reduce pollution, reduce traffic, lower transportation costs, reduce oil consumption. improve health, and really its like you ignored everything he said about monocropping and native species it seems like you don't really know what your talking about.

theres also a huge amount of water wasted growing specific varieties that have good shelf life and transportability local farms would increase diversity of produce available and most of these varieties are geared around a reductionist part in a machine fertilizing practices that don't take the system into account. monocropping with bare soil is seriously dumb as shit.

there are better species that are more nutritious with lower shelf lifes that require less water and self fertilize for example



You don't have to make urban areas any more dense per se to get better economy of scale. I don't think you really get what these words mean, tbhfam. You could have bigger cities that are more spread out than a typical urban center.



>thinking cars would be used in socialism of the 21st century and not maglev + tramway + subway + bullet train + monorail + bicycls + walking in super dense cities

Anon I…

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this is why the libertarian party is such a fucking joke

no talking points, they just spew nonsensical ideology that has no relevance to modern society

on the other hand they make up 17~23% of the voter base, so why is it that they have literally zero official libertarians in office?

4 posts omitted. Click reply to view.


libertarians who associate with the libertarian party are the most autistic libertarians in my experience


The Libertarian Party is the most White party in existence.


Cantwell is right though, you need to be prepared to shoot mailmen if you don't want Fascism.


Because they are idealists who spout platitudes like "good ideas don't require force" without a hint of understanding why that's pants-on-head retarded.



But I like my mailman.



Fucking Fascist

File: 74748e2301553e4⋯.webm (4.89 MB, 1280x720, 16:9, capitalism_rocks.webm)


Sorry losers, the price mechanism wins. If you disagree, you're a luddite.


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You can't just remove one piece from the puzzle and assume its the same picture. This would be obvious to you if submitted to you that, for example, if it hadn't been for the Third Reich, the 22,000 soviet tanks would have plowed over all of Europe and the Iron Curtain would've been the Atlantic Ocean.




Excuse me, that's just what they produced up to the start of the war. It was ~60,000 tanks in total. Where are the monuments to Hitler for preventing the enslavement of all of Europe?




Fuck this bullshit and fuck you. The fact that everything the US did in the middle east and Libya was economical reason wasn't the fault of capitalism, but the US government. But for some fucking reason, everything the USSR did is communism and therefore it's the fault of communism. I never understood this fucking retarded logic.

You don't actually care (neither am I) that how many people died in either side, you just use the death toll as an excuse to hate USSR and/or communism. It's nothing more than a moral deathmatch game. This is the reason why nobody takes "muh death toll" seriously in this board.

Seriously, fuck you.


File: 1307b75320672bb⋯.jpg (40.01 KB, 373x521, 373:521, really.jpg)


>being this triggered

Another libtard destroyed with facts and logic.


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File: 0522d9750651626⋯.jpg (686.12 KB, 1242x1119, 414:373, marx.jpg)


After hearing the Zizek-Peterson debate I've realized that 99% of arguments against Marxism from right wingers today are based on their own assumptions and misinterpretations and on shit they heard from other anticommunists. Peterson did all this and openly declared he had only read the Commiefesto (how is he even considered an intellectual?). So, how do we fix this? Is there a point in debating others anymore?

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just tell us

im more interested in schizoanalysis



After what? Remember that the text was made in 1848 made for the conditions of 1848. Second, that these ten planks turned me off of marxism as a libertarian minded person when like half of it is just centeralization of the state into industries and stuff, not workers direct control over those industies through positive and negative feedback from output of production. Sure, centeralization would help with establishing efficient information of these outputs and inputs for the optimal plan but I wouldn't know that if I just read the Manifesto. I probably wouldn't be a Marxist today if I've read the Manifesto before reading Marx's other works.


File: 4bc7befdbe0a3e6⋯.jpg (41.59 KB, 435x262, 435:262, oof.jpg)

>99% of arguments against Marxism from right wingers today are based on their own assumptions and misinterpretations and on shit they heard from other anticommunists

<99% of arguments against Fascism from left wingers today are based on their own assumptions and misinterpretations and on shit they heard from other antifascists

Also, generalizing with broad strokes involves the same exact logic as racism. If you're actually "lefty" (unless that no longer includes being for or against race realism) then you should probably think twice before typing before you make this board look clinically retarded.



Gotta love PJ's critique. Just about every argument against socialism and in favor of capitalism is a logical fallacy.

Its pretty silly to me that he doesn't identify as a socialist, even though hes in favor of a planned economy where the means of productions are held in common. He also thinks the soviet union was state capitalist, even though they abolished private property and had a planned economy.


It's not about getting insta-conversions, it's about planting a seed. Maybe they'll ignore it for a while, but if ever they think to themselves, maybe after a really shitty week at work, "man, fuck capitalism." maybe then they'll remember a sneaky bit of Marxian text that stuck to their minds.

File: c000b75c0a00cf6⋯.jpg (26.51 KB, 550x550, 1:1, Trot.jpg)


This was the most evil man in history and if you know history, you know why.

You know why that is?

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Eh, I thought his writing was OK.

Some of his theory seems kind of shit tho




what does this mean?



>this description of permanent revolution

It really can't be this simple can it? I mean it makes sense but is there a critique of this anywhere?



Refers to Thermidor reaction against Robespierre. Thermidorian basically means reactionary against the more radical ideas of a revolution, that ultimately leads to its death



No worries that's my bad, thanks for the info. I did presume to know too much about it in my original post.

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only e.g I can think of are the Naxalites and they seem to be of nuance then an actual threat

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Not if right-wing niggers get their way.



>Once we are gone it will collapse into a communist

Go and die then.



There were anon. Read abt the 1968 movement in Pakistan. Also Pakistan elected a weird islamic socialist(Bhutto) in the 70s but he was deposed by a US backed islamist general and his nationalization policies arguably wrecked the countries’ economy. Zia class-cucked all of Pakistan and its been a reactionary hellhole ever since. The Pakistan People’s Party is currently hated because their most recent regime was a fucking hell to live through, and they took power after another literal military dictatorship. RN tho there are increasing leftist sentiments within the youth but its all bougie radlibbery and nothing that’ll develop class consciousness or actually help the working class.



not sufficiently proletarianized?


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Is he /ourcomrade/ or too bourgeois? I’ve seen his debates with Jesse Lee Peterson, Ann Coulter, Nick Fuentes, Charlie Kirk etc and he seems to know his shit. All 4 of those Nazi losers got exposed for what they are. Not even going to mention Sargon and his pathetic “individualism”, what with that posh accent of his. Fuck him.

But anyway back to Hasan.

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pretty much this.

He sucks at debates though.



>Destiny is a pedophile

No….that's a stupid right-winger meme

Honestly, he's probably about as left as Jimmy Dore at this point, and basically social democrat.

He's a shitty reformist, but he's also soooo close to getting it sometimes.

If the pressure on him keeps up he'll be a market socialist within a year…..probably.

vid related




he goes pretty hard even when on tyt

ive seen some clips of him on twitch advocating for landlord genocide and saying free healthcare on the back of the third world is not enough. like others have said hes light on theory but his heart is in the right place.




why would someone tall, fit, and stylish remind you of stalin?

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Theresa May told to resign as prime minister in 'a matter of days'

Backbench Conservative MPs will meet on Tuesday afternoon to discuss plans to force Theresa May out as prime minister "within a matter of days," as anger over her decision to delay Brexit boils over.


New police crackdown in France as Macron to announce further austerity cuts

As French President Emmanuel Macron is set to announce new social attacks on the working class in a speech on Thursday, the government is stepping up its police crackdown against social opposition and “yellow vest” protesters opposing social inequality.


Silent and powerful: Nuclear underwater drone carrier set afloat – Russian MoD

The Russian Navy’s largest submarine designed to operate nuclear-tipped underwater drones, considered by experts to be a “retaliatory weapon,” was set afloat in Russia’s White Sea, according to the Ministry of Defense.


Netanyahu calls for new Golan settlement named for Trump

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says he wants to name a new settlement in the Golan Heights after President Donald Trump out of gratitude for the White House’s recognition of Israeli sovereignty over the territory.

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/04/23/netanyahu-golan-settlement-trump-128765Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

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File: 682e474ff4466a2⋯.png (378.12 KB, 552x665, 552:665, 682e474ff4466a2dbd80660262….png)

>Netanyahu calls for new Golan settlement named for Trump


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>Lyra McKee killing: 'New IRA' admits responsibility

>The New IRA has admitted responsibility for the murder of journalist Lyra McKee, according to the Irish News.In a statement given to the paper the group offered "full and sincere apologies" to her family and friends.






Can't wait when Syrian and Hezbollah troops reclaim the Trump settlement

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What's the /leftypol/ stance of Khorloogiin Choibalsan, the famous "Mongolian Stalin". Is there stuff I can learn about him?

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I don't get it



I still don't get the joke



you deserve love



Thank you




He was implying Stalin was Mongolian, probably something relating to Russians/Georgians being Mongol rape babies.

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