/mahjong/ - Mahjong

>>110

Defensive strength basically goes:

Waits that would put them in furiten, so anything they've already discarded and anything discarded after them but before their next turn can be considered safe. Furthermore, if they've declared riichi, anything discarded by other players from that point is almost always safe.

For honors, or if you know they're going for a pair or double pair wait, any tile that 3 have been discarded of is safe.

For honors in general, guest winds are safer than round/seat winds and dragons. Yakuhai that you can see less than 2 of are particularly unsafe, yakuhai that you can see 2 of are a little safer, and if you can see 3, the only time it'd be unsafe is kokushi, but that's very easy to rule out if you can see four of one tile anywhere.

Then there's suji and kabe; suji, which is the 1-4-7, 2-5-8, 3-6-9 stuff, and kabe which tells you if say, all four 3-pin have been discarded, they can't be waiting on any set which includes a 3-pin, i.e. [1]-2-3p, 1-[2]-3p, 1-2-[3]p, [2]-3-4p, 2-[3]-4p, 2-3-[4]p, [3]-4-5p, 3-[4]-5p or 3-4-[5]p, though a [1]-1p, [1]-1-1p, [2]-2p or [2]-2-2p wait could still be possible.

The initial dora is also particularly unsafe, followed by fives that you can't see the akadora of.

Discards close to the tile they discard when calling riichi are also less safe, the reason being is if they're trying to complete a sequence to enter tenpai, for example a hand such as: XXX-XXX-XXX-3-4-6-7, there's a large number of draws that will make their discard the tile right next to, or very close to their wait in tenpai. The furthest their wait could be from their discard is a wait on a 2 or a 5 if they draw a 6 and discard the 7 (or drawing a 4 and discarding the 3).

Beyond that you can use their discards to infer the kind of hand they're likely making, making certain kinds of tiles a lot safer.

Discarding mostly terminals and honors = tanyao, therefore simples are less safe

Discarding mostly honors and simples = junchan, therefore terminals are less safe

Discarding mostly simples = chanta or honroutou, therefore honors and terminals are less safe

Discarding mostly two suits = ittsu, honitsu or chinitsu, therefore the third suit is less safe (and possibly honors too)

Lastly, their called tile groups can betray their hand composition a lot, or at least reassure you that they're going for something particularly cheap. For example, if they call a sequence and a triplet of different suits, one containing a terminal and one containing no terminals, yakuhai become extremely unsafe.

There's a lot more stuff I guess but those are the basics to defense.

Theres some posts in osamuko that explain defense pretty well imo, like http://osamuko.com/umaikeiki-defense-guide-betaori-and-suji/ a bit lengthy, but it's a good read either way.

>>111 This anon explained the basic stuff really well too, along with getting a sick ankou

>>111

>if they've declared riichi, anything discarded by other players from that point is almost always safe.

It's 100% percent safe, because if they've riichi'd and pass calling ron on a winning tile they're furiten.

this Senki-, Ura- and Matagi-Suji look incredible complex and hard to learn ;_;

>>115

thank you, asian clams harvester :')

>>113

Oh, maybe I misread the rules then; I thought temporary furiten was for that turn, but I guess it's for that tile and that turn?

>>117

Riichi furiten means if you pass on a winning tile you can't ron with that hand anymore, in regular furiten you can't ron if one of your winning tiles is on your discards.

Temporary furiten comes if you get riichiless tenpai and you pass on a ron, then you can't ron until your next discard.

>>118

Oh I see, it's for riichiless tenpai only.

Reading discards is something you shouldn't bother to try doing until you're at a certain high level. Just focus on tile efficiency and basic defense, those two will take you very far.