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/tech/ - Technology

Winner of the 77nd Attention-Hungry Games
/x/ - Paranormal Phenomena and The RCP Authority

April 2019 - 8chan Transparency Report
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File: 8341b512695d9b9⋯.png (82.31 KB, 1200x630, 40:21, opengraph.png)

File: 783dbbb7422b464⋯.png (16.51 KB, 500x500, 1:1, Untitled.png)

 No.1041416

The only good thing about Electron is that it allows you to fuck over OS UI designers while supporting every input device Chrome supports without building bicycles on SDL/SFML/whatever you're using. Qt/GTK are way fucking restricted to the ancient Windows 95 paradigm and doesn't allow you to make a button look like a link/checkbox look like a switch.

 No.1041422

>>1041416

> make a button look like a link/checkbox look like a switch

Why would you want to such a horrible thing?


 No.1041427

>>1041422

because I wanted to provide an example on how Qt's styling is limited.


 No.1041428

>>1041416

>>1041422

>>1041427

You are so preoccupied with whether you could, you didn't stop to think if you should.


 No.1041452

yes, electron is a piece of shit

>fuck over OS UI designers

that would be a good thing. unfortunately, they are indeed not fucked over and continue to spread their filth

>Qt/GTK [...] doesn't allow you to make a button look like a link/checkbox look like a switch.

what


 No.1041481

>>1041416

>Make a button look like a link

This is literally everything wrong with modern UI design.


 No.1041487

Someone please tell me what was so wrong about simple websites where there were no animations or GIANT VIDEOS AND POPUPS showing up without your permission or desire or where performance was pretty good and not complete ass because muh animations?


 No.1041491

>>1041487

Literally the only good thing about the nu-web is having HTML5 video. It may suck sometimes, but it's one hell of a lot better than being stuck with Adobe Flash for video content. Everything else is aids.

Halfchan was started back in like 2003. Did that even use Javascript back then? If it did, it was probably a very small amount and nowhere near (((Web 2.0))) levels.


 No.1041510

>>1041491

Pretty sure 2chan/4chan was just a simple CGI.


 No.1041524

Everyone thinks Election is attractive because people know javascript and don't want to learn anything else. The reality is that Qt and every other big cross platform GUI toolkits is its own special hell and Electron is so much easier to use at every step of development. GUIs were a mistake and so was everything that came after. Choke on the fruit of that tree. The world is a fuck.


 No.1041527

I'm not sure why there's so much hate for it tbh. Why would you want to write a separate program for each platform when you can just use electron. The only one autistic enough to care about the bundled web view is you ironically enough, any end user of your program will probably never even be aware of it.


 No.1041528

>>1041524

>GUIs were a mistake

TUIs were the actual mistake.


 No.1041529

File: 5346488adf2247e⋯.webm (1.25 MB, 640x360, 16:9, command-line.webm)


 No.1041531

>>1041529

A line that you enter commands. That's how close Terrys idea is to whatever nigger monkey cli you are jerking off to.


 No.1041535

>>1041527

>probably never even be aware of it

they will when their machine grinds to a full stop because your garbage app consumed all available ram on the machine which is what inevitably happens with all electron apps.

Swing is the only good cross platform gui lib to ever exist.


 No.1041541

>>1041535

>consumed all available ram on the machine >inevitably happens with all electron apps

That's not true though. VS code has no such problem and it's the quintessential bloated electron app.


 No.1041545

While on the topic of GUI libraries, what is the best choice if I want something nice looking without having to set up a huge development environment? I want to make a simple UI around a C library, something that's as retardedly simple as "drag a file into this rectangle". I looked into Qt, but every tutorial makes it look like you have to use their graphical IDE.

>>1041535

> Swing

Java shit


 No.1041550

>>1041545

There's nuklear which is specifically for GUI (no window system/render backend/input). I haven't used it but it looks ok.

https://github.com/vurtun/nuklear


 No.1041563

>>1041541

I give it 2 years before the complexity starts to pile on and it turns to shit

>>1041545

Funny thing is, if your library was written in Java shit it would be the most trivial thing to wrap some Swing around it, but you like to suffer so...


 No.1041574

>>1041563

Why would complexity pile on? Any additional complexity would be in the addons. I've got nearly 100 installed and there's no memory leakage. It uses around 120 mb of RAM.


 No.1041576

You got a fair point, I suppose same can be said about serving a JS webUI on localhost. Incidentally, both provide an easy way of doing clouds - and before anyone starts foaming at the mouth, think a beefy program running in a big server in your closet which you access from a thin client on your phone or weak laptop.

Problem with electron is that it's like when they say the cure is worse than the disease. It's slow, bloated, and the ease of use attracts shit devs who amplify those flaws tenfold. But then again, slow and working is still better than not slow and doesn't work.

>>1041428

No, he's right on this one and it's you who is too preoccupied with whether he should, to recognize why it's a shortcoming that you can't say he could. By way of analogy, if a poor craftsman blames his tools, what does a poor toolmaker say of the craftsman?

The point of a UI framework is to make it as easy as possible for people to create whatever UI people have thought up in their head. A UI framework is not a pedagogical tool. There are absolutely bad ways of doing UI, and people should definitely be taught to avoid them, but the UI framework is not the right medium for doing so, just as your car is not the right medium for teaching you to not drive drunk or speed (although perhaps you are a fan of breathalyzer keys and speed limiters, I don't know).

For a UI framework, more customization is generally a good thing because the #1 thing people want with UI elements is to customize them. Moreover, it's very useful, because a lot of people hate UI and are only doing it out of necessity, so you have even more users than usual that don't understand a lot of your framework and are just trying to get by with what little they know. If a person only knows buttons and would much rather not learn about links now, a frankenlink made from a button is, bad though it may be, still a way to get them to do what they want and it's still better than nothing. Kind of ironic that UI is supposedly the classic, perfect OOP problem, but actually it's a very duck typy thing. From the use's perspective, it doesn't matter whether it's actually a link or a button or an image with an onclick handler or whatever the fuck under the hood, it only matters what it looks like and what it does. And then there's the usual problems like diamond inheritance or circle-ellipse.


 No.1041581

>>1041574

<unironically using visual studio

How did you even find /tech/?


 No.1041583


 No.1041595

>>1041581

Not an argument.


 No.1041607

>>1041550

Looks like the UI to a video game.


 No.1041610

>>1041607

So how do game UIs work anyway? Do they usually hack something basic and ad hoc? Or do they write a whole UI framework just for the game? Or is it common to use frameworks specifically made for game UI?


 No.1041615

>>1041610

lots of games use javascript for their UI


 No.1041616

>>1041610

Depends on the game and the scope. Nuklear is popular for debugging or having a quick and easy UI for editing. I've always written my UI code from scratch for my games and tools because I usually only need a very narrow subset of what an entire framework offers.


 No.1041657

GUIs are awesome when they can tell the user what the program is going to do


 No.1041658

>>1041615

for example Battlefield 1 uses React + TypeScript + Mobx

>frontend developer cums


 No.1041659

>>1041581

It's VS Code, the nephew of Visual Studio and son of GitHub's Atom. It doesn't lag on pisspoor Intel Pentium B950 (suck that Android Studio) and it has rich language support for every popular/semi-popular language (I'm looking at you, Visual Studio). So it's the best code editor that you can use with mouse. Also it uses pure DOM (except their actual editor, Monaco, which AFAICT also uses DOM), so that's why it doesn't lag.


 No.1041660

>>1041527

True, in the era of 100 GB video games nobody cares if the messaging app weights 100 MB


 No.1041673

>>1041615

>>1041658

Wait, does that mean that every copy of the game effectively bundles and entire web browser in it?

>>1041659

> So it's the best code editor that you can use with mouse

> use with mouse


 No.1041677

>>1041416

>Qt/GTK are way fucking restricted to the ancient Windows 95 paradigm and doesn't allow you to make a button look like a link/checkbox look like a switch.

https://doc.qt.io/qt-5/qmlapplications.html

Qt is better than Electron in every way. It is also cross-platform, but doesn't require chromium to render applications.


 No.1041681

>>1041677

QML doesn't use the React.js paradigm so it's not for me. Also AFAIK you could only style it when you get deep down in Qt/use Qt Quick Controls. But it's nice and still fucks over OS UI designers.


 No.1041686

>>1041673

First, they don't use an entire browser but rather it's subset which is good enough to output an image, react to input, and do JavaScript.

Second, yes. Using hotkeys is hard for me and I can't remember them, so I use a keyboard to type/call some functions, but I use a mouse to click on code I want to change.




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