[ / / / / / / / / ] [ b / news+ / boards ] [ operate / meta ] [ ]

/marx/ - Marxism

Catalog

Name
Email
Subject
Comment *
File
* = required field[▶ Show post options & limits]
Confused? See the FAQ.
Embed
(replaces files and can be used instead)
Options
Password (For file and post deletion.)

Allowed file types: jpg, jpeg, gif, png, webm, mp4, swf, pdf
Max filesize is 8 MB.
Max image dimensions are 10000 x 10000.
You may upload 5 per post.


File: 1413646828738.jpg (162.49 KB, 1590x637, 1590:637, 1413462767231.jpg)

 No.962

how does it feel knowing from now on nationalism and fascism is rising in europe

meanwhile all communists are just faggy manlets?

 No.964

As Marx noted, "The ideas of the ruling class are in every epoch the ruling ideas, i.e. the class which is the ruling material force of society, is at the same time its ruling intellectual force. The class which has the means of material production at its disposal, has control at the same time over the means of mental production, so that thereby, generally speaking, the ideas of those who lack the means of mental production are subject to it."

As evidence of this in the case of fascism, we can cite… Von Mises.

“Against the weapons of the Bolsheviks, weapons must be used in reprisal, and it would be a mistake to display weakness before murderers. . . . Fascism can triumph today because universal indignation at the infamies committed by the socialists and communists has obtained for it the sympathies of wide circles. . . . It cannot be denied that Fascism and similar movements aiming at the establishment of dictatorships are full of the best intentions and that their intervention has, for the moment, saved European civilization. The merit that Fascism has thereby won for itself will live on eternally in history. But though its policy has brought salvation for the moment, it is not of the kind which could promise continued success. Fascism was an emergency makeshift. To view it as something more would be a fatal error.”
(Ludwig Von Mises. Liberalism: A Socio-Economic Exposition. Kansas City, MO: Sheed Andrews and McMeel. 1978. pp. 49-51.)

In this case "European civilization" is a stand-in for capitalism. The bourgeoisie of Western Europe were often at the very least "tolerant" of fascism because of its rabidly anti-communist nature. The Baldwin government in the UK refused to react to the remilitarization of the Rhineland because he felt that a Nazi Germany that lost face would only embolden communist forces in the country.

"Not True Communism" is indeed a lame argument, but you're not likely to find it on this board anyway. That being said, it was liberty-hating Vietnam that ousted Pol Pot, while freedom-loving Reagan and Thatcher worked with semi-free China to support his struggle to regain power throughout the 80s.

As for "fail[ing] to create a prosperous society," they were often superior to capitalist societies in many ways, as their own citizens recognized afterwards. See: http://bookzz.org/book/981420/1bb275

As for "freedom," the question has to be asked: freedom for whom? Marxists note there is no such thing as "pure democracy," there is bourgeois and proletarian democracy, the former an advance on feudalism and absolutism (as Lenin noted) but a far-cry from the latter, which genuinely introduces democracy for the vast majority of the population, while repressing the tiny dwindling minority.

Saying it "created poverty" is particularly hilarious, unless you think Russia under the Tsars, China under the Kuomintang or Ethiopia under Haile Selassie were advanced societies freed from the constant threat of famine.

As for killing people, it should be noted that the October Revolution itself was pretty much bloodless. Communist movements everywhere start off peaceful, it is the bourgeoisie that represses them once they threaten to gain nationwide strength.

And when the bourgeoisie tries to overthrow the dictatorship of the proletariat, then that class dictatorship will act (in a still more just manner) similarly to the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie during the period when that class was revolutionary, back when its dictatorship was directed mainly against the resistance of feudal society.

Lenin: "The British bourgeoisie have forgotten their 1649, the French bourgeoisie have forgotten their 1793. Terror was just and legitimate when the bourgeoisie resorted to it for their own benefit against feudalism. Terror became monstrous and criminal when the workers and poor peasants dared to use it against the bourgeoisie! Terror was just and legitimate when used for the purpose of substituting one exploiting minority for another exploiting minority. Terror became monstrous and criminal when it began to be used for the purpose of overthrowing every exploiting minority, to be used in the interests of the vast actual majority, in the interests of the proletariat and semi-proletariat, the working class and the poor peasants!"

 No.965

>>962
Nationalism and communism aren't incompatible

 No.966

File: 1413652261846.jpg (110.17 KB, 720x940, 36:47, 10698452_683107885136823_3….jpg)

Of course you're going to see a rise in reaction in Europe during an economic crisis. That's because Fascism is opportunist, it needs something like an economic crisis to get people to stop thinking they are completely retarded.

Am I supposed to be impressed when you hit a mans knee and it jerks? It's predictable.

Also it's funny you say that when the Golden Dawn went and fucked itself, communists didn't even need to do shit. You guys are scared because you know you're gonna lose again and get your asses kicked like you did last time around. Fascism is a virus, the population responds accordingly.

 No.970

I'm assuming OP is going to ignore the rise of the left as well
Greece is in flames, bordering insurrection from the leftist groups, russia while just another capitalist country has taken an open stance against nationalism, mexico and south america are also developing huge leftist currents, and I may be wrong but I heard the bosnian left was getting pretty rowdy too

 No.971

Oh, can't forget the comeback of the middle eastern left, too, most notably the YPG/PKK for their construction of anti-isis militias but there are many other currents as well

 No.972

>>964

Five star post, comrade.

 No.973

Situation in greece:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ee5XED8Apao

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7L07wSZhXc

Czech antifa's breaking up nazi's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7wsaUYxDBQ

greece leftist raid on nazi party offices
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVGb1sCN5Q0#t=15

Sweedish leftists interrupt the arrest of theior comrades:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3EObohVXGM

Japanese leftists march against militarism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JZtokGgzAw

 No.976

File: 1413662350105.jpg (114.64 KB, 500x333, 500:333, GoldenDawnLeaderArrest.jpg)

>>973
I think it's funny the Fascistii ever thought Golden Dawn would make it anywhere. They are the most short-sighted Fascist party in their region, going around trying out Reich-era thuggery in modern Europe. Without a major opportunity for their propaganda they don't stand a chance in Greece. Good strategy isn't going and getting your top-ranks arrested with unorganized assassination, ya goofed.

Pic related, it's so precious

 No.978

>>976
I kinda wish the KKE and the syndicalists would take the intiative and arm themselves, they both have the support of the workers and the militancy they need.

Of course I do recognize the european situation would hardly permit it, at least we'll have a fat leftist current there in the situation of a nationalist upheaval

 No.1255

>>962
>>964
>As Marx noted, "The ideas of the ruling class are in every epoch the ruling ideas,

And how does Marxism explain the fact that the majority of the "ruling class" that exploit the workers in the USA are of Jewish descent, see:

http://thezog.info/list-summaries/

 No.1256

>>1255

Marxism calls for the liquidation of the capitalist class. If they're Jews, it's no exception.

 No.1262

Henry Ford, a firm anti-communist and friend of Nazi Germany, regularly scapegoated Jews while at the same time spying on his workers. John D. Rockefeller, J.P. Morgan, etc. weren't Jews. Bill Gates, the Koch Brothers, and other random examples of "here be rich guys" aren't Jews either.

A capitalist can be white, black, Jewish or gay, it doesn't matter. What matters is their relations to the means of production.



Delete Post [ ]
[]
[Return][Go to top][Catalog]
[ / / / / / / / / ] [ b / news+ / boards ] [ operate / meta ] [ ]