No.347626
in 2010, the US's glorious leader set to make a manned mission to mars a reality. in doing so, Obo has overlooked a relatively unimportant collision with one of Mar's moons (Phobos). the asteroid body that is believed to be the cause of the dinosaur extinction was a pale 6-7 miles wide. Phobos is double that size @ 14-15 miles across and decaying into a collision with planet mars. so one could only guess that a surface colony would be utterly destroyed during the event. which really leaves a subterranean effort as the only possible chance for a mars colony. there are actually benefits to human life being subterranean on mars versus the surface. but life on the surface is looking rather impossible.
http://news.discovery.com/space/mars-moon-phobos-is-double-doomed-151110.htm
the Massachusetts institute of technology (MIT) suggest mission failure beginning around the 70th day after landing, with the current level of planing and technology available.
but why ask why? with common sense out-the-window here, why not chose a different planet body with a greater chance of permanent human success. allow more time for space travel developments to overcome harsh radiations. and at-least give the human explorers a chance at success, rather than a death certificate.
No.347642
No.347646
There is only one man who can save us from Phobos now.
No.347647
>>347626
>almost no atmosphere
>suddenly planet is swirling in years-long cloud
Why can't that event be useful for terraforming? The only way it could get better is if the moon kicks up more water than dirt. It beats using nukes.
No.347651
This is all I saw in the article:
>. The gravity of Mars is expected to tear Phobos apart in about 100 million years.
>it's grooves are aligned like stretch marks, telltale evidence of tidal forces in the ongoing gravitational tug of war between Phobos and Mars. Phobos is losing the battle, inching closer to Mars at a rate of three- to six feet per century, Hurford told Discovery News. That gives the moon between 30 million and 50 million years before impact, but scientists doubt it’ll get that far.
>NASA and other agencies are looking at missions to Phobos as a steppingstone to human missions to Mars.
How is this a chimp out?
No.347652
No.347653
>>347651
when a planet collides with a moon… it epitomizes the word chimp-out. it could also spell disaster for life on earth. this is a major MAJOR, event.
>>347647
i can't find an upside to something like this, no way. i don't think this type of event can even be put on a calculator.
No.347654
>>347653
I don't think you grasp this so I'll explain. Scientists have already proposed detonating nukes over ice deposits to terraform Mars. The ice melts and goes up into the sky where then augments the atmosphere and becomes more like Earth. One of the issues is radiation of course. Another is energy. It would take an arsenal of nukes to make a difference. A dinosaur extinction level+ event has the energy and without the nuclear fallout. To be clear, it might be something to wait on before a colony mission, but it would be potentially a boon to terraforming either way. Make sense now?
No.347655
>>347626
Literally the only habitable areas are Mars and one or two of Jupiter's moons. Venus is a giant sulfuric gasball of death surrounding a solid core, with internal temperatures hot enough to melt steel beams.
From a profitability standpoint, Jupiter's moons would be the most efficient place to colonize by using the planet's gas pockets to heat colonies on a moon, but Mars is the closest goal we could reach as Humans at this time. If we can establish a base of operations on Mars, we could set up a "planetary highway" that would allow us to make a pit stop for six months on the red planet before continuing on to the very wealthy asteroids or even further out.
No.347660
>>347626
>it's happening
>in 30-50 million years from now
Fuck you OP.
No.347666
>>347655
i have to wonder about Titan around Saturn. it is believed to have fluid rivers of liquid methane, lakes of methane, raining methane… that has got to be an adequate, dry-cell power source. so the only rub left is the temperature Vs. the habitat. at -290 degrees Fahrenheit. steel tends to get brittle, but even with mars @ -80, both are equally fatal if exposure happens. so why not go for the fuel source???
No.347667
>>347660
whoa buddy, the moon is said to be fracturing, and scientists can't place a time table on it. ease-up pard.
No.347668
>>347666
Both are equally fatal, but Mars is much closer E.G. problems can be rectified more easily and humans will not have as much muscle atrophy.
Ideally if we can colonize mars, even if just as a star port, we can then use it as a "jumping block" in which space travelers undergo strength training on Mars in order to visit other places even further away from Earth. It's much easier to escape the Martian "atmosphere" than it is to escape Earth's atmosphere.
No.347676
Jesus is coming back this millennia so it literally doesn't matter. Waste of tax dollars.
No.347679
>>347668
the explorers are not going to be able to reverse atrophy in either case. so can the human body adapt? 2 inches gained on mars Vs. 4 gained on Titan. the radiation on titanis going to be far less harmful. and a 6 month supply chain Vs. what… 2 years. i mean both potential expeditions need to be fully self serving.
No.347684
>>347654
No it doesn't, because mars has no magnetic field.
No.347689
>>347626
The planned mars mission is not to build a colony any more than Apollo was. The first person on Mars might only have a few hours to scoop up some dust and rocks.
It is more about learning how to survive long-term in space than anything they might find on Mars.
No.347692
why even try??? we cant even supply clean water here on earth….
No.347693
>>347626
>MARS CHIMP-OUT IMMINENT!
Terraformers?
No.347696
>>347692
>hurr hurr why go to south america
>ya terminaste la reconquista en españa
>hurr
Fuck off
No.347698
The collision course has been known for a while.
The only difference now is that it's more likely to break up before it even reaches the surface of the planet
Which means Mars is getting a sick new ring system
No.347702
No.347706
>>347626
yeah lets not land people on mars because in 30 million years the sky will fall
No.347707
>>347684
I feel so stupid. I'm a grown man who actually knows what he's talking about, trying like a crazy retard to have conversations with average, angsty kids. I've wasted my whole day. Jesus I am stupid. I think I'll get a dog tomorrow and talk to it. Thanks for helping me see my folly, bud.
No.347708
>>347707
This guy gets it. Took me years to figure that out.
No.347712
without an ample fuel source, how can mars be chosen over titan. i still have to believe Titan is more promising. both planets share the same risks to atrophy, only one has fuel. that has to be the defining difference. the escape fuel for Titan would amount to compressed air? I'll bet you, if the astronauts/explorers were given a choice… you would get at-least a split decision to go for the fuel source, maybe even a unanimous decision for titan.
No.347715
>>347626
>we can get colonies on Mars
>we can't push the moon a little bit
come on guys, you're counting your hens before they've hatched
No.347718
/n/ - Martians, Crustaceans, India, Infowars and Robots
No.347719
>>347715
the worst thing about the whole mars effort would be the need of creating a stronger magnetic field, thereby increasing Mar's gravity-well. then hail to the moon god Phobos. mars is cucking dead dead dead.
No.347720
>>347684
>Mars has no magnetic field
No.347739
No.347743
Not particularly. Remember; the full Phobos deorbit would take 30-50 million years, and long before that it would fragment. Think of Phobos as a large beanbag - once the exterior is torn apart by tidal forces, tens of thousands of meteoroids will form a ring-like structure around Mars for several million years, before tidal forces eventually cause them to gradually deorbit one-by-one.
So there won't be a large cataclysmic impact. Instead, there'll be in several million years a series of many, many smaller impacts. The kinetic energy may actually transfer energy to the Martian atmosphere, causing a degree of global warming at a sustainable rate. And this also precludes the possibility of Phobos being removed long before it was due to fragment. Any Martian colony would use Phobos as a prime port of call, probably as the main station. It would be a trivial effort on a geological scale to reinforce the body, boost it to a higher orbit, or even gradually dismantle it and replace it with a station.
So basically OP please research Mars more. It's still the best body for colonisation.
No.347746
>>347739
That's a lot of oxygen though…
No.347748
>>347743
how can anyone begin to predict the shattering effect and how that will behave, thats impossible. it is far more likey that the fragmented pieces will dance off each-other and god knows what after that. it will NOT be a subtle dance to form the rings. it will be complete chaos.
No.347750
>>347746
thats right, a lot of oxygen… tons of it. you know why? because after burning methane and oxygen, you also have created carbon dioxide. and what do plants love?… you guessed it. then there is more oxygen. so the real threat is oxygen mixing with a methane-rich atmosphere, add a spark, and that is a fireworks show beyond imagining. that would be the best chance at any type of "terraforming". that would likely need to be decided upon before any colonizing effort, for sure. or for that matter, any surface human presence on the surface.
No.347751
>>347655
>with internal temperatures hot enough to melt steel beams.
Venus did 9/11 all along. At last, I truly see.
No.347753
>>347655
>He doesnt know about proposed missions to use its highly dense atmosphere to float around in a hot air balloon
No.347759
>>347746
so basically, either-way, you have dry-cell fuel in the form of methane and/or oxygen. 4 ingredients to life. fire, water, food, shelter. can the human body conform to low gravity in order to sustain a colony (i am betting it can). although switching back to higher gravity would likely need bioengineering help. my guess is the human body switches rather easily to low gravity, but switching back to high gravity is extremely taxing, as bone density then becomes the problem (along with some vascular issues). can the habitat withstand the cold. thats all there is to colonizing Titan, a real colony, not some suicide mission to a dead planet… like mars. defeat the space gamma enough to get humans to Titan, and it is a win/win.
No.347764
>>347759
titan is literally so far away from the sun it would be permanently night. then there are the gravitational tides of jupiter.
on top of that it is composed of poison
the earth's moon, mars and venus are the only choices for an extraplanetary colony for a very long time
No.347767
>Phobos is losing the battle, inching closer to Mars at a rate of three- to six feet per century, Hurford told Discovery News. That gives the moon between 30 million and 50 million years before impact, but scientists doubt it’ll get that far.
>30 to 50 million years before impact
>implying humanity won't have died out or figured out a way to stop it by that point
OP full of shit.
No.347773
>>347767
>strap a rocket to it
>accelerate it into a higher orbit
BRUTE FORCE AND IGNORANCE CANNOT BE DEFEATED
No.347782
>>347767
i think this is less about the OP, and more about the explorers. why doesn't someone ask the explorers what provisions will give THEM the best chance at a life. cuck!, they are just accepting what is being handed to them, THAT IS THEIR CUCKING JOB! it does not mean they need to receive a death sentence from some political cuckhead.
No.347786
>>347773
a rocket would never work. do you realize how much fuel that would use?
we need to nuke the ever loving fuck out of a single point on phobos. each blast wave will knock it further and further out of mars's path
No.347795
No.347799
>>347764
>jupiter
i meant saturn - my bad - but both are enormous gas giants with huge gravity density in their gravitational spheres of influence
>>347786
phobos is about 14 miles across, weighs about 10 trillion metric tons - not really that big when you consider the three gorges dam in china weighs about a tenth of that
a high efficiency "rocket" like an ion drive over a million years or so would be fine.
No.347802
>A manned expedition is the same as colonization
Are you retarded?
No.347804
>>347655
yeah unlike Mars, Ganymede has proof that they have liquid water under the surface that isn't routinely frozen or so high in salt its basically salt with water ontop
No.347809
>>347643
PBS digital studios is full of retards. Look no further than their gaming channel.
Also I love how they some how leave out that Venus is 800+ degrees
Also, surfacism…. are they making up new sjw bull shit words everyday? You don't wanna die on a planets surface? you surfacist!
No.347815
>>347720
>>347707
Mars has no magnetic field. Any atmosphere that is kicked up from terraforming will quickly be blasted away by the solar winds.
No.347821
File: 1458706765231.jpg (168.27 KB, 696x670, 348:335, terra-formars-3420819_zps0….jpg)
>>347626
Mars chimp out you say?
No.347829
>>347750
You need at least 40% methane content.
And don't forget that Earth's atmosphere is mostly nitrogen, not oxygen.
No.347831
>>347753
You'd need to pretty much make an impenetrable fortress, because Venus' atmosphere consists of gaseous sulfuric acid mixed with CO2 due to being so fucking hot.
No.347834
>>347748
>Hurr durr, I'm too stupid to understand physics.
Shut the fuck up and let the grown ups do the thinking, kiddo. Just because it's too complicated for your tiny brain to comprehend, doesn't mean it cannot be predicted.
No.347838
>>347764
In the contrary, Jupiter lets off a shit ton of heat. You wouldn't have "day" per say, but if you could harvest the heat radiating off of Jupiter, you'd be alright.
Literally just send a canister down to Jupiter on a bottle rocket long enough to suck up all the flammable gases, then burn those as fuel.
No.347840
>>347815
Uhh… Mars has an atmosphere, it's just composed mostly of Carbon Dioxide. And it took hundreds of millions of years for Mars' atmosphere to be stripped, so that's not much of a worry.
All you'd need to do is drill into Mars' outer core (which is completely possible since the planet is in a "cooled down" state), then proceed to shoot massive amounts of current through it (read: a large EMP) to jumpstart the core into a semi-solid magnetic state. At that point, planetary physics does the rest and you've got a magnetic field around the planet within half a century.
No.347846
>>347748
While individual pieces can't be computed, you simply shrink the model. Macrophysics are macrophysics until you exceed a certain size (at which point we're talking quantum mechanics on a star-sized level).
It would be quite easy to calculate the impact of a moon into mars using a supercomputer. Gravity works the same way at virtually all levels as do collision physics, so we simply use an electromagnetic telescope to figure out the composition of both along the trajectory, and then cross-examine that with our collision physics models to predict where the "cracks" will appear that shatter the moon.
At that point you just track the macrofragments using the basis of Mars' gravitational pull on them, and you can figure out approximately where all of the big particles will go.
Keep in mind we calculate out the thousands of baseball-sized particles traveling at hundreds of miles per SECOND around the Earth with relative ease. If we're already there, calculating these things on Mars is, in relative terms, child's play.
No.347849
>>347846
well, while you are here, can i get a short explanation of why quantum & relativity don't play well together.
No.347852
>>347840
>using an EMP as a planetary defibrillator.
No.347853
>>347831
Every single time I've seen the proposed Venusian mission mentioned, it's always prefaced with, "assuming we can find a way to deal with the sulfuric acid." The upper atmosphere isn't particularly hot nor pressurized, and, H2SO4 aside, pretty tolerable.
It'll be a matter of time before we find a good protective coating or metal.
No.347858
>>347853
What is a plastic bottle?
No.347859
>>347849
Well, first keep in mind that we used Newtonian mechanics for forever and a day. Newtonian mechanics are wrong at super-fast levels, but work alright one anything that doesn't break the sound barrier.
In a way, Quantum and Relativity are tied pretty closely together. We actually use special relativity to bring Quantum back down to the real world since probability gets messy.
Really, the best analogy I can use is that relativity needs to be calculated like analog signals, whereas quantum is more like a digital signal of ones and zeros. Relativity needs continuous line whereas quantum is broken into bits and pieces since you can't really calculate the exact point.
So on the "micro" and "nano" scales, there is no difference, but if you're working with quantum mechanics on the large solar level, or working with relativity on the 1/1 trillionth of a hydrogen atom's length levels, things get wonky… Theoretically.
No.347861
>>347859
tl;dr- If you understand electronics, pretend that Relativity is an analog circuit (constant wave) while Quantum Mechanics is a digital circuit (breaks in values where only highs and lows matter).
No.347863
>>347861
ok, so hall vs wave, thank you thank you
No.347877
Its funny the only reason NASA isn't doing both missions is because Nasa is funded enough.
No.347879
>>347877
NASA has actually been taking a back track and has been giving increasing amounts of their money in private grants to private space missions.
The issue is they need more nuclear material, but the Department of Energy has cut them off until they can get back up to date…
The DOE is about 60 years behind schedule right now.
No.347881
>>347877
as in a manned mission to Titan? or just an observation effort?
No.347887
>>347782
Again.
>30 to 50 million years until the moon fucks its shit up
The moon is going to do absolutely jack shit to anyone who goes to Mars within the next 30 MILLION YEARS.
In less than a hundred years humanity has advanced from biplanes to supersonic aircraft, all the way to space travel. In no way is the moon going to be a "death sentence" for any human 30 million years down the line.
inb4 this post is screencapped and saved for 30-50 million years
No.347888
>>347626
the earth could be destroyed before then, as well. in fact, if certain parties are elected as world leaders, it could happen in our own lifetimes. what a nice news article that could make.
No.347898
>>347887
it is a piece of car—bon with some remarkable ores. fit for mining, not life.
No.347901
>>347887
Don't worry, digital memory only lasts about 500-600 years.
No.347907
>>347651
>but scientists doubt it'll get that far
So around 10 million years, or do they think the moon will crash within our lifetimes? Either way, I doubt it will do anything to us as we will either die out or never really get off our planet at the rate we are going.
No.347917
>>347907
hard to say, a supernova gamma-ray burst could vaporize it gone tomorrow.
i think NASA has some seriously pimped>out telescopes that can see the moon sweat against our own sun's solar output. i'm guessing they will see some degradation before it $hit storms the place.
No.347919
No.347924
>>347809
The idea behind Venus colonization is to live in cloud cities above the clouds made of acid, pressure, heat and murder.
In a way Venus would be better than mars, because the gravity there would be very similar to our Terran gravity.
No.347999
No.348036
>>347786
>efficiency
heh, what a casual.
We're claiming mars, we have a whole planet worth of minerals to use.
Hell, we're talking millions of years, we could use some solar powered ion 1N max power thruster for 100 years and it'll be fine.
No.348049
>t-they're talking about me again…
No.348057
>>347767
>>30 to 50 million years before impact
Gheez by that time another paradigm shift will happen and insectoids will need to worry about it. OP is a faggot.
No.348076
THE SUN WILL EXPLODE!!!!!!
in 5 billion years
op is 12 yo with absolutely no knowledge, just ignore him…
No.348303
>>348057
>insects evolving human-level intelligence in 30-50 million years
No.348333
>>347666
You gotta have oxygen to burn methane, satan, even in a fuel cell
No.348351
>>347626
>millions of years
>imminent
yeah, happening any time now
No.348379
>>348333
how, how does this happen on a planet of 8 BILLION humans? thats what i want to know. everyone on the whole damn planet uses energy in 1 form or another for their day2day lives. yet our most hopeful explorers are expected to do more, with almost nothing! MARS IS A DEAD PLANET! does Mars have a purpose in the the bigger picture? yes, it is a source for some minerals and ore, that is it.
you know what it is… it is repeated over and over… it is a misuse of power and/or resources. just in recent history, you have apollo 13 failure, challenger failure, BP oil failure, Chernobyl failure, fukushima failure, and the list goes on. these are all power failures for resources that will not even be granted to human space explorers to Mars once they reach a colonizable plot. but they are not given the chance to colonize, so instead they are given a one-way ticket to death. but more importantly, this Mars mission should be plotted with a massive surveying operation to evaluate the best mining deposit locations and/or human settlement areas for the mining effort (((with robots))), lots of them.
energy resources on any space exploration effort for our solar system is vitally improved with ABUNDANT energy resources. Titan has that, ABUNDANTLY. so they need to carry some extra oxygen to kick-start the effort. at least there is a promise of hope for the human-race & most importantly… the explorers.
everything needs to target energy resources for human exploration to have a chance at success, EVERYTHING!. why is that so hard for people on earth to understand that concept? it is absolutely MISSION CRITICAL! space explorers are forced into life and death choices with almost every decision of their lives. energy should not be anything they need to concern themselves with. and when that happens, they can truly define some goals and the human race has a win/win.
to send a bunch of bright minds out to meet their deaths, is just plain stupid.
No.348667
>>348379
you do know that the components of CO2 are carbon and oxygen, right?
mars has CO2 in vast abundance
No.348898
>>348667
there is something benevolent about your suggestion… ending in a "carbon neutral" result? please share your idea.
No.348912
>>347626
>(MIT) suggest mission failure beginning around the 70th day after landing, with the current level of planing
All I know is my planing does a terrible job, leaving me with tons of work left for the rotary sander.
I agree, our level of planing sucks.
No.348923
>>347626
It's ok send Aerosmith up there to deploy nukes.
No.348929
>>348898
why the fuck would a carbon nuetral result matter on a planets which has no life and would requir rising temperatures?
besides we can use the carbon for nanotubes
No.348937
>>348929
carbon is the means by which molecules chain themselves. which basically means, carbon is everywhere and plentiful. which means plentiful amounts of energy,
i am not sure what you mean by rising temperatures
No.348967
>>347626
congrats you're the biggest retard on the site
No.348972
>>347853
>>347858
Plastic gets eaten by H2SO4. Afaik though, glass doesn't. We've been making a lot of strides in that department relatively lately too.
No.348980
>>348972
HDPE is safe for low to medium concentrations which is what you'd see on venus
No.348987
Earth IS FLAT! THIS IS NASA FEAR PORN!
>Porn is RUN BY JEEEEEEEEWWWSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!
Pic related cuz we'll crash this election with no survivors.
No.349291
>>347702
>Phobos
ABSOLUTELY HARAM
No.349443
>>347626
>It will take at minimum 30 million years before Phobos collides with Mars
>Doomed
Yeah because if somehow the human race even lasts that long they wont have the tech to prevent a tiny satellite from colliding with a planet.