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/tech/ - Technology

September 2018 - 8chan Transparency Report
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File: 0b5c108c4de8167⋯.jpg (45.99 KB, 740x400, 37:20, lightweight-minimal-gnome-….jpg)

 No.914777

 No.914781

Reminder to use i3-gaps, bspwm, or dwm on X, and Sway on Wayland.


 No.914782

It's gnome, I'm surprised that nautilus can still show files...

Will probably be removed with the next version.


 No.914791

File: d243f7ec7873e5b⋯.jpg (953.12 KB, 3136x1668, 784:417, gnomesjwomenoutreach.jpg)

Their 2 users must be pissed off.


 No.914793

This is parody, right?


 No.914812

>>914793

I wish, I can only hope that canonical feels retarded for using GNOME instead of literally anything else


 No.914813

>>914781

Reminder GNU Emacs is the one true window manager.

>>>/emacs/


 No.914830

So? You don't have to use it.


 No.914833

File: 3b0e68171063991⋯.jpg (307.01 KB, 1170x836, 585:418, systemd.jpg)

If it depends on this, it isn't worth using.


 No.914837

>>914833

I've been using Linux as a daily driver for 10 years now. I started with ubuntu which included pulseaudio. Of course sound never worked. I went on to Slackware which didn't use pulseaudio, of course sound worked. I went over to Gentoo without pulseaudio, of course sound worked. I went back to Slackware, but this time it had pulseaudio, of course sound didn't work.


 No.914839

>>914837

Build Firefox without PA on Gentoo.


 No.914849

>>914837

I personally hate how it takes 5-9% of cpu usage on my setup and the only thing it does alsa doesn't is allow you to control volume of programs individually.

Meanwhile I at most only ever have a music player and something else on the foreground that may or may not be playing audio and basically every music player ever has audio controls built in.

And alsa does it with lower audio latency and unmeasurable cpu usage.

Alsa is a straight up upgrade from pulseaudio and pulse is only ever used by tardy maintainers and projects who surrendered to Poettering's "gentle push" strategy.


 No.914853

>>914781

>i3-gaps

<muh gaps

Why use a fork for a meme feature when you can use the main branch? Although i3lock not having transparency sucks big time.


 No.914855

>>914853

Because gaps are comfy, silly!

>>914833

Remind me again what’s wrong with dbus and avahi in that picture. I totally get why PulseAudio and Systemd are bad, but not the other 2.

We kinda discussed this in another thread, but we didn’t really reach a clear answer.


 No.914860

>>914849

>Alsa is a straight up upgrade from pulseaudio

>Ancient Linux audio manager is an upgrade from something that's 10+ years it's junior

This is the state of modern computing.

PULSEAUDIO is completely unusable on first gen atoms.


 No.914865

>no features

>still bloated shit

wew, why is GNU still funding these cockheads?


 No.914866

>>914812

Still think the biggest joke was system76, their "popOS" as a result of ubuntu leaving unity is just a side by side gnome installation with less shit working


 No.914870

>>914866

I'm not an expert, but from the dozen articles I've read and multiple interviews, I have this vague suspicion that System76 had nothing to do with Unity and created PopOS because of Canonical's relationship with smaller vendors and how Canonical's shortcomings in assimilating System76 work into the mainline was reflected on System76's product, but they couldn't legally modify Canonical's distribution and still call it Ubuntu.

But your theory's cool, too.


 No.914872

>>914870

I am not an expert either, but I've toyed around with the distro and there's... a bunch to be desired. Then again gnome is trash so I'm obviously a bit biased


 No.914875

>>914872

That literally has nothing to do with System76's decision to author PopOS.


 No.914880

>>914875

> desktop environment

> nothing to do with decision in OS

I'm honestly confused.


 No.914887

>>914880

You are an idiot on so many levels.


 No.914888

>>914887

And you're a shill for clevo laptops. Gratz fam.


 No.914893

>>914865

G'nope has barely anything to do with the GNU project anymore.


 No.914897

>>914777

That's why you should use KDE.


 No.914898

>>914833

>systemd is baaaaddd

This meme was retarded from beginning and is increasingly retarded as time has progressed.


 No.914901

>>914898

Install Gentoo and YOTLD too. These memes are well beyond stale, but autists never let a meme die when they get ahold of them.


 No.914908

>remove features

<YOU CANNOT LAUNCH BINARIES UNLESS IT COMES FROM OUR REPOSITORIES GOYIM

that's some feature to remove.

this shit propagates too. you can't launch binaries from thunar in xfce4 either if they're PIE, you have to open up a terminal and ./foo


 No.914912

How can you write " launching apps based on users choices." in the same text titled "Don't allow launching binaries or programs in general"?

Also LOL @ the idiot saying that compiling a hello world and running it from nautilus is an "artificial" scenario.


 No.914919

>>914912

Well, it kinda is.

You're more likely to type

make hello
./hello
instead of clicking around your file manager after compiling something

Though, as rarely as I launch applications that way, it's still retarded to remove the functionality all together.


 No.914925

>>914908

>if they're PIE

Do you mean without PIE or do they just hate security?


 No.914928

>>914781

>tilling window managers

No thanks, I'm not retarded.


 No.914930

File: 79546cc3ced1103⋯.jpg (137.64 KB, 1280x720, 16:9, 79546cc3ced11033d1927f7a19….jpg)

>>914928

<Look how smart I am. I can handle keeping track of a messy desktop. Look how complex my desktop is. You brainlets can't handle software this complicated.


 No.914931

>>914925

i need to read more on it, but compiling my own C stuff i can't launch it from thunar if it's compiled with PIE enabled. there's some difference where thunar doesn't know how to run it. I don't see why, being as I can ./foo.out either way.

Thunar/xfce seems to be going the same way as gnome when it comes to this. Maybe it's time to ditch thunar and/or xfce too.


 No.914933

>>914919

and what about when you try to share it with others and it's gtk/qt GUI? Good luck trying to get your obscure shit into these package repositories if you even want it there. Assuming you want what you've written in one of these repositories, debian, jewbuntu, even gentoo, your going to have to go through 6 levels of kikery to get there and it's going to take years if they don't flat out ignore you.

This is designed with one goal in mind, discouraging use of anything that isn't in their official repositories. I'm suprised they haven't tried to patch the kernel or bash or something and require that the binary be fucking signed with their package manager before it'll execute. That's coming next I guarantee it.


 No.914935

File: af2615c0cadd44c⋯.png (109.88 KB, 1024x768, 4:3, cwm.png)

>>914928

>>914930

Floating minimal window managers (like cwm) are patrician.


 No.914936

>>914935

>I want to manually position and size my windows every time I open anything


 No.914939

>>914935

You might as well not use a Windows manager at all and just use X11 scripts to spawn windows


 No.914940

File: d4f0d515b57611e⋯.jpg (31.11 KB, 431x767, 431:767, 0rLWlPPtzlo0sqLMaNHTdrxXbS….jpg)

>>914930

>His windows gets squished into weird proportions

>he's autism makes him upset when windows don't line up with corners juuuuust right

>he uses GUI in TWM or spends hours configuring ncurses apps into doing 90% of what GUI apps do

TWM are for mentally ill people.

The mouse is there for a reason.


 No.914941

>>914936

I've had a literal autist to me that once.

When do you ever need to "position" anything in a FWM?

In TWMs, I'm constantly managing layouts and spending actual minutes fitting with does into weird layout constraints and it still does at work.

With FWM, you just use the window where it is or you place it literally anywhere with a single unified action that takes less than half a second (mouse AND keyboard).

Plus I can't even stack and layer windows.

I think TWM users just have mental problems.


 No.914942

>not just using an empty x session

Anything else is bloat.


 No.914950

File: 0bdd1653ef7130e⋯.png (236.81 KB, 1024x768, 4:3, shot1.png)

GNUSTEP is the way.

Name one thing 90s UI does worse or doesn't do.


 No.914957

>>914940

>His windows gets squished into weird proportions

Either use applications which play nicely with being resized, or just don't put 5 million windows on the same screen. You are encouraged to use multiple worksapces.

>he's autism makes him upset when windows don't line up with corners juuuuust right

Don't you think it looks worse that way?

>he uses GUI in TWM or spends hours configuring ncurses apps into doing 90% of what GUI apps do

There's nothing wrong in using GUI applications in a TWM. It's just that GUI application developers typically don't put the same amount of care that their application works on different sizes as terminal application developers.

So what if I spend time configuring emacs to just how I like it. Would you rather be limited in what you can do in an application?

>TWM are for mentally ill people.

I am not mentally ill.

>The mouse is there for a reason.

Yeah, but it's not there to click on windows or move them around.

>>914941

>I'm constantly managing layouts and spending actual minutes fitting with does into weird layout constraints and it still does at work

Use more workspaces.


 No.914965

>>914957

>use more workspaces

If I'm just going to fullscreen or splitscreen apps anyway, then what's the point of a TWM?

FWM do basic tiling and workspaces just fine and with less buggy floating modes too.

>emacs

A crippling disease of the hands. Nonsense command combos straight outta Mortal Kombat.

Mentally illness.


 No.914968

>>914941

>phoneposting

>calls others mentally ill


 No.914976

>>914898

>systemd isn't bad

kill yourself immediately kike


 No.914978

>>914968

>phoneposting

?


 No.914982

>>914976

you should look into a mirrored oven and gas yourself


 No.914999

File: 4bb2ef6d9b59882⋯.jpg (274.14 KB, 1440x1400, 36:35, 3fcaf50.jpg)

>>914777

Is that the naut no exec launch pr?

Lmao, just use launcher


 No.915020

>>914777

>launching binaries from file manager is something good

I want winfaggots to go back.


 No.915021

File: 536a659142ff93b⋯.jpg (280.74 KB, 612x720, 17:20, 1453475079515.jpg)

>>914976

Please limit your dragon dildo usage to max 18h a day you seem asspained.


 No.915022

>>914833

Principles, morals, why do they not appeal to younglings anymore?


 No.915024

>>915022

systemD does one thing well, it boots my system.

PulseAudio does one thing well, it routes my audio


 No.915026

>>914982

>gas

>>915021

>dragon dildo

>further proving your a kike

Some day I'll import an american gas chamber just for you my dear friend.

>>915024

>systemD does one thing well, it boots my system.

damn slow

>PulseAudio does one thing well, it routes my audio

damn bloated

Also UNIX philosophy sucks to begin with.


 No.915027

>>915026

*you're


 No.915035

Yeah it's dumb, but - who gives a shit about gNOme? Just use XFCE, Mate, etc...


 No.915047

>muh YOOOONEEKS philosophy

Is running a multi-user mainframe operating system developed 50 years ago on devices such as thermostats or home computers, right?

Friendly reminder, that Google employees adore Plan9 and other wow! Unix! bazing! beep-wahoo! cuckware projects, like bsd family of oses that lead to all the "cloud" and server-centered botnet we have to deal today with


 No.915061

They do it because crap like appimages makes it super easy to spread malware on Linux. Blame the kikes.


 No.915067

>>915061

>I want a walled garden of outdated software, that can equally become infected but at least it's signed by big daddy maintainer(tm) so it's ok


 No.915072

>>915047

>Is running a multi-user mainframe operating system developed 50 years ago on devices such as thermostats or home computers, right?

I'd call you a cocksucker otherwise, but this is a darn good point.


 No.915073

>>915072

>>915047

Its not like theres anything better.

if u think there is, name it


 No.915075

>>914791

Python is cancer. Or at least cancer-enabler.


 No.915077

>>914849

Each new generation must reinvent the wheel, poorly. Go ahead kids, make your argument for your new wheel. They will all be discarded in < 5 years. Those that expanded on what was already here making it better & faster will have their work live on.


 No.915079

>>915073

Windows.


 No.915081

>>914791

Damn those python bobbies!!!


 No.915090

File: 829252c923aabb2⋯.jpg (50.23 KB, 306x500, 153:250, Len-shota-len-kagamine-291….jpg)

>>915079

Look at this brainlet!

giggle at the brainlet! *giggles*

>>915075

>>915081

reminder that portage is written in python.

>>915061

perhaps the programs need to be sandboxed away from the rest of the system. isnt that what flatpak is doing?

I do agree that this could lead to the malware situation of windows if handled poorly.


 No.915107

>>914781

Reminder to gas tripfags on sight.


 No.915110

I'm such a MASSIVE faggot I can't have enough of cocks. *gulp* *chomp* *slurp*


 No.915117

>>914950

Dear god, that screenshot looks like a parody.


 No.915122

>>914940

The mouse is there to be used for programs like ACME, not so retards can fuss about with their fisher price UI.


 No.915145

>>914965

>what's the point of a TWM?

It formats the windows automatically. You don't have to spend time doing it yourself.

>A crippling disease of the hands.

My hands are just fine when using it.

>Nonsense command combos straight outta Mortal Kombat.

Most of the common ones are not random eg. C-x C-s for save, C-x C-c for close, C-x C-d to for dired, C-x C-k for kill buffer, etc.

If you don't like them, you can remind them. Since the editor is written in elisp, you can easily change stuff you don't like>>915090

.>perhaps the programs need to be sandboxed away from the rest of the system.

>>915090

>need to be sandboxed away

Why though? If it was really necessary, they could use seccomp to block some syscalls.


 No.915173

>>915122

>mouse is not for manipulating gui

>mouse is for writing text

plan9 fags, everybody


 No.915184

File: 079349baf5483c8⋯.png (600.94 KB, 2560x1600, 8:5, openstep_2560x1600_1.png)

>>915117

For those born before 2000 and XP VisualStyles, computers looked like this.

They look and work better.


 No.915186

>>915122

>>915173

Ackshually... mouse is a dedicated gaming peripheral, like a joystick or a gamepad. LOL@plebs using it for anything else.


 No.915191

>>914791

From row, second from the right. What gender is that thing?


 No.915196

>Flatpak provides the ability to run applications in an isolated environment and Nautilus is not an application launcher.

Wake me up inside.


 No.915198

>>915191

bearded m'lady


 No.915203

>>914965

>Nonsense command combos straight outta Mortal Kombat.

hahaha


 No.915204

>>915184

I used it on my laptop for a while and it worked like a charm


 No.915242

>>914791

Women need to go back where they belong, in dah kitchen. Everything they go near dies eg. BioWare, Mozilla, Blizzard, soon Gnome. I hate Gnome but it's good for the Gnome loving faggots to have their own DE.


 No.915255

>>915242

Gnome is a catch or bait for the cancer that is killing tech. Let it stay there and rot.


 No.915356

File: 35f0563fabaf0b0⋯.png (710.27 KB, 1920x1080, 16:9, Screenshot_20180516_193447.png)

>>915184

PikoPixel is about the only GNUStep app I use.


 No.915369

>>915356

you mind postng that akko?


 No.915380

>>915369

It's pixel art and there's a full preview in the image, do it yourself you big gay


 No.915388

>>915380

no fuck you


 No.915416

>>915356

Wow, that's really good.

Pikopixel is an awesome little program.

>>915380

How would you even do the colors? I guess artists can do it naturally?


 No.915560

>>915380

But the 100% one has its bizarre paraplegic limbs "cut off"


 No.915589

>>915242

Agreed, despite Isis Lovecruft & Qubes OS women in tech is a fucking disaster!


 No.915684

File: 5978dc80541501a⋯.png (320.93 KB, 1712x772, 428:193, isis agora lovecruft.png)

>>915589

>despite Isis Lovecruft

Her code is shit and so is she.


 No.915715

>>914919

there is a world beyond your cellar you incel.


 No.915756

>>915715

>"incel" as an insult

hello shlomo

>>>/gaschamber/


 No.915909

>>914837

install apulse then call your program with it

$ asound firefox-esr

it emulates pulse but just uses normal alsa, resulting in much less cpu usage


 No.915917

>>915909

>it emulates pulse

Why the fuck would anyone ever do that when libpulse can talk to bare alsa when there's no PA server running?


 No.915946

>>915917

Why even run it at all? Poetteringware is cancer.


 No.915947

>>915917

Firefux requires pulseaudio but it can't tell that you're using apulse, for one.


 No.915948

>>915909

I might do that. PulseAudio has never worked and it will never work.


 No.915950

>>915948

>PulseAudio has never worked and it will never work.

Works on my machine, works on every machine I have used for years. There were some fuck ups a long time ago, but it was new tech. Now I can plug in my USB headset on almost any machine and it just works.


 No.915953

File: 546d86314a8c005⋯.jpg (41.37 KB, 1000x1000, 1:1, gold_jack_ext_kenable.jpg)

>>915950

>USB headset

w-whats wrong with this? uwu


 No.915958

>>915953

Anon is probably using a headset with audio in/out. Many computers in current year, especially laptops lack an audio in port.


 No.916071

File: 2371bf5bd78d393⋯.jpg (55.47 KB, 600x810, 20:27, 2371bf5bd78d3937cfcb51089e….jpg)

xfce for the win, everything else is retarded.


 No.916095

>>915950

This, and USB DACs


 No.916104

>>914777

Finally. This will stop accidental opening of executables. Why did nobody think of this sooner?


 No.916118

>>914777

Even MacOS, even MAC, makes it a point to explicitly allow you to open .apps from the file manager.

Aqua is like KDE compared to GNOME.


 No.916138

>>915684

>I wish effort would be directed at preventing new CP & giving paedophiles some therapy, rather than going after the ones who DL old content

I can't tell if women who actively defend CP is some sort of pattern or not. There have been a few like this that I've seen.


 No.916154

I use KDE, never looked back. Default settings are not good, but once you do some tweaking and find all settings, unbeatable.


 No.916158

File: 85f76c5a807d810⋯.jpg (101.8 KB, 696x525, 232:175, exe.jpg)

>>916118

SpaceFM has both click to execute and tucked away (default)


 No.916179

>>915950

Fucking shill retard. Even if Pulse "works" it takes a shit ton of CPU.


 No.916635

XFCE has no new features since 2008 because it hasn't needed any. It's perfect.


 No.916637

>>916179

>Even if Pulse "works" it takes a shit ton of CPU.

Never on any of the machines I use.


 No.916713

>>915950

>>916095

You realize that's a driver issue and not something that PulseAudio addresses?


 No.916759

>>916637

It bottlenecks for me when I'm run programs that mix a lot of audio.

It's like some 90s pre-pentium shit on early 2010s laptop hardware.


 No.916766

>>914777

>having nautilus installed

>ever

y u do dis


 No.916778

>>916759

That's the true problem with PulseAudio. It takes away hardware mixing and the hardware features of your soundcard and uses the CPU instead. It's a giant step backwards.


 No.916779

File: 5dd120113f1e5f7⋯.jpg (31.67 KB, 500x340, 25:17, 1526639252065.jpg)

>>914777

>hating on something you get free as in freedom and gratis


 No.916786

>>916779

>Not realizing that what happens with gnome eventually has an impact on gtk, which in turn has impact on applications, which in turn change to support new GUI "features", which in turn break things, which in turn breaks workflow, which in turn...

Even if you don't use it, gnome will eventually come to you at some point.


 No.916847

>>916779

>here is shit thrown at you, stop complaining, it's free


 No.916938

>>916778

>hardware mixing and the hardware features of your soundcard

What mixing? What features? Soundcards have been dumb single-stream DACs for over a decade already. Windows has removed support for HW mixing in Vista.

Shit has moved to software processing ages ago, and that's fine. Modern CPUs, even the shittiest ones, are fast enough to process lots of voices with minimal CPU usage. There's no need for specialised audio processing hardware anymore.


 No.917125

>>915947

I don't understand why people still say this after all these years. I was forced to use pulseaudio when I realized I was wasting too much time trying to make my setup work (changing outputs daily + bluetooth audio). Pulseaudio works perfectly 100% of the time. I understand the criticism and the fact that it *used to* be shit.

Poettering is an idiot and systemd is a trainwreck waiting to happen, but pulseaudio works.


 No.917126

>>916938

>mfw some day this will happen to gpus


 No.917135

>>917125

This. I've had to wrestle with ALSA (and sometimes not been able to get it working at all), but pulseaudio has been relatively trouble-free.


 No.917186

>>917126

Unlikely, since the stream processing model is useful for general purpose computing too, not just graphics. We might see GPUs shed graphics-specific features such as hardware texture samplers and rasterisers, but the split between serially fast CPUs and massively parallel GPUs is here to stay (even if the latter won't be called GPUs anymore).


 No.917242

>>916713

>You realize that's a driver issue and not something that PulseAudio addresses?

Anon hotplug audio configuration and routing is not just a driver issue. It could work on other machines do without pulse audio but have to go through PITA configuration.


 No.917276

>>914777

That's the UNIX way. As time goes on, everything on UNIX needs more code and does less. Like they say, "clocks are running faster but the calendar is running backwards."

>>915047

>Is running a multi-user mainframe operating system developed 50 years ago on devices such as thermostats or home computers, right?

UNIX is a 16-bit minicomputer OS, not a mainframe OS. It's being used for thermostats and home computers because it's as good at being multi-user as MS-DOS. Multics, VMS, and MVS are much better multi-user OSes.

>>914865

>>915026

UNIX being slow, bloated, and wasteful is not new. Your computer would be so much faster and less bloated with a good OS that you probably couldn't believe it. It would likely be as significant as the 8-12 MB to 250 KB memory usage and 35 MB/s to 170 MB/s network bandwidth difference on the Paragon.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SUNMOS

>SUNMOS was developed as a reaction to the heavy weight version of OSF/1 that ran as a single-system image on the Paragon and consumed 8-12 MB of the 16 MB available on each node, leaving little memory available for the compute applications. In comparison, SUNMOS used 250 KB of memory per node. Additionally, the overhead of OSF/1 limited the network bandwidth to 35 MB/s, while SUNMOS was able to use 170 MB/s of the peak 200 MB/s available.[2]

>>915077

>Each new generation must reinvent the wheel, poorly. Go ahead kids, make your argument for your new wheel. They will all be discarded in < 5 years. Those that expanded on what was already here making it better & faster will have their work live on.

Bullshit. People outside of C and UNIX weenie culture respect innovation. Look at the evolution of Fortran, Cobol, Algol, BASIC, Pascal, and Lisp. In UNIX culture, each generation has to solve the same problems over and over again, reinventing Multics poorly, but the solutions never get used. These C/UNIX bugs haven't been fixed in 50 years and will never get fixed because C is too broken. You can only avoid those flaws by using a language and OS without those flaws.

There are times when I feel that clocks are running faster
but the calendar is running backwards. My first serious
programming was done in Burroughs B6700 Extended Algol. I
got used to the idea that if the hardware can't give you the
right answer, it complains, and your ON OVERFLOW statement
has a chance to do something else. That saved my bacon more
than once.

When I met C, it was obviously pathetic compared with the
_real_ languages I'd used, but heck, it ran on a 16-bit
machine, and it was better than 'as'. When the VAX came
out, I was very pleased: "the interrupt on integer overflow
bit is _just_ what I want". Then I was very disappointed:
"the wretched C system _has_ a signal for integer overflow
but makes sure it never happens even when it ought to".

    Actually, it's more the hardware vendors fault.  For
about 15 years now, the solution has been to throw more
hardware (memory, cpu cycles, graphics co-processors, and so
on) at the users. UNIX has the dubious advantage of looking
more like "a real operating system" to the microprocessor
crowd (who are used to CPM/MSDOS/etc).

So they think that by installing unix, it makes their
system into a "real computer". In fact, unix is just a
minicomputer operating system (at best). So what they end
up with is a box with more MIPs than a 70s mainframe, more
memory than a 70s mainframe, more disk than a 70s mainframe,
and a 70s minicomputer operating system. And it runs about
as fast as a 70s minicomputer, asn supports as many users.

The wonder is that anyone is surprised.

    I'm just getting around to responding to this, with an
historical note which I cannot resist. Paul's paper is
a good, thorough, and competently done analysis, but
the conclusion takes me back about 14 years. Are we
always destined to reinvent the same stuff every N
years?

There is a well known effect in the computer architecture
community, which in summary states that all major
architectural mistakes must be and have been made at least
three times: once in the design of mainframes, once in the
design of minicomputers, and once in the design of
microcomputers. Perhaps a similar rule applies to operating
systems.

The same mistakes are made once in mainframe OS's, twice in
microcomputer OS's, and N times in Unix (tm) operating
systems. What seems surprising and different is that they
don't get fixed in Unix. Mostly people don't even realize
they ARE mistakes.


 No.917277

>>917242

If you don't have drivers for the audio devices, they won't work. If you have the drivers, ALSA is completely accetable through normal configuration, the same configuration necessary for choosing pulseaudio versus selecting the actual hardware. It's a driver issue.


 No.917351

>>917276

Agree, it's UNIX's fault, it killed my family too. We all know that small pieces that do one thing and can be interconnected takes way more locs than the same amount of pieces but each does everything. Like libraries, 100 redistributables that do not change API or the behaviour take way less space than one library file.


 No.917382

>>917351

>We all know that small pieces that do one thing and can be interconnected takes way more locs than the same amount of pieces but each does everything.

UNIX and "small pieces that do one thing and can be interconnected" are opposites. UNIX commands are not libraries. UNIX programs output "not a typewriter" for years because some moron "grepped" error messages for that particular string. This is the same bullshit that leads to "grepping" for compiler error messages from a specific version so they can never be improved and checking for "Mozilla" in the user-agent string in a browser and all the other horrible string-based crap UNIX weenies do. This rubbed off on JavaScript web devs too.

>Like libraries, 100 redistributables that do not change API or the behaviour

Those "100 redistributables", if you mean Windows, are mostly C standard libraries, which all suck because "every tool depends for its operation on the bugs in every other tool." Considering how "simple" C weenies say C's library is, it sure is buggy. Instead of updating the C library or replacing the broken parts so that you no longer depend on them, C weenies "code around" the bugs in a specific version, which means using a newer version would break their program. If they didn't do that, you would only need the latest version on your computer and could get rid of all the rest.

>take way less space than one library file.

UNIX weenies were against shared library files for years. They would rather have you statically link everything that's not in the kernel into every program, which sucks. Instead of 100 broken C libraries, there would be a separate broken C library linked into each executable. Since the UNIX weenie idea of debugging is adding printf and recompiling, they don't care where the bugs are. If it looks like it works, it works. No wonder UNIX weenies think "software engineering" isn't a real thing.

> What I can't figure out is why there isn't a giant market
> for improved unix software. For example, it seems like it
> would be straightforward to write a decent C macro
> processor or garbage collector, and that you could make a
> bundle of money selling them because everyone would want
> them. But no one does this. Why not? Maybe it's because
> weenies are so used to not fighting city hall that they
> can't believe things could ever be better?
>

You really can't figure this out? It's because every
tool depends for its operation on the bugs in every other
tool, to exaggerate slightly. Thus anyone promoting an
improved version of anything runs smack into insuperable
compatibility problems. You have to work as hard as
Stallman to make any headway at all.

No, no, no, you don't understand the elegant simplicity of
Unix error mes- sages. Remember: The map is not the
territory. No translation is ever completely accurate. The
text doesn't MEAN anything, it simply IS.

In attempting to translate a Unix error message into
English, you have missed the point. The message is what it
is. Absorb it on that basis. Go with the flow.

More to the point, you have all the sources on line, don't
you? (No Unix system is complete without them.) Simply
grep for the error message. The meaning is the message; the
code is the secret. The experience user will know what
needs to be done.

A truely elegant Unix would eschew the use of English-like
phrases in its error messages - they just confuse the issue.
If your error message had been just, say, "+2C)", you would
have been equally enlightened, and could have grep'ed just
as easily - but much more quickly.


 No.917424

>>917382

That last snippet sounds just like dealing with women. Except they don't come with source code.


 No.917428

File: 2e893b1392c406a⋯.mp4 (611.29 KB, 1280x720, 16:9, shut-up-richard.mp4)

>>917382

>UNIX and "small pieces that do one thing and can be interconnected" are opposites. UNIX commands are not libraries. UNIX programs output "not a typewriter" for years because some moron "grepped" error messages for that particular string. This is the same bullshit that leads to "grepping" for compiler error messages from a specific version so they can never be improved and checking for "Mozilla" in the user-agent string in a browser and all the other horrible string-based crap UNIX weenies do. This rubbed off on JavaScript web devs too.

What are you talking about?

>Those "100 redistributables", if you mean Windows, are mostly C standard libraries, which all suck because "every tool depends for its operation on the bugs in every other tool." Considering how "simple" C weenies say C's library is, it sure is buggy. Instead of updating the C library or replacing the broken parts so that you no longer depend on them, C weenies "code around" the bugs in a specific version, which means using a newer version would break their program. If they didn't do that, you would only need the latest version on your computer and could get rid of all the rest.

Do you have any examples of "broken C library"? It's all implementation defined.

>UNIX weenies were against shared library files for years. They would rather have you statically link everything that's not in the kernel into every program, which sucks. Instead of 100 broken C libraries, there would be a separate broken C library linked into each executable. Since the UNIX weenie idea of debugging is adding printf and recompiling, they don't care where the bugs are. If it looks like it works, it works. No wonder UNIX weenies think "software engineering" isn't a real thing.

How much are you getting paid, or is this all you Richard?


 No.917433


 No.917446

>>917351

>UNIX Way

>small programs that do one thing

>30KLOC for parsing command line/environment and setting up permissions and rest of program is one line


 No.917448

>>917433

>HTML is a blackbox that people tap into.

no it fucking isn't, and that's the entire problem with it. there isn't a single real abstraction (which isa necessary condition of a black box) in the web


 No.917539

File: 30fdc0133169393⋯.png (1.45 MB, 2560x1440, 16:9, Screenshot_20180520_231437.png)

> I'll stick with KDE/Plasma


 No.917551

>>917539

>wayland

>vega

Jelly AF m8


 No.917623

>>917277

>It's a driver issue.

Except its not anon.

>he same configuration necessary for choosing pulseaudio

Yes its called installing it

>If you don't have drivers for the audio devices, they won't work.

durrr

>LSA is completely accetable through normal configuration

Yes, manually.


 No.917624

>>917382

If only lisp machines did not suck


 No.917631

>>917539

Is the file manager on the left the default? It looks disgusting, like google chrome.


 No.917675

>>917631

In KDE all the core utilities are written in Electron.


 No.917679

>>914928

Your an asshole is what you are. What kind of sane person responds like that?


 No.917681

>>914935

ah! a fellow Links user!


 No.917685

The sad thing is that Gnome 2 was actually good at one point in time, Now, Gnome 3 and GTK have become absolute trash. The development has been taken over by people who think the average computer user is goddamn drooling moron. In particular, I don't understand their fascination with making the nautilus worse. It's a file explorer; logically for an operating environment that should be one of the most feature-filled programs.


 No.917696

>>917685

>people who think the average computer user is goddamn drooling moron

Its true anon. We can use tiling window managers and build everything from source and that bullshit. The average user thinks gmail is a program.


 No.917805

>>917631

It's just the shitty default "modern" theme that makes it look like that. Install QtCurve and Plastik and you've got a nice, comfy classic look. No pic cuz I'm a torfag and Jim's just a fag.

>>917675

kys faggot


 No.917808

>>917805

>Install QtCurve and Plastik and you've got a nice, comfy classic look

Ah yes more bloat


 No.917812

>>917808

It's actually less bloated than the default ones, but whatever.


 No.917814

File: e22d8cbae654cf1⋯.jpeg (165.56 KB, 700x700, 1:1, serveimage.jpeg)

>>917685

The development has been taken over by people who think the average computer user is goddamn drooling moron.

I tried using gnome 3 the other day. It felt like using pic related.


 No.917816

>>917812

>KDE

bloat bloat bloat


 No.917817

>>917685

MATE still exists though, no?


 No.917819

File: b4424f03d3eea67⋯.jpg (462.53 KB, 1502x1363, 1502:1363, Haas-Controller.jpg)

>>917814

Design doesn't scream "FUCK YOU AND FUCK EVERYTHING ABOUT YOU", so it's got to be bad. Why don't you buy some industry hardware, you'd feel right at home.


 No.917851

>>917675

You don't have any idea what you're talking about. It's all C++ there.


 No.917853

>>917851

No anon its javascript


 No.917899

File: d30b8623ed260b9⋯.jpg (219.92 KB, 780x814, 390:407, kdegnome.jpg)

>>917816

KDE is actually lean compared to bloat such as GNOME, Unity etc

Enjoy being cucked by GNOME devs


 No.917900


 No.917906

>>914781

i use openbox. i have tried others but i dont really like them.


 No.917910

>>917899

Anon its literally 2 megabytes different.


 No.918022

It feels great being a Windows user and not having to deal with ALSA and Pusaudio.


 No.918056

>>917900

Anon just look its right there


 No.918064

>>918056

You're probably thinking of the way GNOME uses CSS for styling, and I would not be shocked if they used JS for some extensions. The only JS I've heard about in KDE was for an engine for Konquerer.


 No.918069

>>918064

I'm guessing he is trolling. KDE is a showcase for QT so it wouldn't make sense for them to use javascript.


 No.918155

>>917910

That's three times as much as was supposedly enough for everyone 30 years ago.


 No.918156

>>918022

It feels great being a Linux user and enjoying dealing with ALSA and dmix


 No.918259

File: 40affb88406a789⋯.jpg (407.08 KB, 1024x592, 64:37, FA-18 cockpit.jpg)

>>917819

What would DEs be like if they followed the same design principles of fighter aircraft cockpits?


 No.918278

>>918155

My watch has more RAM than that.


 No.918282

>>918069

>is a showcase for QT

Anon one of the main features of QT is that you can embed HTML / CSS / JS into and develop things with it.


 No.918286

>>918259

Every single conky ricer out there.


 No.918404

>>917819

It's Gnome. What do you mean it doesn't?


 No.918408

>>917910

Yes, that is why the "KDE is bloat and GNOME is not" is invalid. This myth needs to die, because I fucking hate GTK and GNOME devs


 No.918424

>>918278

bloat bloat bloat


 No.918441

>>918408

KDE is bloat. Gnome is also bloat. They both need to die.


 No.918461

>>918441

Linux is bloat. We need to go back to using CP/M.


 No.918474

>>918461

Linux is considerably less bloated than every viable alternative (except for perhaps BSD).


 No.923670

>>914781

>and Sway on Wayland.

i would if it didn't lag

ONLY weston works alright for wayland - not gnome, not sway at least for now

for weston i recommend you switch KEY_TAB with KEY_SPACE in shell.c


 No.923681

>>914931

I always remove thunar and install nautilus except in 18.04 where it's broken so I use nemo

Also I'm not 100% but I'm pretty sure I can launch programs from my debian server with xfce/thunar


 No.923697

>>914933

That was the firefox way. Next they'll create a shittier kind of executable that can only run in sandbox (flatpak?), and then deprecate normal executable.


 No.923699

>>916635

>taskbar is still shit and icons are forever fucked

Real great DE you got there.


 No.923741

>>914777

>>914791

THE OPEN SOURCE COMMUNITEEEEEE


 No.923775

>>914813

Let me know when I can use a full feature browser in the frame buffer without X in emacs


 No.923789

>>923775

There are literally two webkit browsers in Emacs. And the whole point of GNU Emacs is that it can be a frontend to anything, including Firefox. Thus, helm-firefox, browse-url, etc., etc.... There's a thread for this on /emacs/: >>>/emacs/74


 No.923924

>>914865

GNU is less coordinated than you think. The GNU project is not a giant monolith of people who think the same way. GNOME is only formally part of the GNU project.


 No.923925

File: aaf9128bebeefb7⋯.jpg (49.65 KB, 620x388, 155:97, hacking_1929918b.jpg)

>>914791

Why can't the women in the LFOSS community be hot babes with sane hair colours instead of these abomination?

>>914898

systemd was adopted not because of its superior quality but because of distro maintainer laziness. The maintenance complexity was shifted over to the end user away from the distro developers. Not to mention the fact that systemd has no clear goal line, even systemd developers have a hard time explaining exactly what it is, and it became so big they even had their own systemd conference (no joke: https://conf.systemd.io/ ) later renamed "All Systems Go!" to inlude other system management software (probably because it was embarassing that an init system/service manager/whatever held its own congress). Oh, and don't forget systemd only works with glibc/Linux, forget about any other kernel and C library combination. If that's not enough reason to shun it, I don't know what will convince you.

>>916779

>if you critizice things that gratis you're a faggot

Just as they are free fuck up GNOME badly, we are free to laugh at them. There is absolutely no inconsistency there.

>>917899

That whole list is a condemnation of modern UI developement, including but not limited to GNOME.

>>923670

Wayland developement has taken a really long time. Will they ever finish it?


 No.923953

>>923925

>systemd was adopted not because of its superior quality but because of distro maintainer laziness

Yeah, no. It was a massive improvement in so many ways and finally fixed many of the issues plaguing Linux for decades, the problem was that it was also a tangled spiderweb, a bloat magnet, and key devs didn't trust Lennart and the personality cult he surrounds himself with. imo it will probably end in a fork.


 No.923963

>>915684

>Sees CP issue with a logical victim prevention approach

>anarchist, hacker, physicist.

>Tor dev

>Holds strong opinions on issues she believes matter

Seems fine to me. I may disagree with some of the things she says including the assertment that an abusive person can't be part of a minority political movement.


 No.924339

>>916071

>having to grab the mouse every other second just to perform basic tasks.


 No.924410

>>915090

and portage is insanely slow compared to literally any other source-based package manager :)


 No.924420

>>924410

portage sucks because it's python based, and it has to run through all the package trees to find dependencies for every single software. and what sucks, is if you don't sync everyday and keep updates everyday constant updates are a security risk then you cannot emerge any software without downloading useless crap that are not dependent on anything that you need.

portage is terrible.


 No.924434

>>924339

>I'm a chinklet "keyboard" peasant, look tis thee gentlemen

Not a problem, IBM invented pointing stick 25 years ago.




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