/tg/ - Traditional Games

Card game Yu Gi Oh or..

PENALTY GAME

Yu Gi Oh?

>>217084

>>217087

Better question.. Is it possible to decode and gamify the various archetypes and playstyles, and card types into an abstract game about a game?

Like, no cards, but players are rolling dice and using some sort of asspull resource to dictate when their character pulls some absurd trump card or activates a strategy that makes no fucking sense like pic related.

Check out Duel Monsters Genesis on BYOND. If you want to RP do it there.

Bump

>>217404

There is pic related, Card Ranker is a japanese rpg, basically what OP wants but its untranslated.

from what I've gathered PC stats have a meaning on the card game, like think MtG but mana is a stat. luck, destiny and skill could be implemented as stats but what they mean for the card game s a whole different matter.

>>217369

>>217403

>>217404

I was going to go to sleep, but let me bang out some ideas really quick.

Instead of vague stats like destiny, players have an array of skills that reflect different actions and styles of play, like Offensive, Defensive, Preparatory, Retaliatory, and so on. Each of these are related to certain types of card and fluffed as playing monsters, spell cards, trap cards, etc.

These skills can turn into sets of stacking bonuses/tokens/points/whatever. Taking aggressive actions stacks up your damage points, for instance, allowing you to spend that to dish out a harsh hit to your opponent. Defensive actions give you a buffer to soak damage. Retaliatory could allow you to set up traps or reactions that allow you to negate enemy actions, provided your points are within a certain threshold of the incoming action. Preparatory would be a wild card bonus, I guess.

On each player's turn, they have a limited number of actions that they can use to essentially stack up their bonuses and get ready to slap around their opponent.

The rank in the various skills could set the cap on bonuses, but you could further augment things with deck themes. Things that set special conditions or unique actions that fudge the rules, like being able to convert one type of point to another once per game, or recovering lifepoints in exchange for shit.

And, of course, you need to have some sort of theme, like Dinosaurs, or Cats with cute hats, so you can flavor your actions and announce, "I summon Mr Whiskers: The Unrepentant Scratcher of Sofas!"

>>217416

I actually kinda dig this idea, so let me lay out some suggestions.

>Since the game revolves around resolving "adult" issues with a children's card game, cards should be involved. These need not be YGO cards (and should probably be actively discouraged for mechanical reasons.) My suggestion would be that actions are resolved with a single deck of traditional playing cards (sort of like Malifaux in that sense.) Take the Jokers out.

>Two of the Aces are special. The Ace of Spades represents a Critical Success. Motorhead optional. The Ace of Clubs/Diamonds/Hearts (pick one) represents Critical Failure.

>All other cards are ranked based on value/face. (So King outranks Jack, 8 outranks 4, Ace outranks all save for the Specials.)

>Each turn, the player determines which Tactical Skill they are going to use (assuming one action per turn. Allow more Tactical Skill declarations if your card game allows for more than one "action" per turn.)

>Each Tactical Skill represents how many cards the player draws on their turn in relation to that Skill. One of the drawn cards is chosen and placed face-down in Defense Mode while the rest are discarded. (so a character with Defensive Tactics 4 draws 4 cards from their deck and chooses one to act as the "dice roll" for that action. The other 3 cards are discarded.)

>Every combatant takes a turn to lay down their cards, and all cards are revealed simultaneously. Once all card effects are resolved, the players discard into their respective discard piles

>To represent the act of "decking" another player, only allow a maximum number of how many times a character can shuffle their deck and discard piles back together. (This might be a Stat all on its own.)

>There are two opposites: Attack and Defense, Preparatory and Retaliatory

>When one monster Attacks another, compare the Attacker's card to the Defender's card. The highest one wins, destroying the monster and any difference between the cards' values going straight into the loser's Life Points. In the case of a tie, both monsters are destroyed with no damage to either player's Life Points. If a monster has no Defense card available (i.e. the player didn't take a Defensive Action last turn), then the player takes the full brunt of that Attack to their Life Points. (For Faces and Aces, Jack = 11, Queen = 12, King = 13, Aces = 14, Crit Success Ace = 20, Crit Fail Ace = 0).

I've also drawn up a very rough sketch of what I imagine the playing field to look like for each player. Basically, each Stat representing an Action that can be taken during card games/combat, with its own area of the field.

Had to break this up into two parts.

>>217560

>>217560

>Preparatory and Retaliatory actions are where it gets a little complicated. Preparatory Actions represent playing cards that tilt the field in your favor (most commonly in the form of buffs/debuffs). Retaliatory Actions represent playing cards to nullify such effects. Like Attack and Defense, compare the card values of contesting Preparatory and Retaliatory Actions, with the highest value winning.

>If Preparatory > Retaliatory, then the difference is applied as a buff/debuff as desired. If Preparatory < Retaliatory, then the effect is reversed. In the case of a tie, the effect is nullified with no benefit or detriment to either player.

>A successful Preparatory or Retaliatory Action remains in effect until something is done to cancel it. Nullifying effects that are already "in play" do not grant bonuses or penalties for success/failure.

>For example, Dave takes a Preparatory Action to give a bonus to his Defensive Actions. Allen takes a Retaliatory Action to possibly reverse or nullify it. Dave's card is a Queen while Allen lays down a 9. In this case, Dave would have a +3 bonus to his Defensive Actions until Allen can successfully nullify it with a Retaliatory Action. If Dave had the 9 and Allen the Queen, then Dave's Defensive Actions would have a -3 penalty. In the latter case, Dave would need a second Preparatory Action to nullify it.

>I'd also suggest a cap on how much of a bonus/penalty can be applied by Preparatory or Retaliatory Actions (possibly based on the relevant Stat.) Preparatory or Retaliatory Actions that do more than this (such as reflecting an Attack Action back on the attacker, or other esoteric effects) should be left to GM interpretation.

>Since the player that has the first turn is at a bit of a disadvantage (Player 2 will have first chance to counter their actions,) I suggest allowing a Discard and Draw benefit to their first turn, like in MtG. Or possibly allowing them one more Action than normal.

>Finally, there should be some kind of Fate/Destiny/Determination/whatever Stat that represents that player character's inherent luck at drawing just the right card at the right time. Much like Fate Points/Void Points/etc from other systems, this Stat has a set amount of points per session that can be spent for various effects. The one effect that comes to mind first is allowing a player to spend a point to draw extra cards for one action equal to Fate/Luck/etc.

>>217607

The system already listed was a heavy abstraction anyways to stick to OP's wishes of themed decks. And I assumed that OP wanted a style similar to the manga/anime, which actually had very little card trading. That, and simplifying the amount of special cards would make the card battles less of a slog than the original.

>>217611

This is a pretty good idea. Though I'll warn that abilities that damage CP should be rare and/or expensive, lest you have a reformation of the fucktastic Yata-Lock decks (pic related.) I also feel that the special abilities should be relatively few, to place more emphasis on actual card strategy rather than a flat-out "Fuck you, I win due to higher numbers" meta. Maybe some guidelines on how these abilities are created are in order.

I also suggest that the initial number of starting CP be lowered to 5, which is still a full poker hand that won't get too out of control if the card battle drags on. A max amount of CP that one person could have at the start of their turn is probably a good idea too (I suggest 10, so players aren't trying to hold half their deck in their hand.)

Going with this idea, we'd change the previously mentioned Stats to static numbers to represent that deck's overall capabilities in that field. So a beatdown deck is going to have most of its points in Attack, a little in Retaliatory and Preparatory, and almost no Defense to speak of.

With that in mind, I also started to formulate some character/deck generation and advancement rules (these rules assume the same 4 stats from my previous posts are being used.)

>Each player's Starter Decks has 7 - 14 points (depending on how big of numbers you're aiming for) to spread among the four Stats (so a Starter Beatdown Deck would have stats like 3 Attack, 2 Retaliation, 1 Preparatory, 1 Defense) and 3 - 6 Trick Points (points to spend on constructing special abilities, called Tricks.)

>When making Tricks, you spend TP on three particular aspects: Use, Cost, and Effect. For a Trick to be useable in card battle, at least 1 TP must be spent on each aspect.

>Use is a 1:1 TP cost that represents how often that Trick can be used per card battle. So one point in Use lets you use that Trick once per battle, 2 points = twice per battle, etc.

>Cost is an inverse TP expenditure, with more TP placed in it making it a cheaper in-battle expenditure. Something like 1 TP for 5 CP, 2 TP for 3 CP, 3 TP for 1 CP. Cost never goes below 1 CP (for obvious mechanical reasons.)

>Effect is a bit more esoteric and might need to be placed under GM interpretation. But it's also where wonky stuff like suit-based mechanics (as per >>217607's suggestion) can find a home.

>To make their decks more powerful, players must spend Cash on more cards (which, obviously, they gain by winning card battles.) And this comes in two flavors: the Booster Pack and the Deck Tin

>Booster Packs are relatively cheap (though both means of advancement should have some form of incrementally increasing cost) and are essentially how you "level up" one particular deck. Something akin to 2 - 3 Stat points to spend and 1 - 2 Trick Points. Stat and Trick Points don't need to be spent immediately and can be pooled for later use, though they can't be spent during a card battle.

>Deck Tins give players a whole new deck to play with, but also cost a great deal of Cash. In exchange, the player gains double (or possibly triple) the amount of Stat and Trick Points granted from a Booster Pack and can rearrange their Stats and Trick Points as they desire (in the case that their current deck isn't working out to their expectations.) Alternatively, the player can make a second Starter Deck with the new Deck Tin, complete with all new Tricks and Stats (and probably a few extra Stat and Trick Points to help it keep pace with their current deck/decks.)

I'm actually running a homebrew yu gi oh themed adventure in DnD 4e because that's the system I have the most resources for. It's set in the virtual world from the show and I bought a bunch of the yu gi oh heroclix minis since they were cheap. it's incredible how easy it is to fool my players into thinking I brewed the monsters, almost every early yu gi oh monster has a DnD counterpart. I just change the name and tweak the values slightly. The setting is basically "westernized fantasy JRPG setting" so it's easy to tell what is or what isn't part of the world.

Bonus story:

My players get enlisted to "clear an infestation out of an old man's basement" and everyone immediately thinks they are doing a kill the giant rats adventure. They get to the old man's house and he tells them where the problem is, and there's a door with locks on it. He says he's going to lock them in because he "doesn't like adventuring leaking into his house." Right as the door closes he says "oh and whatever you do, don't kill them." The players don't even know what "they" are since my wording was very vague. The players (Flame Swordsman and the Dark Magician) descend the stairs into the basement and see a mostly empty room with a pile of trash, some bear traps on the floor, a corked jar, a furnace, and an oil spill. The Dark Magician checks out the trash, and the Swordsman checks out the oil. There was a Sangan in each location. I adapted the card effect so when you kill one, it spawns a random and potentially dangerous monster. They are also minions, so they die VERY easily. Swordsman pulls up the floor boards and sees one covered in oil. He hits it on the head with the flat side of his blade. The one hiding in the trash pile jumps out and tries to bite the Magician. After the one in the hole manages to stumble out the player controlling the Swordsman tries to, and I quote, "putt the Sangan into the bear trap." I make it travel d4 tiles, and it barely stops short of the trap. The sangan then tries to pick up the trap and swing it around by the attached chain like a hammer thrower and toss it at the PC. He crit fails, and the chain wraps around his body, the trap closing on his body (face) and it kills him instantly. It spawns a Harpy Lady, and that Harpy Lady starts scratching the shit out of the swordsman. Meanwhile the magician has crit failed multiple times on the one by the trash, trying to sleep it, bind it, anything and fails miserably every time. Finally he uses a maze spell to trap it. A third one falls out from the ceiling and B lines it to the furnace. The PCs immediately know what's going on and the magician uses an illusory wall spell on it, stopping it. The swordsman kills the harpy, and they bag the two Sangan looking to dispose of them somehow. It keeps going if anyone is interested.

>>217607

>>217677

Actually trading the cards, getting boosters, or obtaining cards in any way was rarely a part of the YGO series. Instead, cards were circulated almost like cash, as far as I can tell, with some cards literally being one of a kind or so rare that no one else had them.

Implementing any sort of trading or booster packs seems like it would be hard to do in a game that is a strange abstraction and mock-up of the basic ebb and flow of a card game.

The real trick, however, is going to be finding a way to make this appropriately hammy. Without a hard cardlist attached to each baddy, it will be up to players and GMs alike to set up a sort of narrative escalation, with bold moves and surprising strategies playing out alongside the hard numbers and resource management.

Perhaps each baddy could have a sort of script attached to their description that outlines their basic playstyle and priorities, followed by certain milestones, like unleashing their signature creature, which alters their stats, or setting up some kind of silly thematic gimmick, like catapulting dragon knights into flotation rings.

Hard numbers are going to be a decent part of this, but there's going to be a lot of bullshitting too. Like using a time wizard to turn a baby dragon into an elder dragon, or combining different monsters to get special monsters.

>I cast [NECROTIC METEOR] and… All of my Dinosaur creatures turn into ZOMBIE SKELETON DINOSAURS MAKING THEM IMMUNE TO YOUR POISON GAS TRAPS!

There would need to be some control on this, like a mechanic that measures the ebb and flow of the game, and when it swings far enough in one combatant's favor, they get to pull off some silly maneuver like that. After so many successful actions, they build up enough steam and unless a combo like that, but it resets the counter, allowing the other combatant to quickly build up momentum in their favor to counter.

Remember, the idea is to emulate the batshit insane theme of the Yu Gi Oh show, not just play the card game. If you wanted to play that, then you'd just buy a deck. This is about saving the world from an ancient egyptian grudge by playing a children's card game, sometimes on motorcycles.

>>217662

Only reason I started at 7CP was because most card games start with 7, but YGO actually does start with a hand of 5, so that works.

As for abilities, I'd say start small. Players get 2 or 3 at most and as the game progresses and they level up, they gain more or replace weaker ones with stronger ones.

I like the idea of each deck being point buy. If there's going to be any sort of progression or leveling to speak of, slowly increasing the point value of a player's deck, allowing them to increase their Attack, Defense, and other stats, while also gaining additional abilities/strategies/combos/whatever.

At any rate, I'm going to have to add all these ideas to my notes. I have a homebrew that I've been sitting on for far too long that's meant to be based on proxy battle anime like YGO. Some of this can definitely be used and adapted.

This is getting too complicated.

won't it be simpler if we just patch an already existing card game to incorporate mechanics related to a player character?

So I was thining.

Each suit is a mechanic: creatures, effects/magic/spells, counter effects/traps/instants and ?

So in the character creation process the players chooses different prewritten mechanics for each suit each mechanic having a required PC level and cost in whatever the players are spending.

Bump

>>218401

>>217749

I would have some kind of booster pack system in which player's roll dice to determine which card they get from said booster pack.

To track which cards a player/NPC has

Having less than 40 cards would probably be of great help, in Yu Gi Oh BAM (a sub-game to yu gi oh) players only have 15 cards in a deck (3 in hand) so maybe something like that.

You could use a d20 to see what card you pull from your deck, if the number you roll is "empty" you re-roll (so every card in your deck has a corresponding number to it) or maybe simply have the DM decide which card you pull depending on how high you roll.

>>217767

>When you get right down to it if you just take out the 2 zeroes at the end of each number YGO is just an 80 point game. 1000 can be 10, 2000 is 20, and etc. The numbers become easier to work with if you keep this in mind.

Not always, pic related.

>>219570

>You could use a d20 to see what card you pull from your deck, if the number you roll is "empty" you re-roll (so every card in your deck has a corresponding number to it) or maybe simply have the DM decide which card you pull depending on how high you roll.

>Rolling a dice instead of drawing actual cards

>>220508

There's dueling network, ygopro, and other dueling simulators to help facilitate this. it's as simple as looking online for decklists. This means that both players need computer access or to play online, but it's possible.

As for me, I'm ashamed to admit it but I myself have ~12 irl decks before I quit playing, and plenty of spare cards to throw together a functioning retard deck for one off weaker characters.