/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>608854

>The only sustainable model is democratic libertarian (not LOLbertarian) socialism.

Explain your reasoning, then.

>Revolution or democratic election ultimately doesn't matter and probably varies by country, the most important thing is that you try it.

How do we get Porky to willingly give up xir power/capital through the democratic process?

>>608854

Wrong. The truth is, there is no stable government system. Everything eventually fails. There is no escape.

>>608854

The sectarianism on this board has to stop. We are all workers united!

>>608858

It's simple. Anarchy is just asking for things to devolve into chaos or evolve back into order. When there's nothing to ensure that nobody decides to overthrow the system, there's nothing to fight the overthrowing. There's nothing to encourage people to share things but common culture and if someone decides not to nobody's going to stop him except a community, but what if he's the local weapons producer? What if he's only affecting a handful of people and nobody else cares? People don't usually stand up for each other.

The problems with mutualism have been explained plenty of times over and over again and even on Wikipedia. Nihilism is shit because it recognizes but does not consider the impact of Nietzche's breakthroughs regarding discovering your own meaning in life. Paradoxically, this means life really does have meaning- pursuing your own meaning and allowing others to pursue their own meaning.

I hate to borrow Stirner's language here, but power is ultimately a spook that is a little bit more real than other spooks because it manifests when it is believed in. Take America. Say Bernie Sanders is democratically elected to the presidency but the vote counters are told to count the votes incorrectly. All they have to do is defy this order and Bernie Sanders wins. Suppose once he's there people try to block everything he does. Nothing he does passes, because the Democratic senators and representatives we elected to ensure Bernie Sanders' motions passed allowed themselves to be paid off by corporations. Ultimately this will piss people off and the threat of being replaced or deposed entirely will encourage these Congressmen to step back in line, or a revolution happens, one of the two. Once people start to revolt, no matter how harshly it gets crushed, the seeds of revolt have already been sown. There has not been a single major revolt that wasn't either successful or followed by a successful revolt. Unrest doesn't rest. Worst case scenario is a military coupe of revolt or Sanders-presidency government, which would eventually be overthrown. History always looks up.

Porky isn't as strong as you think he is. Remember nobody stopped FDR. Besides, end goal is direct democracy where all Porky can do is shill and lie, which is much less effective than bribes. We are already so close to that goal that Porky has been defeated entirely in Switzerland.

>>608866

Stablest. As in, more stable than capitalism, whereas these systems are far less stable than capitalism.

>>608881

This too.

>>608884

(Believe it or not) Some of this too.

>sectarianism: the post

>>609020

In the end banter doesn't hurt anything. Besides if we ever do Directx we need to get this shit sorted out.

>>608886

very few things in this block make any sense.

> people don't usually stand up for each other

you're forgetting that if we ever reach an anarchist state, society would be structured and people would behave much differently than they currently do. people are also programmed to protect their own, and if they survive because of their community, they are invested in protecting everyone in that community.

>say bernie sanders is democratically elected

>vote counters are told to count the votes incorrectly

>all they have to do is defy this order and bernie wins

what exactly is your point here? and what would be the motivation for government employees to deny this order when hundreds of years of precedent indicates that they will listen to the orders that come from above them?

>there has not been a single major revolt that wasn't either successful or followed up by a successful revolt

this is a very general and highly subjective statement but is wrong, no matter how you interpret it. how are you defining major? I would say there have been dozens of global revolts that have failed, more often insurgencies fail than succeed.

>unrest doesn't rest

are you really suggesting this? by this logic, movements would never die out. How many times have social movements just dissipated because either enough concessions were granted to reduce the outrage (civil rights movement, farm workers movement) or because they were met with no success (Vietnam war protests). There may always be signs of unrest but most people are disillusioned enough that movements just become fads.

>remember nobody stopped FDR

this is the biggest thing i have a problem with. FDR was ONLY allowed to pass his reforms because he had the support of capital. Financial institutions realized that if they invested in society and raised the standard of living, more people would have money to spend and they could rake in more profits. This was an incredible success, FDR was in collusion with porky the whole time. This isn't to say his reforms weren't productive, but they were sanctioned by those who benefited most from it (capital). Seriously m8, read a book

>porky defeated entirely in Switzerland

Switzerland is a haven for large corporations who evade taxes. They stash billions of dollars in profits and get away without having to pay taxes in the countries the profits are made in

Get the fuck off the internet and read a book

>>609049

Ask yourself. It'll be different for you than it is for me. That's the point.

>>609053

>>609059

As far as native influence in politics and corruption, yes.

>>609060

Little problems turn into big problems too. Say someone kills someone else and when the mob comes in he says it was in self defense. Nobody was around to see and nobody has the heart to make the possible mistake of killing him if he's right. So they let him off. And he moves, and does it again. And again. And again. And nobody would ever catch him because nothing would be organized enough to detect a pattern.

My point was that nobody has to obey Porky because all Porky can control is what they can carry and our minds. If we don't give them our minds they are almost powerless. If Bernie's message is one of power to the people the vote counters are going to be more likely to ignore the rig attempt. Hell, rigs hardly even get tried in a country with free press because it's so easy to have it just be something to make you look bad, soon enough Bernie's become a martyr for the cause.

I'm defining "major" as "gained any traction at all before being crushed". And I'm really just going off a way of seeing things than a fact. If you could prove me wrong, per se, I'd just say that its follow-up is waiting to happen.

Unrest doesn't go away, it just gets converted into background tension to be used the next time people get upset.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass%E2%80%93Steagall_Legislation

Yeah, the banks really ran away on that one.

Switzerland is popular with private corporations, that much is true. But do you see them fucking over the workers? They are some of the most well treated. My understanding is there is heavy regulation.

>>608854

Read a book

>>609224

> For another timeless interval, AC thought how best to do this. Carefully, AC organized the program.

> The consciousness of AC encompassed all of what had once been a Universe and brooded over what was now Chaos. Step by step, it must be done.

> And AC said, "Want to make a Contract? ／人◕ ‿‿ ◕人＼"

>>608854

This is so stupid that I am forced to assume you're a Stirnermemer false-flagging.

>>609233

Nope.

wew

>>608886

read about something before you make any judgement, dumbo

>>608886

>We are already so close to that goal that Porky has been defeated entirely in Switzerland.

I've had lolberts use Switzerland as an example of a state with libertarian aspects.

Hello edgy OP. Care to actually contribute to the board or do you want to shit it up some more with posts that don't explain anything and just claim bullshit like "my position X is best"?

If not, may I suggest

>>>/gulag/

>>611719

Joining me for the tripfag revolution?

Daily reminder that culture is a spook.

>>611738

See my other posts.

>>611720

I've seen that too. They're going off of the fact it has a decentralized government, no attempts to redistribute wealth and no free healthcare. I assure you though that besides that they are Porky-free. They just happen to be fiscally conservative.

>>611634

About what?

>>610458

>FDR

>porky

He wasn't perfect but wew

>>611719

Do you mean me calling "communist" systems that aren't anarchist communist being cogdis? I agree that they aren't communist. That's why I said they're especially shit.

I'm only going off of what other, often leftist, experts have said when I say these things and my own intuition.

Almost entirely, anyhow.

Yeah, Switzerland is about as far away from "socialist" as we are. But they are very populist and well-regulated and that's a step.