4217b8 No.5105
Something that stands out to me is that no matter how bad people have it, society seems to want them to stick around even if they hate every minute of it.
Why is it so wrong to want out? What's the point of keeping people from committing suicide in the first place? Sure, maybe public suicides would be a problem, but if you're not disturbing anyone (except maybe your family) why be forced to stay?
And then if you do try to kill yourself they put you in a mental ward and feed you pills and make you into their prisoner. What the hell?
Pic related?
0f9c31 No.5106
Interesting indeed on how they keep people that doesn't want to live to be kept alive, I haven't got anyone to answer of why people is really anti against the idea of suicide.
Couple of thinks I thought, probably cause it goes against the very concept of us as a "living" being. It could also lead to the problem that it makes the mindset that suicide is the simplest and easiest way out for a lot of things in the world, had it not be considered as taboo, we could be seeing streets littered with bodies here and there, heaps of debt? Suicide. Cops chasing you? Suicide. You went on a depression phase? Suicide.
Of course it might not be that simple a matter at all, just saying.
People consider those who tries suicide to be having some mental illness, issues, few loose screws, thus explains the treatment, although how the treatment goes, I haven't experienced on myself, only saw them. The impression I get is that, it doesn't seem… effective. It doesn't exactly solve the root issue, cause, wasn't usually those who seeks death are those whose in a desperate situation? Although the counseling part I can understand.
4217b8 No.5108
>>5106To counter your argument of the streets (or homes) being littered with bodies… Perhaps that would still be a better alternative than forcing people to stay alive.
The people who want to live, are born into or acquire a welcoming life situation, and don't have any reason to go would stay. And the one's who do stay feel much more appreciative of their lives…
Because they got to choose to stay and weren't forced to.
2a79aa No.5160
What I don't understand is, if being born is not by choice, why living is mandatory.
>>51053 reasons I have:
1)Because they're selfish and can't see beyond their noses; they'd feel sad if you departed, so they force you to stay despite you feeling like shit.
2)Because raising someone costs money. Society expects you not to squander any opportunity and to fully exploit your potential, so you can't bail on them just like that.
3)Because cognitive dissonance kicks in; they can't believe anyone genuinely want out of life (i.e. if you wish to die, there must have some sort of condition or ailment that needs treatment). If they accepted suicide as a valid course of action, they'd be acknowledging that life may not be as good as they thought, and they can't have that.
Could have phrased it better, but English is not my first language.
>>5106>People consider those who tries suicide to be having some mental illness, issues, few loose screwsThat's the propaganda that gets drilled into every person's head. This leads to suicidal people ignoring advice from people close to them because it seems like speaking to a voice recording.
The reasoning for suicide is simple: if you don't like it here, why stay?
4217b8 No.5180
>>5160Your English is quite good for a non-native speaker.
Considering the proliferation of depression and the crummy state of affairs of the world in general, it seems like the world really isn't as good as they thought.
It's funny how you mention selfishness being a reason. I've often heard of people who commit suicide as being selfish. "How could they just hurt their family like that?" When forcing someone who hates to live to stay for someone else's benefit is far more selfish.
6283ac No.5201
>>5105I don't think it's a conspiracy. People just don't like to see their fellow humans dying. It's probably instinctual.
2a79aa No.5216
>>5180>It's funny how you mention selfishness being a reason.That's the thing. They call you selfish for not wanting to live, while failing to notice the fact that forcing someone into something (e.g. life) is way worse.
c0b81a No.5254
Its another form of control, the industrial civilization abhors freedom, suicide was an honored tradition among pre monotheistic societies.
580d67 No.5261
>>5105They need mothers, soldiers, and tax payers. It's as simple as that.
13918f No.5299
Because death is seen as the ultimate bad thing and people naturally don't want people to die. They don't really think "What is death like? Will they suffer more in life or death?" or anything like that, it's more like "Oh shit! They're going to die! Stop it!"
It's a natural instinct of living things to oppose death, that's why none of us have done it yet, and while the modern human has little need for the relatively few individuals that will kill themselves, instinct still tells people to "save" them.
d8ba47 No.5311
>>5105Because they're scared of what life would be like without you, and what you leaving means for them. Because they need you in some way.
Because they want to imagine you can get better without ever imagining that you aren't or can't.
Or because they've been 'depressed' before, because their job was mildly annoying and they got stuck in traffic - and therefore because they could 'pull themselves together' they believe that you should too. Ignoring the fact that illnesses come in different sizes, forms and severities.
Because the majority of people inherently enjoy life and can't understand that you don't.
And probably more.
7d4a46 No.5321
I got a few
>if monkeyslaves depressed relatives an hero'd, the monkeyslaves themselves might get depressed and an hero too, causing a chain reaction of death (which is ultimately the biggest form of social noncompliance possible)
>people really, really hate losing things they think belong to them. this extends to other people far too often
>they see the desire to die as an "illness" that can be "fixed" as our lens for viewing the human drifts from the subjective to the objective "humans are just robots who are self-aware" view
>they just wanna torture you mang
If everyone started dying because of the suicide domino effect I describe (something even the jews in psychology have noted to happen) then the illusion of society not being a piece of shit would crumble and it'd lose its control.
We have to keep up the "you must be happy" and "unhappiness is an illness" mentality in order for society to thrive the way it does. Once something -real- happens that pierces the veil of advertisements and social pressures people "snap out" of their social living and begin to come into their own. That is very bad.
So yeah it's not really about -you-, it's about the effect you would have if millions of people just like you gave in and ended it. I mean most people have thought about suicide before, and I'd dare to say many people have/do seriously consider it, many more than actually do it.
Natural death is okay because that is death by submission; another force overpowered you and killed you. Death by your own hand is not okay because it is an act of defiance.
8209b6 No.5335
Maybe because they believe that they are just going through a short time period of depression and that it will soon go away. In my case, I've been suicidal since since I was 14 (8 years) and I still haven't killed myself, but I believe I will finally do it very soon, within this month. I am planning on jumping off the 45th floor balcony of a building in San Francisco.
8209b6 No.5337
There are a few arguments people say against suicides.
"People who commit suicide are only thinking about themselves, not about their family who will suffer because of their death."
- You could also say that the family is selfish for not allowing them to end their misery and instead want them to keep on living in pain.
"Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem"
- I've been suicidal since I was 14 (8 year), this is not a temporary problem. Plus, a permanent solution is what a lot of people want, no matter how temporary the problem is.
f8ca1f No.5339
>>5261Literally this, everyone can be taken advantage in one way or another by at least one person. 'healthy' people inevitably get taken advantage of from everyone richer than them, 'sick' people like us from pharma.
6245a5 No.5344
>>5160I see suicide as a very unnatural cause, simply because it defy the concept of a "living" being. Doesn't really meaning I'd would go "hey, don't die, live worth living" and shit, just make sure what makes you want to do the suicide to be something that is not somewhat petty or else. Its a permanent solution and quiet the dramatic death.
ebbe04 No.5346
File: 1422889495934.jpg (240.3 KB, 1081x1080, 1081:1080, ForbiddenCity_MaoZedongPor….jpg)
One man didn't.
>People who try to commit suicide — don't attempt to save them! . . . China is such a populous nation, it is not as if we cannot do without a few people.
-Mao Zedong
4217b8 No.5407
>>5346Probably the worst reason I've heard to let people kill themselves. Don't stop suicides! They don't matter!
Give the people a reason to live, then provide them the freedom to choice whether or not to live. That would be a netter way.
4217b8 No.5408
>>5407Fuck touchscreen keyboards. Yeah there's typos.
7d4a46 No.5409
Death isn't real.
They want us to think it is and that it's tethered to our fleshbodies.
They make suicide seem like a big deal so that we by extension continue to believe that this life is a big deal, which it is not.
4217b8 No.5412
>>5409Wait hang on…
By that logic then what is real? And are you saying that's why one shouldn't fear death or why one should want death?
0b493c No.5684
>>5412Other poster, to be honest. there is no evidence that "this" is real. therefore what i want to say is that you have no idea whats next, only speculations about "afterlife" or darkness or whatever there is. for me i would like the quantum immortality as well as multiverse theory to be true. which is awesomely extraordinary, and what i'm looking up to.
a7786d No.8239
bd9236 No.8363
>>5344
The human drive to suicide has been theorized as a genetic fitness thing; you perceive yourself as negatively impacting your family, subconscious calculus says they'll be better off without you, bing bang boom you want to die.
404eda No.9028
overpopulation benefits the elites.
The more people there are, the more "group-think" there is. every person alive is subject to education and entertainment that has been created and distributed by elites.
overpopulation is what fuels the digital revolution, is what keeps the media (tv and the internet) relevant to the populace as a whole. Just look at how powerful hollywood has grown. its not just relevant in america; in fact most hollywood movies make more money from foreign countries than they do from the states.
If overpopulation wasn't so prevelant, than maybe the go-to american hobby of sitting in front of an electronic screen wouldn't be so widespread.
additionally if you survive suicide attempts then you will have to eat big pharma pills and talk to doctors that have been given liberal education at elite-controlled schools.
ee491a No.9030
>>5412
technically you can't 100% prove that anything exists outside of your own consciousness. This is why I fucking hate philosophy
3872fa No.9829
>What's the point of keeping people from committing suicide in the first place?
If this was deemed acceptable and suddenly a lot of people started doing it, you could end up with a sizeable portion of the workforce and taxpayers vanishing into thin air. This is bad for The Man.
Think about Japan, for instance. Low as fuck birthrates, high suicide rates. A recipe for economical disaster after a while.
073807 No.9834
>>5337
Here's my refutations
>suicidal people are selfish
As long as no one else gets physically hurt, there is no problem. It is legal to emotionally hurt people. For example you could start ignoring every family member, it's your right. So why should suicide be any different? I guess what I'm really trying to say is that there's nothing wrong with being selfish. So calling suicidal people that doesn't mean they shouldn't be suicidal.
>permanent solution to a temporary problem
How long is temporary? Your entire life would still count as temporary. Granted if the problem hasn't been there that long you shouldn't kill yourself. But most suicidal people have really severe problems that inhibit their lives and make them miserable. If things are absolutely shit, have been absolutely shit and you don't have any hope for the future so they will be absolutely shit, I see nothing wrong with suicide. I will add that suicide for people with terminal illnesses is allowed, but not for severe mental illness, probably because mental illness isn't seen as physical. If mental health workers want to have mental illness on the same level as diseases and injuries, they should allow termination of life.
ce6a7b No.10035
>>5105
Money. Greed. Power.
You can't profit off a dead person. That is why suicide is illegal.
By keeping people alive and in pain they sell you doctors opinions and medical treatment. If you're not on prescribed drugs or in a mental institution you'll be in jail All of these things funnel money into the 0.01% and they will do everything in their (enormous, corrupt, evil) power to keep suicide and helpful herbal drugs illegal until the day they themselves die.
830166 No.10054
Hey guys. I have a slight predicament
Ive been dealing with depression for 5 years and suicidal ideation for 3 i'm thinking of catching the bus this year but I can't go, it would hurt my significant other too much. Is there a way out without killing two birds with one stone.
It was a mistake that I let anyone close.
78324c No.10055
>>10054
Introduce them to someone they would like more than you, and become gradually more distant. Also a good way to get rid of friends without making enemies out of them. You just grow apart. I dunno. I've been dead inside for so long, all I can do is manipulate people. I can shape them into feeling good about themselves, but all it does is underline the contrast against myself.
830166 No.10056
>>10055
The thing is, my partner is tied around my finger.
Also I dont really care about my friends I've just been a burden to them.
Tbh the only people I care for are my uncle and her, I know I have the silver tongue to do these things, I'm just not sure if I have the courage.
78324c No.10057
>>10056
Doesn't take courage, just takes determination. Honestly, if you manage to maintain some modicum of awareness right before death, you'll feel relief that it's finally fucking done, with a mild bit of panic as the last part of the brain fails.
I don't know why I continue. Probably habit. Sleep, shower, shave, work, repeat. Maybe eat if people give me shit about starving. Shouldn't be too much longer, though. Work is falling apart, and I'm now positive that I'll never get better. I mean, it's been eighteen years I've been on my own, and it hurts to fucking breathe. Fuck everybody else.
830166 No.10059
>>10057
Alright.
I hope you reach your release to,
18 years.. Its godamn derserved by now.
069e5a No.10064
>And then if you do try to kill yourself they put you in a mental ward and feed you pills and make you into their prisoner.
Actually, they don't. Whatever this wonderful utopian city of yours is, I want to know. I tried. Nobody cared. I only told people around me matter of factly. I expressed that I didn't want sympathy. I'm not looking for attention. All I want is out. Responses range anywhere from my family relaying a story about an uncle who blew his brains out and left the brain matter mess for his wife, to my coworker who said "you won't find her in eternity, eternity's a pretty big place." First of all, ETERNITY IS A SPAN OF FUCKING LIMITLESS TIME, NOT A PLACE. Second of all, I'm going out as painlessly as possible but I'm not even sure that after the uncomfortable burning sensation and the brain's "supposed to" shut down, that my consciousness won't experience all the rotting fun that death has to offer. Kind of like when a doctor cuts you open with anesthetic, but you feel it. You don't feel the pain, you feel it without pain. It's disgusting. What if that's what death is? You feel the suffocation of your lungs giving out, even though the brain is supposed to be dead. You feel the heart and the rest of your organs stop, eventually decaying. But not before you get to experience the coroners cutting you open, draining your blood, and filling you with embalming fluid.
All of these thoughts affect my mind, but I still want out. She's gone. She's never coming back. Unless of course, death is like sleep and we live again. What if death is the same as when we close our eyes and don't dream, waking up wondering where the time went, only with more sting? There's that possibility. That I'd wake up, and either go straight to her or spend some time trying to find her. Either way, it's a shot. I can't live like this. There's no other person for me. She did something very foolish, left many behind who loved her. A funeral packed with people crying. Me, my mother and maybe my sister will be the only ones crying. I hate to do this to my mom, but I don't have the will to live anymore.
And am I correct in that there's a guy here with a partner? Holy shit, what the fuck? She's alive, you asshole. Sure, do to her what the person I loved did to me. Kill yourself, leave her behind to lose the will to live and wonder how to get out of this fucking prison.
830166 No.10065
>>10064
This isn't what I wanted. At all.
We got together because she wanted to play a prank on her best friend, and know I'm committed to life for at least another year. YOU think you're stuck in a prison? When everyone I ever loved used me and let me go? You think I want to do that to her? All I ever wanted was out. I missed my window of opportunity and now I'm stuck. So thanks for making me feel like shit. It's honestly not counter productive at all.
069e5a No.10081
>>10065
You're welcome m8. Yes, I'm stuck in a prison. You can't go to fucking prison WITH a female. You go to prison with guys that rape you in the ass, or you're locked away in a cell for solitary confinement. Solitary is my life. At least you have a mate and she's alive. You can just go to make love to her and feel all better. The rest of us should be so lucky. You sound like those people who want to die because their thermostat doesn't have an in between setting, or there's not dip for their chips.
830166 No.10082
>>10081
Make love to her and feel better? When both of us were rsped as young teens
I think you might need some midol Hun.
830166 No.10083
cece4c No.10085
>>10064
That's completely unfair. I had a partner too, but she caught the bus. Did it right in front of me, I had to see her throw up all those pills and fucking die. But she had reasons, the same reasons that I have now. I hate her for leaving me, but after losing so much, and falling so far, I can only understand her reasons. She can never come back. I don't think I'll meet her ever again. But who am I but a plain old man, to force her to stay.
You can't take your experiance, and apply it to another person. Why, why, should someone who hates life stay around, simply to spare someone else. Would you place the importance of your happiness above that of your partners? To force a loved one to stay, just to spare your own life, says that your happiness is intrinsically more important than you partners very will to leave
a2f3c6 No.10088
>>5105
It's illegal to destroy government property m8. They've put a lot of money into your education and raising you and now they want their investment back.
Your family won't like it either since the grieving process is pretty hard on them too.
SCREW THE MODS! BE AN OUTLAW!
ac315d No.10107
Because you're a huge investment.
A ton of money has been poured into the education you got, the infrastructures you used, the services offered to you etc.
The whole point of psychotherapy, drugs or whatever is to make you able to work so that you can pay taxes. They don't want to make you happy, to make you feel good about life. None of that, all they want is for you to work to pay back the money invested raising you.
You can die the day you retire, nobody will give a shit then.
d1afa3 No.10108
>>10088
Thats an interested way to look at things. Shame on them for not expecting some losses on investments, though.
If there were any guarantees in life, we wouldn't be in this situation anyways.
2ff610 No.13896
>>5160
massively underrated post right here
dac97c No.13904
I personally don't think it's anything really mysterious.
My theory which many others hold is that since suicides are becoming more common through out the decades the government is feeling it's slaves. We are property of the government we are herded cattle that serve as a means for the higher ups to have a form of power without us they have nothing, and see someone killing themselves as a loss of property. It's been like this for a very long time, suicide is consider a sin by many and assisted suicide is against the law for just as long almost.
That's all we fucking are is god damn cattle that's all this life is, you serve, pay debts, reproduce, and die just so the cycle can continue.