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/tech/ - Technology

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File: ba419cfef5ba1ea⋯.png (206.96 KB, 398x402, 199:201, firefox_and_friends.png)

 No.888741

Now, Firefox has been making shitty anti-user decisions for YEARS, and they keep piling up. Removing the ability to disable javascript completely (and removing many settings in general). Anti privacy shit like pocket, google / yahoo as default search engines, and a bunch of unsolicited connections and other shit that requires huge scripts to disable (https://github.com/pyllyukko/user.js/). Removing support for many addons. It goes on and on.

Anyway...all Firefox forks are dependent on Firefox in the end. IceCat has a team behind it, I guess, but does not stray much from FF. It has many of the same issues. Waterfox is made by one guy? And Palemoon is the least worst, but still - it lacks support for many addons, and how long can it keep up with the security fixes and such? It will become outdated soon.

So what's the solution? Clearly, addons are essential, so meme browsers like netsurf or links are out of consideration. The other browser giant is Chrome, which spies on you, and apparently Chromium as well. It has many forks but the only one worth anything is Iridium, so I think that should be used. Regardless, time to throw Firefox and friends to the trash.

 No.888749

I'll try Qutebrowser soon, since it finally got something umatrix-like. I just hope it's not too painful to configure.


 No.888751

>>888741

>time to throw Firefox and friends to the trash.

No it's not time because there's actually no good solution.

And there's no good solution because to make a browser nowadays is as enormous as making an operating system.

The reasons for that is because the W3C as be hijacked by mega corps and even if the W3C wouldn't be it wouldn't change anything as google find the way top spread a software as much as possible via the simple method of being like a virus and inserting itself (in exchange of cash) in the most popular downloaded software in existence (ccleaner, avast, etc...).

The only way to have a browser that freedom/privacy respecting, is popular, also working 99% on all websites is to have shitloads of money, have a team of 50 people who have at least read SICP, integrated a firewall like umatrix, and act the same way as google did to spread Google chrome.

This is not happening and will never happen except if god as mercy on us one day.

Also

Palemoon is shit and doesn't give a shit about freedom.

Waterfox is placebo.

Icecat needs cruelly more serious devs.

Mozilla needs to hang itself.

Anything based on chromium is botnet and can't be unboneted.


 No.888755

>>888751

chingchong


 No.888772

>>888749

That's one hopeful browser, and the other is Otter Browser. But we're putting hopes in a few people here. For now I'm staying with Iridium.


 No.888779

File: 935ecf5a02cfd38⋯.png (145.75 KB, 251x288, 251:288, 935ecf5a02cfd38b3d1596211e….png)

>>888749

>qute has per-domain settings now

HOLY SHIT!


 No.888789

I can probably get away with just a terminal browser once I finish my 8ch terminal client.


 No.888790

File: 33d93ca668330b6⋯.jpg (108.21 KB, 500x500, 1:1, 1400539355607.jpg)

>>888789

>using a terminal

>for web


 No.888791

>>888751

>Palemoon doesn't give a shit about freedom

So poor performance and licensing autism?


 No.888792

>>888790

>hypertext and NOTHING ELSE


 No.888795

>>888790

It's not a bad experience. If it can't run in a terminal web browser, it likely needs proprietary javascript anyways.


 No.888796

>>888795

I really hate how everything is fucking javascript now. Markup language only please, no turing complete shit that I HAVE to load in order to use the fucking site.


 No.888799

File: a2f063ba9db3b0d⋯.png (376.44 KB, 960x540, 16:9, IMG_3665.PNG)

Brave is the answer, my son.


 No.888800

>>888799

Isn't Brave closed source?


 No.888804

>>888790

The problem is the web, not the browsers. If your site isn't usable on links, then it's shit.


 No.888806

>>888804

Of course, there's not many "your sites" these days. It's all made using ready shit like wordpress, github, wikia or whatever. People don't even want to host IMAGES on their own server. Or even requiring a connection to google for fucking FONTS. What a joke.


 No.888807

You don't have to abandon it completely. Just experiment with other browsers like Links, w3m, Lynx and so on. They don't work on all sites, but most of them that require bloated browser aren't worth the trouble IMO.

>>888790

Well do you want the content (text, and maybe some images) or do you want gigs of botnet?


 No.888810

>>888807

What if the content is locked behind the botnet? I think they don't even do it on purpose since normies just have adblockers but don't block scripts, they just want to externalize the cost of site generation to the consumers.


 No.888814

>>888810

Try to get the same thing some other way, like P2P or something. Or you can just find something else to download.


 No.888821

>>888741

Whatever sucks about Firefox sucks in Chrome ten times as hard, Google.

No, no Chromium.


 No.888822

>>888806

>People don't even want to host IMAGES on their own server

because cheap VPS have little storage, do you know about it?

and hosting from personal computer is not viable as it's trivially traced, and also because NAT everywhere.


 No.888825

>>888822

Don't ISPs still offer webspace on their servers? Mine does at least, and you can even point a custom domain name to it if you really want. They let you have PHP and databases. Not that I want any of this shit though, I'd rather use Gopher.


 No.888826

>>888741

It's been time to dump it for years now. We'll all do that as soon as you introduce an alternative that's at least as good.


 No.888834

>>888741

it was time to dump firefox about 10 years ago. problem is all we have is links which doesn't work on all sites (this is by design, you need a super complicated product to view web pages so you can pay for antivirus or other feel good products to compensate for all the bugs induced by this)

>>888749

qutebrowser is shit. all these browsers are just wrappers around the same dumbass "web" engines that have been around for 20 years. umatrix is just some meme. adblocking is a meme. if you actually cared about browsing you'd realize adblocker changs nothing and at worst adds more bug and lag


 No.888849

>>888834

>umatrix is just some meme. adblocking is a meme. if you actually cared about browsing you'd realize adblocker changs nothing and at worst adds more bug and lag

please go back to /g/


 No.888851

I've been using the Chromium fork Inox since it first came out, and it's treated me quite well. also it has an AUR package

Yeah, Mozilla is far less abusive than Google, but Firefox's UI has always seemed crusty and sluggish. I tried Quantum a while ago and it seemed to be a major improvement, despite the Rust meme. If Icecat ever incorporates Quantum I will switch without hesitation.


 No.888871

>>888741

>>888749

>>888751

>>888772

>>888834

>>888849

There needs to be a common browser extension platform that works across multiple browsers. I hate Firefox for making Poettering shit mandatory, as well as the whole Cliqz, Riseup, and Looking Glass shit they did. However, I don't want to use a browser without support for Noscript, Decentraleyes, uBlock Origin, *insert cookie deleter here*, a vim keybinds extension, and so on.

There's a bunch of meme Loonix browsers out there running WebKitGTK or QtWebEngine that look cool and relatively lightweight, but they support literally no extensions outside of maybe a poor-quality adblocker. If there was a complete, universal, cross-platform browser extension system, you could use whatever the fuck you wanted, and bring all your favorite privacy tools with you.


 No.888872

>>888800

No.

Stop spreading FUD.


 No.888877

>>888871

it's not mandatory. You can compile it with ALSA, or use apluse.so


 No.888884

People need to stop catering to lusers and start making programs for actual knowledgeable people. Make a browser for programmers that is fully programmable so that it can become the Emacs of browsers. Wrap around blink and V8 and make it do all the heavy lifting.


 No.888887

>>888877

That's effectively only a viable option on gentoo.


 No.888889

>>888887

GENTOO WINS AGAIN

ARCH FAGS ON SUICIDE WATCH


 No.888931

>>888821

I'm as far from a Google shill as possible. But Iridium has a team behind it dedicated to maximizing your privacy. And Firefox has nothing like that.

Of course all browsers suck in the end, but we have to use something. Addon requirement leaves only two choices - Firefox based or Chrome based, and the latter wins.


 No.888935

>>888741

There's not really a great, simple solution, but there's a few steps in the right direction. I think it's unfortunately necessary to have one "suck" browser on a system for most people, just to be able to do banking, pay bills, access work/university related websites, etc. This can really be anything, though I prefer firefox because at least it's FOSS. For everything else, I think the solution is to go more simple. Link2 in graphical mode, dillo (which I'm posting from), things like that. Streamlight or smtube for video streaming. Use a hosts file to block ads. Keeping js disabled is the best way to stay safe online.

>>888749

Really? Link? Pretty neat if true.

>>888789

Please share your project once you finish, I and I'm sure others would be quite interested in that.

>>888800

No, it's FOSS. And despite what some think, I don't really think it's botnet either. I'm just wary about it. Can't shake a gut feeling that it's just not a great solution.


 No.888936

>>888887

If you're too much of a brainlet to compile Firefox, install libpulse. It's a tiny package on most distros to circumvent installing the full pulse.


 No.888947

>>888871

>noscript

javascript.enabled;0

>decentraleyes

literally who?

>ad blocker of the month #35236576235

malware, pajeetware, skidware, and hardly brings any benefit

>cookie deleter

firecox and all it's forks have:

-a "delete cookies on exit" option

-ctrl+shift+del to clear cookies

-network.cookie.cookieBehavior;2

also be sure to have

-network.http.sendRefererHeader;0

unfortunately you have to set it back to 1 or 2 to post on 8ch. still better than installing some more cancer on top of your cancerfox fork though


 No.888971

>>888935

>Please share your project once you finish

Another thing on my fix up list before release is proper unicode support. My current support is brainlet their. I print a character and then check what the position of the cursor is. I know how to properly do it now, so it's just a matter of doing it.


 No.889018

>>888884

So, basically uzbl/luakit/qutebrowser then?


 No.889034

>>888947

>javascript.enabled;0

I still obviously need some amount of JS for sites to function. Noscript gives granular control of that.

>literally who?

"Protects you against tracking through "free", centralized, content delivery. It prevents a lot of requests from reaching networks like Google Hosted Libraries, and serves local files to keep sites from breaking. Complements regular content blockers."

"Websites have increasingly begun to rely much more on large third-parties for content delivery. Canceling requests for ads or trackers is usually without issue, however blocking actual content, not unexpectedly, breaks pages. The aim of this add-on is to cut-out the middleman by providing lightning speed delivery of local (bundled) files to improve online privacy."

>malware

It's Free Software licensed under the GNU General Public License

>pajeetware, skidware

prove it.

>and hardly brings any benefit

it blocks ads. I consider that a benefit.


 No.889046

>>888790

>2018

>Not using Lynx

kys


 No.889050

File: cca4def4ffea60e⋯.png (120.58 KB, 256x256, 1:1, rf Leafie no.png)


 No.889061

>>888825

PHP can suck my dick

also we don't trust our ISPs

so this is not a solution


 No.889070

>>888741

>Removing the ability to disable javascript completely

Does this extend to the Tor Browser Bundle?


 No.889078

>>888871

WebExtensions is what you describe. If only it wasn't such a crippled piece of shit.


 No.889086

>>889061

PHP was just an example, they got other scripting stuff too. I just have no interest whatsoever in making web sites of any kind, so I'll never use it.


 No.889110

>>889070

of course not, that's always been a priority tor feature


 No.889123

>>888884

Yeah, I had an idea kind like that for a browser. Literally everything would be a plugin. From typical plugins to graphical elements to the engine. Everything. The only problem is I'm a pajeet tier programmer and couldn't even figure out how to get started.


 No.889126

>>888751

Why not go the qutebrowser route using qtwebkit?


 No.889143

surf also has per domain like umatrix by the way. Just in case you want to avoid webengine cancer(replaced by webkit cancer).


 No.889144

>>888741

>So what's the solution?

Qupzilla.


 No.889160

>>889078

>>889144

Yeah WebExtensions sounds like the future. I just wish browsers like Qupzilla (now called KDE Falkon) or Midori supported them.


 No.889259

>>889160

>Qupzilla (now called KDE Falkon)

I use Qupzilla and I didnt know that.


 No.889265

>>889259

They considered Kitsune (fox) which sounds much better and even starts witk K like other KDE stuff.

>muh bird


 No.889290

All I want is to view images and text, maybe the occasional video(but I can do that on MPC anyways).


 No.889387

Pale Moon is fine, although a old-style furry dev (and him putting Ad Nauseum on the not recommend add-on list) might triggers some people.

If you want something closer to newer Firefox (and thus more "newer" add-on compatibility, try Basilisk.

Take into account though, that most "new" addon versions for FF were made due to the browser breaking stuff with each update and not necessarily of improved features for the addon itself.

>>889265

Should have gone with that at least. Falkon sucks, Qupzilla was better.


 No.889410

>>889387

The morons who don't know how to set extensions.blocklist.level to 3 aren't worth listening to anyways. They're just looking for something to complain about.


 No.889460

>>888751

> no good solution

use webkit or qt to write one yourself, it's not as hard as you think, you aren't reinventing the wheel because webkit/qt does all the work but you should retain good control over privacy settings.

>>888821

>Whatever sucks about Firefox sucks in Chrome ten times as hard

except performance, chromium is atleast 50% faster than firefox.

>>888851

>Yeah, Mozilla is far less abusive than Google

not anymore, pozjew is just as bad if not worse than chromium.

sign in so we can datamine and sell everything you do - check

webext locked down so all webext requires a kosher stamp - check

datamining telemetry by default - check

option to install botnet voluntarily (not even chromium does this) - check

datamining even if telemetry is disabled (google telemetry on addons page) - check

atleast with chromium you get performance.

>>888871

> common browser extension platform that works across multiple browsers.

webext

>>888889

>GENTOO WINS AGAIN

gentoo disables the data choices tab on pozjew, the only way to disable telemetry is by hand in about:config.

>Addon requirement leaves only two choices - Firefox based or Chrome based

webkit and qtwebengine both support webext (though arguably webengine is essentially chromium).

>>889018

>qutebrowser

qutebrowser has a pozzed CoC and is just a front-end for QT, do it yourself and so no to the Poz

>>889078

native messaging solves this, but it's a pain to setup and for the user to install, (you have to put shit in the registry in windows), the user is going to have to use and your going to have to create a seperate installer and link to it from inside the webext (i don't even think you can link to it from the webext and make any attempt to automate the process and still get your kosher stamp from mozilla/google).

native messaging is essentially:

webext->json->stdin->(your program)->json->stdout->webext

it's not run in any VM or jail or anything, it should have full access to everything.


 No.889560

Most browsers are shit anyways. Be it webkit or something.

How did I know?

Set up a server yourself, try to make that said server LOG itself on how many requests are made on it (or use an IP logger)

You'll see most browsers show 2 requests or even more. You can see your IP then another IP from Mountainview CA - I guess you already know what company lives there. On other browsers it's using MacHomOSeX - they're probably another spy agency but you should already know that nothing is safe and if you still religiously do think its safe then you're stupid and there's no cure for stupidity.

All are botnet

chrome botnet

furryfox botnet but tries hard not to be

firefox botnet soros-sjw-backed

torbundle botnet suffers the above

icecat is like furryfox but lazier

other "insert web engine rebrand" are all shit and very low on opsec (fingerprintable) while most of them suck google's dick (mountainview ca on logs)

since everything is botnet the only way to save yourself is to implement a botnet yourself.

try rat-ing a wangblows noobs or some company if you want a 9-5 stable connection and routing all your request in there.

If you can't beat the botnet, be the botnet.

HH


 No.889561

>>889560

>Set up a server yourself, try to make that said server LOG itself on how many requests are made on it (or use an IP logger)

You get it. I actually did these tests a long time ago. And I checked not only requests made at the start, but also while visiting the new tab pages for example. Some requests appear only once a day. Firefox, Icecat, Palemoon, Vivaldi, Opera, Slimjet all spy on you.

Some of the results are on this website: https://spyware.neocities.org/articles/ (not mine but was submitting articles). I wanted to submit more but the guy stopped caring about the project so I did as well. Might make my own with a better format.


 No.889594


 No.889604

File: 6d3d7f77f5e969d⋯.png (1.77 MB, 1000x7440, 25:186, 6d3d7f77f5e969d07336bc02fe….png)

Oh, great. Yet another stupid browser shill thread. At least post the obligatory infograph.


 No.889605

File: 00b99acfa025feb⋯.png (1.02 MB, 1200x900, 4:3, 034.png)

>>889561

Shit site.

But I'm interested about discoveries you made; by that I mean "features" I can't disable or disable easily.


 No.889675

>>889460

>webext

again, I really hope this gets supported on QtWebEngine and WebKitGTK browsers


 No.889680

>>889675

it is, atleast with GNU/webkit, i can't find anything about it with Qt

https://webkitgtk.org/reference/webkit2gtk/stable/WebKitWebExtension.html


 No.889683

>>888790

>>888789

I was using PINE for email as late as 2005. Never tried this place in lynx, but I have a new linux box I need to test... hmm...


 No.889686

>>889680

That's something different, entirely unrelated to WebExtensions as in Chromium/Firefox extensions.


 No.889716

>>889605

Yup, site is shit. I suggested some more modern look to the creator but he ignored it. And now it's dead.

Anyway, from my tests IceCat is 90% the same as Firefox, so forget about it. Palemoon upon its first run connects to its first run page (you can't avoid it), and that has google ads and pixel trackers from rubiconproject. THen it connects to its start.me page which makes 120+ different requests. These include google ads of course, google analytics, twitter ads, "scorecardresearch", again pixel trackers, and a bunch of other trackers. You end up with 47 different cookies just from this, many of which contain unique IDs which will probably track you again anytime you visit the palemoon website. Also the requests tell the sites where it came from, so they know you're a palemoon user.

Some of the usual firefox issues also apply, like downloading automatically a blocklist of addons, and others.

I have to make that website after all, I guess.


 No.889749

Abandoning the only decent browser left just because it has some options that are easily worked around in a couple of minutes when you first run it?

Holy crap, /tech/. Fuck you.


 No.889758

>>889749

It's not only that and you know it.


 No.889769

>>889749

you should get off your knees and then remove the poz from your browser if you want people to like it again.


 No.889775

>>889604

graphic is shit

>Waterfox is just firefox

No changes:

Disabled Encrypted Media Extensions (EME) by default

Disabled Web Runtime (deprecated as of 2015)

Removed Pocket

Removed Telemetry

Removed data collection

Removed startup profiling

Allow running of all 64-Bit NPAPI plugins

Allow running of unsigned extensions and full add-ons

Removal of Sponsored Tiles on New Tab Page

Addition of Duplicate Tab option (toggle with browser.tabs.duplicateTab, thanks to PandaCodex)

Locale selector in about:preferences > General (further improved by PandaCodex)

Cookie Prompt see image


 No.889920

>>889775

This, anyone who regards waterfox being the same as firefox (or with simply minimal difference) is an idiot.


 No.889922

>>889775

>>889920

>Hey look we changed the default compile flags!

>We swear its different

kys


 No.889947

Does anyone know if Brave calls home to google? I've heard that chromium does this, which is what Brave is based on.


 No.889950

File: ee2c39dc52f62a3⋯.png (526.12 KB, 1185x992, 1185:992, 873e84d9c897224b5b62ee0e83….png)

You can only run IceCat on Linux... doesn't help mainstream adoption. You're supposed to support winblows and hackintosh but slowly nudge users to the libre way with subliminal and over messaging.


 No.889951

>>889950

Wow. It's amazing how blatantly wrong a person be about such obvious things while literally sitting right in front of a computer.


 No.889954

>>889775

>>889920

You're right. I hate these stupid browser threads since the differences between browsers is so trivial and it distracts from the real points, but, for the record, I wrote that before the Quantum switch. Yes, I know those features existed pre-Quantum--the compiler optimizations were sort of a red herring that distracted me from the parts of it that were actually worthwhile. I considered writing a new graphic that was less stupid, but then I realized that browser discussions among stupid laymen who will cling to any minor, impertinent technical flaw to dismiss your bigger arguments is a bit like being Sisyphus of your own volition.


 No.889959

Pale Moon is working just fine for me. What's the problem?


 No.890026

>>889947

Test it yourself? It probably does for certificates, safe browsing and google search auto complete at least.


 No.890027

>>889959

>webp support

>ad nauseam is malware because it hurts poor google

>if you want privacy you are a pedophile


 No.890030

>>889954

>hurr im retarded


 No.890224

>>888871

>a common browser extension platform that works across multiple browsers

That by definition can't have low-level access to browser innards (since these are different in every browser) and therefore can't do anything interesting. An ad blocker might be possible with proper hooks provided, but forget about interface hacks like Vimperator.

We already have WebExtensions and they're shit for exactly this reason.


 No.890235

>>888871

>common browser extension platform that works across multiple browsers

NPAPI


 No.890253

>>888887

>>888889

Because it's so hard to patch a PKGBUILD. Retards.

You both deserved to be off by one. Kek hath spoken.


 No.890279

>>890224

They seem to be doing a good job though. We got adblockers, vim keybind addons, umatrix, and pretty much all my other privacy addons. I used to be really skeptical of webextensions, but they don't seem THAT bad.


 No.890285

>>889951

Link me to the official binary releases for Windows and Mac. The mainstream users won't bother compiling.


 No.890290

>>890285

mainstream users can't compile unless they install development software which they won't


 No.890296

>>888741

>Removing the ability to disable javascript completely

about:config - javascript.enabled - false

>Anti privacy shit like pocket

Is open source, can be disabled, is removable from the source.

>google / yahoo as default search engine

The large majority doesn't use anything other than Google. They default to Yandex in Russia and Baidu in China. If you ask me the only thing they should change is make Qwant the default for EU countries.

This can be changed, can be changed in the source code.

>Removing support for many addons

They didn't do such thing. They changed to a better engine and have the devs 3 years to port addons. If your shitty addon isn't supported then it wasn't good to begin with or it was abandoned anyways.

>all Firefox forks are dependent on Firefox in the end

How is this an argument?

>Iridium, so I think that should be used

Iridium depends on chromium. Here, I'm turning your argument against you. Blink/WebKit is a significantly worse engine when it comes to features and privacy, so by default Firefox is better than any chromium browser if that's your concern.


 No.890424

USE CYBERFOX

FFS, /tech/.


 No.890425

>>890424

>CYBERFOX

Isn't it abandonware?


 No.890429

why are you still using Firefox,

the devs sold their souls years ago


 No.890437

>>890296

Interesting how you didn't respond to the hundreds of unsolicited connections Firefox makes.

>edit the source code

Of course, you can even make your own browser that way, but then it's not "Firefox" anymore. So I'm judging it by the DEFAULTS, and the defaults are terrible.

Why are you still shilling for this turd?


 No.890444

>>890027

>webp support

I'm confused. Are you somehow mad that it doesn't support this piece of shit obsolete-out-of-the-gate format?


 No.890470

>>890444

I'm mad that he actively went out if his way to support that proprietary google crap. Remember:

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=600919

https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=856375


 No.890625

>>890027

>>if you want privacy you are a pedophile

WAT?

never been using it so I have no idea why you wrote that

>>890437

Firefox + a few simple patches that are easy to rebase = still Firefox (for all practical purposes)


 No.890636

>>890625

user.js is anything but simple


 No.890697

>>890027

>>890444

From what I read in this forum thread, I'm not seeing the issue: https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=16231

>>890027

>ad nauseam is malware because it hurts poor google

This is fucking stupid, but at least it can be turned off. I understand that they want their shekels so they have an interest in not having the (((ad industry))) die. I simply don't care and would gladly automate ad clicks on a machine that isn't my own to cause the kikes harm. Ads are cancer.

>if you want privacy you are a pedophile

Don't know where you're getting this one from, but many normalfags think this. It's unfortunate, but truly, even some people that make unquestionably good shit probably think this. I'm not going to boycott Pale Moon just because Moonchild is a degenerate furfag dumbass. Pale Moon looks and behaves the way I want it to, has all the extensions I need for the time being, and continues to improve. When they fuck up more seriously, then I'll consider looking into alternatives again or just killing myself, because the internet is already completely fucked. Thanks kikes, you ruined it.


 No.892656

File: 0a9e094d93854fb⋯.png (57.49 KB, 586x336, 293:168, EvenDJBHatesSystemd.png)

>>888871

> Mandatory Poettering

Fact: Firefox also implemented JACK support when they removed alsa. Fuck Poetterware, be a man, run JACK and install Claudia/Cadence to manage it.


 No.892718

>>888741

Use Firefox ESR. It's essentially version 52 with security updates, so all the addons work. Freeze there.

Disable pocket. Change the search engines. You don't need lots of scripts, the guys at privacytools and eff have a list of shit to do to the about:config pag.

Run noscript with the settings from Tor Browser default, Run uBlock Origin with default plus a few extra anti-social privacy checks on the 3rd-party list. Run Privacy Badger.

That will buy you time for later to decide what to run.

Then you're done.


 No.892728

https://github.com/mozillareality/firefoxreality

They're working on a VR bowser it seems.

Should we be concerned?


 No.892732

>>892728

Why? This is nothing more than an experiment. They do experiments to implement different ideas all the time.


 No.892743

>>892718

>Use Firefox 3.6. Freeze there.

>Use Firefox 27. Freeze there.

>Use Firefox 52. Freeze there.

We've been there many times already. And guess what, this "freeze there" thing has never worked out in the long run, because each and every "muh FF final stand" version eventually became outdated and obsolete to the point of not being practically much usable anymore, and everyone had to move on anyway. It won't be any different this time, why should or would be?


 No.892745

>>892656

Telling every Linux user to use JACK is like having told every Audigy user to use Kx drivers.


 No.892748

>>889749

>Holy crap, /tech/. Fuck you.

And doesn't it make (you) feel better? The larpers won tonight. Now they can all sleep soundly and every fucking thing is alright.


 No.892749

>>892743

everything becomes outdated eventually

>muh ff final stand

don't put words into my mouth fucktard

i was really clear that it's a temporary solution to buy you time to find something

personally i don't think anything out there is a perfect solution but for now it seems to me that freezing ff is better than most alternatives

and esr versions seem to never get a mention on these threads, it's as if people forget they exist for some reason, even though they're the source of the forks and in wide use by corporate clients


 No.892804

>>892728

I remember reading some architecture blog a year or so ago complaining that you had to download a specific development build of Firefox to get WebVR working and that nobody was using it since it was far too difficult for your average user to get working properly.

They should have done this from the start instead of trying to make their main browser support VR on multiple platforms. Seems to be more pointless busywork similar to Firefox OS or their IoT framework Project Things.


 No.892820

>>892656

lol Firefox audio still doesn't work. Literally the only browser I've ever had hardware issues with. I mean seriously what a fucking botch.


 No.892874

File: facca3cb68b85ca⋯.png (75.41 KB, 237x276, 79:92, 1423980661587.png)

>>889126

can someone answer this fine young gentleman?


 No.892943

>>888751

> Anything based on chromium is botnet and can't be unboneted.

Why? You have the source code. And the design is arguably better than Firefox from a security POV, as Theo explains in this talk:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=FzJJbNRErVQ


 No.892953

>>892749

>don't put words into my mouth fucktard

I didn't say you said that literally. Nevertheless that's exactly what had been happening again and again, people trying to entrench themselves with the last Firefox version before a major change. And everytime they have moved on eventually after clinging on to that version stopped being practically viable.

>it's a temporary solution to buy you time to find something

If you haven't found any permanent alternative by now, you're not very likely to find one anytime soon.


 No.892960

>>892943

>designed around adobe flash player and adopting Eich's terrible mess, designed by an ad company with solid ties to yankee intelligence communities, part of the greatest target for identity fraud on the desktop for the past five years, at least

many eyes are too busy watching youtube or designing 'features' to bother searching for bugs


 No.893259

>>889070

It is still there in Firefox, it was only removed from the GUI.

about:config --> javascript.enabled;false


 No.893304

File: 6cc35c554464e00⋯.png (1.55 MB, 1252x11275, 1252:11275, furfags_ruin_everything.png)

>>889604

>Palemoon

https://github.com/jasperla/openbsd-wip/issues/86

<Furfag supporter

>OpenBSD

<You will revise your mozconfig located at www/palemoon/files/mozconfig to remove the following:

<We do not allow system libs to be used with official branding because it deviates from official configuration. You must comply with the directive or you must disable official branding for your builds.

<Additionally, you will please explain and justify the patches you are applying in www/palemoon/patches.

>I will do no such thing until I speak with the person who owns the rights to the intellectual property, which appears to be not you.

>Additionally, your confrontational attitude dismisses you from any and all future discussions on the matter. I will only speak to M.C. Straver about this issue, and I wish to do so amicably. Your attitude demonstrates that you are unfit to be an intermediary of any sort.

<@ibara You could have just complied. I don't see the problem. You know, except for this being a direct violation of the terms for redistribution with official branding as you are materially changing the end result of the intended software beyond what is absolutely necessary for the application's operation on BSD.

<I became aware of this because a user pointed out they were using Pale Moon on BSD. A Build I was unaware of so I came to check out what exactly was going on with it since you had used Official Branding.

>This repository does not create nor distribute binaries. This repository is not official in any way.

>Again, you are dismissed from this conversation since you have no legal authority over the matter.

<Point 8b, my friend. Also, Moonchild will respond in his own time but I suggest you stop being rude to me.. All I did was point out issues with your imposed build configuration and gave you options under the Redistribution License for which I know very well and have had to obey for my own build once upon a time.

>I suggest you leave then.

King Furfag:

<Your insistence to only speak to me in person about such matters is ridiculous, considering the license is up on the website, worded clearly for everyone to see, and you're clearly not adhering to it. But, here I am, as requested.

<Now, follow the license terms, please.

<I will not be as educational next time.

<You think trademark law is a joke?

>This issue is now officially resolved. There will be no Pale Moon browser, official or not. The port has been removed. Farewell, petulant children.


 No.893317

Chrome has added Anti Virus that Scans personal Files on Your PC,didn't inform >>>/n/608019


 No.893326

>>889387

falkon is still heavily under development you fucking retard


 No.893355

>>888741

Only answer is anon-supported project or pressuring spazilla to reverse course... quantum is worse than chromium

>>888799

no thx chromecuck, brave is just another partial clone


 No.893549

>>893304

all he had to do was to call it 'new moon' and it would have been fine

furfaggots confirmed for copyright trolls


 No.893644

>>893304

Can you explain why in any way it's the fault of Palemoon?

There is a licence, they have to respect it. That's it.

Where is the problem? Can't follow rules while smoking weed with an anarchist flag in the back?,God, I smell the vegan/left bullshit at kilometers in the whole conversation. He never went "offensive" in any way. Actually, if they're looking at this speech as "offensive", then seriously... How are they making it in real life?

It doesn't even look like a fucking monstrous change to do...


 No.895057

>>888947

>javascript.enabled;0

have fun browsing websites that are made after 2005


 No.895088

Microsoft won the browser war of the 90s defeating Netscape (by any means necessary, but they did). Mozilla won the browser war of the 00s (not much of a war really, given that after their earlier victory MS mostly just sat there with an "IE6 oughtta be enuff for anybody" attitude). But Google won the browser war of the 10s.


 No.895240

>>888751

>Palemoon is shit and doesn't give a shit about freedom.

last I heard Palemoon doesnt support webms newer than yuv420 either


 No.895241

>>893644

I believe the issue was them jumping down a volunteers throat


 No.895249

>>888751

>Anything based on chromium is botnet and can't be unboneted.

What about Iridium? I use that alongside Pale Moon.


 No.895272

>>888741

WaterFox


 No.895317

>>895272

Yes, we should dump WaterFox


 No.895503

>>893259

Yeah, dumping all the options there is precisely the issue.


 No.895504

>>895272

I use it but the real hotness is cyberfox man


 No.896588

File: 28a864cdec4a222⋯.png (33.8 KB, 1199x360, 1199:360, browser bullshit.png)


 No.896941

>>896588

'''NoScript is harmful and promotes Malware! - liltinkerer

https://liltinkerer.surge.sh/noscript.html'''


 No.897428

>>888871

userjs could do this but doesn't for some reason

idk if theres an equivelent cross platform script manager for other languages


 No.897433

>>889947

allegedly there is no build of chromium that can stop it from phoning home including iridium


 No.897826

>>897433

Briefly tested it out. The only issue with Iridium is the connection to the google safebrowsing list, which can be disabled in Preferences. Otherwise there is no unsolicited requests. So this is the browser to use for now.


 No.897828

>>897826

Of course, some requests could appear after a day or so, I don't know. But since the other browsers all send a bunch of requests at the start, and Iridium doesn't, I assume it's safe.


 No.897830

>>893644

The issue is that it was created as a fork from FF because FF rammed shit down everyone's throat against their will.

Now these furfags are doing the same shit.


 No.897854

>>888741

We need a new FF fork that isn't made by furry cuck fetishists.

they gimped addons because it was the only way for you to have privacy on the web.


 No.897891

>>897854

No, we need to move away from giants Mozilla and Google. More forks just means more dependency on them.


 No.897903

>>897826

How can I see this unsolicited requests?


 No.897905

>>897903

Install mitmproxy (or a similar program). Run it and set browser proxy settings to it (default 127.0.0.1:8080). Then you'll be able to see all the requests.


 No.897907

>>897903

Also use a NEW BROWSER INSTALL, because many of the requests are only made once...


 No.897909

>>897907

And for FF-based browsers it means you need to copy a config file with the proxy settings. Chrome based can run with proxy settings defined from command line.


 No.897923

>>897905

If the browser is kind enough to do unsolicited requests over the proxy.


 No.897931

>>897923

Ha! Didn't think of it. You're right, a browser could ignore the proxy settings if it wants. But I was able to fish out some Vivaldi spying, so I guess you will get most of them.


 No.899065

>>895240

>only questionable things done are: putting a warning for an add-on that turns your machine DOS-bot against ad companies and telling a soyboy that they have to abide by their license if they want to distribute their software with their brand/logo

Please tell me, where did Moonchild hurt you?


 No.899095

File: 482293bcfb4b8dc⋯.png (2.31 MB, 1351x7508, 1351:7508, Screenshot-2018-4-16 TenFo….png)

>>888741

Give me another Linux-compatible browser that has a dedicated web developer edition and a full screen mode that shows tabs. And no, neither Pale Moon or Waterfox will cut it (and not just because of their antiquated designs).


 No.899119

File: 80f44ef0755879f⋯.png (183.55 KB, 1054x738, 527:369, pale.png)

>>888741

I have every add-ons I need not to mention there's useless add-ons included in my pic.

The blue dot represents pale moon add-ons and orange is from firefox store and mostly outdated but still werks.

If any, I'd be complaining about my outdated addon thanks to add-on's native version restrictions although there's a way to force install which might eat up all of my bookmarks so no.

If you're weary about the opsec then you should be using tbb although it's a soros honeypot by now (like every sorosfox clone except palememe)

>>888749

try Falkon. its got non-fucked vertical tabs now.


 No.899121

>>899095

>a full screen mode that shows tabs

so not full screen?


 No.899129

>>899095

wtf is a webdev edition?

soydev? lol

>full screen shows tabs

tree tabs have this option

>antiquated designs

>doesn't inject css codes to his browser.xul using stylish


 No.899134

>>899121

Use the "Hide Toolbars" option if you want to see nothing but a webpage.


 No.899146

>>893304

I think palemoon is in the right tho.

>points issues that fuck compatibility with BSD with a direct request

>OpenBSD says muh IP owner, ask wolf

>issue opener says point 8b

>OpenBSD screams REEEE you are barred from this conversation (argumentum ad verecundiam)

>wolf (IP owner) enters and point 8 it is (shame to the previous post LOL) - change branding

since browsers in general are a clusterfuck and it's considered a different port now with those changes (also makes it easier to distinguish)

>pinkdpfag comes in with "that escalated qiuckly" 9gag meme joke (seriously, calm your memespouting)

>complains about the tone although wolf is really logical and calm in the entire conversation while this pinkdpfag keeps on instigating and "im sorry but lowkey fuck you ./."

>closing in-circle talks about "sigh, dying userbase when they should be licking the soles of our shoes for le golden official port" - bsdfags

>although was given an answer the choice is theirs (rebrand = favorable to the userbase)

>closes issue and drops palemoon port due to shame + ad hominems "petulant children"

There's literally no problem building pale moon when using the right mozconfig but these bsdfags are too anal retentive

Lol.


 No.899153

>>896588

>ESR

>built-in pocket hello and market

I chuckled.

>noscript

>allow scripts by millisecond

fail unsafe*

>badger

>google cookie whitelist

>more suspicious shit

nice try 3-letter,

>no built-in canvas poison

heh


 No.899386

>>896588

>Duck Duck Go

Ran by a guy who used to work for a data mining company.

Use ixquick.eu instead, or searx.me.

>tell them to "do not track me"

Optimally, you don't want to tell them anything.


 No.899403

>>889144

Just tried out Falkon on my old laptop with Win7 and so far it's working great but couldn't get H264 video working.


 No.899421

tl;dr: Every fucking webbrowser is shit.


 No.899447

>>893644

>MUH LICENSE

Crying about a minor issue over a FREE BROWSER that's already a fork itself

I bet if it was Mint/Ubuntu/a distro with a huge userbase, palemoon fags would have have at least been ALOT nicer. Maybe even not given a fuck.


 No.899451

>>893644

>>899146

Palemoon devs are ITT


 No.899458

File: f40610f102fee2b⋯.png (124.58 KB, 400x225, 16:9, 1431719608967.png)

Lifelong Firefox user here, I think modern Firefox sucks but guess what, the only other cross platform option is webkit-clones and I think they're all worse. I've tried for AT LEAST 3 months each Vivaldi, Brave, Nu-Opera.

Each have some exclusive benefits but a whole package of detriments. Just like Firefox. It all fucking sucks and I want to die. I wish original Opera was maintained, that seemed alright but now I'll never know because soon we'll have 1 options. webkit, webkit, or webkit.

Simply this >>899421

anger.


 No.899506

>>888741

>to disable javascript

i noticed too that

https://addons.mozilla.org/bg/firefox/addon/javascript-control/

doesn't disable js like

about:config?filter=javascript.enabled

does


 No.899515

>>899095

>all this faggotry

Good thing I dropped furfaggotry: the browser™©®℗

IF ANYONE OF YOU FAGGOTS DARE CHANGE THAT TEXT OR USE furfaggotry: the browser™©®℗ WITHOUT MY EXPRESS PERMISSION, I'LL GUT YOU, YOUR FAMILY, YOUR CHILDREN, YOUR DOG, OR YOUR CAT BEFORE I SHARIA YOUR HEAD OFF


 No.899517

>>899458

You're angry because you're helpless. You're helpless because you refuse to invest development time into your software. When you choose to sustain an investment into the web browser that you desire, you no longer have to be angry about being helpless.


 No.899521

>>899458

Oh well. Where are the simpler times when Internet Explorer 6 (or even 5.5) was enough for anybody, and no-one had problems such as these? Where did it all go wrong?


 No.899774

>>889604

>Firefox

>They're punching up

>Among circles like in 4chan

End your life blogshitter.


 No.899780

>>888741

I want a non webkit browser that is good, firefox and it forks are currently the best option


 No.899790

>>899780

what's wrong with webkit?


 No.899802


 No.899811

Has Beaker browser ever been mentioned? I thought it seemed neat a while back. But I am not very /tech/.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2B9mwRFE8U


 No.899946

>>899811

>that UI

>p2p

>webapps

trash


 No.899969

>>888751

Honestly surprised nobody has tried throwing w3c out the fucking window and made something more lightweight based on their own protocols.


 No.899971

>>899946

>p2p

>bad


 No.900011

Anyone mind helping an anon get Flash and H264 running on Falkon since it's the best alternative to Firefox and Chrome?


 No.900018

just use Tor and shut your trap


 No.900101

>>897854

>move away from furry cuck fetishits

>they are the only ones doing proper work

Too bad projects like Otter are so slow and stuff like Qupzilla is tied to KDE shit.

Which means that everyone sane should join forces with either the furry who actually just work or suffer irrelevancy.


 No.900102

>>900018

>please use NSA-Cuckfox

No.


 No.900202

>>899458

>vivaldi brave nu-opera

Are you a winfag? install Falkon browser, if not.

IIRC brave can't even handle file download that even a visual basic 6 project template can do more stuff than brave.

>firefox was good

nope. firefox is the blame how this google botnet propagated.

>firefox before was good

>native cookie manager got removed temporarily - this was the sign

>forced google homepage

>firefox joint project with google

>log all bookmarks history for safebrowsing(tm)

this was around 2009 if I remember

>>900101

did you mean qt shit? which year are you from?

>Depends On

qt5-webengine qt5-x11extras qt5-svg

>Optional Deps

kwallet : kf5 kwallet integration

libgnome-keyring : gnome keyring integration


 No.900563

>>900202

Got Falkon running on windows but can't get Flash working even though it's enabled in the settings and ppapi is installed.


 No.900826

File: b8b7b52fdbb8e2a⋯.png (143.78 KB, 550x400, 11:8, booopbooop.swf.png)

>>900563

>Flash

>2018

>>900202

>Widows

Currently but not exclusively.

>Falkon

I'll give it a look.

>>899517

>When you choose to sustain an investment into the web browser that you desire, you no longer have to be angry about being helpless.

You may be right, I have treated other tools in the same way and the investment was worth it. However, that was when I had much more free time.

I feel like switching browsers is like switching keyboard layout, it may be worth it long term but you sacrifice productivity for a while, which is hard for me to deal with. That's where I feel helpless, maybe I will push through it now. It could lead to a positive end.


 No.900832

>>900826

If you're switching from FF-based to Chrome-based, there's not much difference (unless some addon you use is unavailable, I guess).

Falkon is unusable. No addons.


 No.900834

File: 2ab0f3026d77dcc⋯.jpg (286.87 KB, 700x420, 5:3, orangulaugh.jpg)

>I feel like switching browsers is like switching keyboard layout, it may be worth it long term but you sacrifice productivity for a while

productivity on the internet?


 No.900870

>>900832

It's a lot of little things, like in Firefox it saves the download path you last used on a per site basis, other browsers don't. But that works both ways, the F2 command menu thing and the fast-forward function in Vivaldi is cool and I don't see that in other browsers either. Firefox doesn't hang like other browsers when you have an absurd amount of tabs and windows. There's no obvious "best", each choice feels like a compromise.


 No.900893

>>899458

>use Pale Moon on Win and Linux (Debian)=It just works

>use Basilisk on Win and Linux (Debian)=It just works

>use Qupzilla (now KDE Neon) on Win and Linux (Debian)=It just works

Why are you such a crybaby?

Presto Opera was GOAT though, what happened to the "bringing it back with the leaked source code" project?


 No.901063

Okay, I installed Flash (PPAPI) and some websites work while others don't while H264 isn't working at all even though I have gstreamer installed and tested to be working on windows.

>>900826

It's not my fault some websites are slow to update to HTML5.

>>900832

It's working great here since all I use is adblock and userscript shit.


 No.901155

>>888741

Isnt iridium just chromium? whats the difference?


 No.901162

>>901155

It's a fork. Apparently has privacy protections, but for all I know it's placebo shit.


 No.901163

>>888741

Use brave


 No.901164

>>901163

>no extensions


 No.901170

>>901155

>>901162

All I know is that, from my tests, it doesn't send any requests that I didn't send myself. That is my standard.


 No.901182

File: 6011198b0098caf⋯.jpg (28.31 KB, 688x359, 688:359, 1451271699062.jpg)

>>900893

>Why are you such a crybaby?

0 male roll models.

>it just works

Emphatically all web browsers will render web pages, but that only puts them on equal ground with every other one.

I don't want to settle for something that just works, I want something that works as well.

I would say that Firefox worked well before but has regressed. Using a fork of the outdated version seems very risky as the maintainers may suddenly drop the project at any moment, which is not uncommon with Firefox in particular, there are many abandoned forks. If one of the major browsers (Opera) couldn't keep up, how can I place my trust in a hobby project?

If I was an asshole I'd ask you "why are your standards so low", the components and concepts to to make a good browser seemingly already exist, it just seems like nobody is implementing them, or in the case of Firefox, implementing them and then removing them.

>what happened to the "bringing it back with the leaked source code" project?

Last I saw they moved the patches repo to some self hosted thing and nobody pushed anything since. Maybe there's recent development happening on non-English sites though.

Maybe it's time that I invest in a project of my own. The problem doesn't seem to be money or software, it seems to be people. Maybe the only sane choice left is to hire my own team for my own damn browser because that's the state of things right now, that's how shitty it's become. Multiple billion-dollar companies can't manage to produce a simple product with all their funds, foundation, and talent.

I think you misinterpret my frustration and disgust as "crying", maybe they're 1 and the same but I'll tell you honestly, the thing I feel is anger.


 No.901240

>>901182

>Multiple billion-dollar companies can't manage to produce a simple product with all their funds, foundation, and talent.

They can manage, they choose not to.

How would your browser look like?


 No.901337

>>901162

>>901170

Any auditing? anything at all? or is just chromium with mods users could do themselves?

Also does it have some sort of sync?


 No.901340

File: b9ebaab6c1bc445⋯.png (21.96 KB, 857x723, 857:723, Untitled.png)

>>901240

It would look like the Airbus browser but it would link to a 24 hour livestream of ladyboys instead of all this other useless shit.


 No.901369

File: 1a7b40ffc6277d5⋯.jpg (10.92 KB, 411x292, 411:292, Dog_raising_paw.jpg)

>>888741

I have a question for you all:

How about we get together and build a new browser from scratch?


 No.901420

>>901369

From scratch meaning engine included? Impossible, forget about it. Could join Otter project.


 No.901455

>>901369

That's a really good idea. I'll get started on the logo.


 No.901854

Then what browser should I be using on android then? Brave is jewing users with targeted ads and Fennec F-Droid is a firecuck fork.


 No.901893

>>901854

Orfox without TOR. It is about as little botnet as you can get but the browser's search bar pings out to the search engine you use on clicking it. But that is still miles better the chrome or upstream firefox botnets. Granted unless you want to port palemoon to android again then you still have to deal with not being able to make your orfox browser look like some random version of internet explorer or something like that.

>palemoon is firecuck fork

It is a fork from a like seven or so year old codebase which means no botnet or backdoors that have been inserted from the last seven years. But yet you still get security/performance/stability updates.


 No.902020

>>901893

How2 unTOR Orfox?


 No.902022

>>902020

about:config settings, look for the redirect to 127.0.0.1


 No.902138

>>899969

I'm surprised too. We could go with lean data-only protocols (RSS-ish) and let the end clients decide how to render it. Most likely the internet will go back to terminal form if done right.


 No.902782

File: c1452e1cc8c4733⋯.gif (9.21 KB, 302x397, 302:397, 07_03b_gopher[1].gif)

>>899969

let's gopher


 No.902785

>>902782

Is there any real difference between gopher and ftp


 No.902817

I just spent half an hour trying to get IceCat to work on a debian-based system that isn't Trisquel. I couldn't get it to work. What the fuck.


 No.902910

>>902782

We should have stopped at Netscape.


 No.902927

>>902785

FTP is kinda convoluted in how it uses two ports and active/passive mode. Gopher is simpler, and it also supports server-side scripting (not to the same extent as CGI scripts though).


 No.905607

File: d78f398e95f9966⋯.png (240.35 KB, 406x471, 406:471, rf wise guy not sure if wa….png)

>>888741

>browser is making anti-user decisions

>let's dump its forks


 No.905614

>>902927

>FTP 2 Ports

What 2 ports?


 No.905688

>>905607

IceCat and Waterfox are 99% clones of FF. Palemoon slightly diverged but has most of the problems of FF and new ones as well.


 No.905777

File: 41fbe66825716a2⋯.png (137.29 KB, 959x563, 959:563, health.png)


 No.906908

>>888741

Firefox's problem is that it doesn't know what clipboard formats to support or how to support them.


 No.906934

>>888799

Go back to cuckchan /g/


 No.906949

>Falkon

Is there a less retarded way of changing locale than physically removing locale files? Because QupZilla 2.6 has an option in settings for this.


 No.906980

Basilisk is the answer to all of our problems.

:^)


 No.906986

>>906980

>This browser is created and maintained by the team behind Pale Moon, and is a fully independent fork of the Mozilla/Firefox code.

Wat.


 No.907022

>>905614

20 and 21. One is for control commands, the other is for data transfer.

I believe SFTP (or was it FTPS? one or the other) makes this simpler by just having everything go over port 22.


 No.907026

>>907022

>SFTP or was it FTPS

22 is SSL/TLS and most, if not all, protocols that use it put the S first. Easy to remember that way.


 No.907037

>>907022

That's new to me. Thanks anon.


 No.907068

>>907026

> 22 is SSL/TLS

No it's not. Port 22 is just SSH. SFTP uses it because it is FTP-like file transfer over SSH. SSL doesn't have a dedicated port because it wouldn't make any sense. HTTPS uses 443 with SSL, SMTP often uses 465 with SSL when it isn't using STARTTLS.




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