/thg/ - Touhou Gameplay

Upload amount by game in total and in 2015 only:

th06: 3655 367

th07: 5779 457

th08: 7384 760

th09: 1805 201

th95: 1349 115

th10: 3553 337

th11: 3753 327

th12: 3447 289

th125: 1408 72

th128: 886 103

th13: 2473 330

It's the third slowest year in its 9 year history. The rate of posting isn't half that of its peak in 2012. It follows the general pattern of th07 and th08 being the most popular, with the main games being a step below them, and the side games being another step below.

I believe the recent numbers are artificially low due to the archive not supporting newer games. Even so, I can tell from both observation and personal experience that the numbers are not as big as they used to be. This is due to a factor of the game's novelty value wearing off as well as new games failing to keep up with the spectacular impression that the previous ones made. Fans always gradually drop off, and most newcomers come to the series around the time new games come out. Hype is important for new players to notice the series, and hype is always biggest around new releases. We had a main game come out recently and we got quite a lot of attraction, thus a main game coming out soon is unlikely. Music albums, mangas, and potentially a side game are more likely. We haven't been hearing much news from the ever-reclusive ZUN. There are rumors that he plans to retire. Whatever news we get will be critical for the future of the series. If we don't have a fresh supply of at least half-decent new games, the series will plunge even further into obscurity.

What are some things we can do to help make the series thrive?

Can we do something about the incredibly toxic community?

Can we change our means of discussion or create new websites and services?

Can we somehow inform any group of people that may be interested in the game about the series?

Is the game overly saturated with achievements? As in, has the bar been raised so high that it make new players discouraged from contributing?

Is the game overly competitive?

Is it not a problem?

I don't want to be the only player in a few years. It's like this with some of my childhood games and it's sad. Not to mention how much hostility there is in an already small community.

>>119

The way I see it, it's fucked. The quantity of players seems to be decreasing but at least the quality is increasing instead.

>What are some things we can do to help make the series thrive?

>we

Nothing. The West has been piggybacking on Japanese content for forever. That content has been decreasing which has the consequence of lessening the western fanbase. Most people got in touch with Touhou through fanmade music/games/doujinshi after all. (As have I)

>Can we do something about the incredibly toxic community?

I wish. I would really like that. The community is too fragmented and isn't willing to adapt to one another. Which just ends up with people going into different directions. It doesn't help that shitposting has become synonymous with Touhou threads. Which just ends up making other people hate the fanbase even more.

>Can we change our means of discussion or create new websites and services?

We have the platforms necessary for discussion. I think the problem right now is just popularity. I've had this really cool idea lately but it's not limited to improving the Touhou fanbase, but the whole community in general.

>Can we somehow inform any group of people that may be interested in the game about the series?

Fighting game and rhythm game players perhaps. These still share roots with shmups in general. Speedrunners might also be a viable alternative.

>Is the game overly saturated with achievements? As in, has the bar been raised so high that it make new players discouraged from contributing?

As long as people don't act like elitist dickheads, this should be fine. Though I'm starting to get really annoyed by the self-deprecating mindset prevalent in the Wester Touhou fanbase. Just because there are better players doesn't mean you have to hate everything you do. It's okay to take some pride in your achievements!

>Is the game overly competitive?

I don't think it is. There are more people that play for survival than for score. Most games only have a few players scoring them seriously.

>Is it not a problem?

It's sad, but it was unavoidable nonetheless. Nothing is forever and hype can not be upheld every day. Having said that, I would still very much enjoy seeing new players arrive and start playing the games.

>>120

>The way I see it, it's fucked. The quantity of players seems to be decreasing but at least the quality is increasing instead.

I care more about players with a good personality than players with high achievements.

>Nothing. The West has been piggybacking on Japanese content for forever. That content has been decreasing which has the consequence of lessening the western fanbase. Most people got in touch with Touhou through fanmade music/games/doujinshi after all. (As have I)

Same here. I discovered Touhou through flashes on 4/f/. Is there really less content? Touhou is still big in Japan. There should still be plenty.

>I wish. I would really like that. The community is too fragmented and isn't willing to adapt to one another. Which just ends up with people going into different directions. It doesn't help that shitposting has become synonymous with Touhou threads.

With such a community, I can't blame people if they stay away. I find myself thinking twice about recommending people Touhou because of it.

>I've had this really cool idea lately but it's not limited to improving the Touhou fanbase, but the whole community in general.

Can you say more about this?

>Fighting game and rhythm game players perhaps. These still share roots with shmups in general. Speedrunners might also be a viable alternative.

The Touhou fanbase has always overlapped with those two. Speedrunners are interesting because they are a lot of what they do is applicable to Touhou. Some of them are quite skilled.

>As long as people don't act like elitist dickheads, this should be fine.

Except they do. And it brainwashes new players into chasing unreasonable standards. Inexperienced Touhou players tend to be easily impressed, and so they act as fuel for those that play for attention.

>Though I'm starting to get really annoyed by the self-deprecating mindset prevalent in the Wester Touhou fanbase. Just because there are better players doesn't mean you have to hate everything you do. It's okay to take some pride in your achievements!

Try telling that to the zealots. Self-deprecation is a sure sign of having a fat ego. I've seen plenty of players quit due to not being able to keep up with another player. It's quite disappointing.

>I don't think it is. There are more people that play for survival than for score. Most games only have a few players scoring them seriously.

Competition isn't just scoring. Touhou players in recent years have become very territorial. They take even survival play seriously.

>It's sad, but it was unavoidable nonetheless. Nothing is forever and hype can not be upheld every day. Having said that, I would still very much enjoy seeing new players arrive and start playing the games.

Perhaps Touhou as a game just isn't meant to be popular. It takes the right blend of mental illnesses to enjoy that most people don't have.

>>121

>I care more about players with a good personality than players with high achievements.

I'd like seeing a combination of both. It seems to be difficult improving without becoming cynical. It's one of the reasons why I look up to high-level players who are still nice to others.

> Is there really less content? Touhou is still big in Japan. There should still be plenty.

More people are aware of Touhou now than there have ever been before. And yet, the content being created is still decreasing.

>Can you say more about this?

Uhh, well, you might've noticed how shmup developers are placing a higher emphasis on migrating to the PC platform lately. Like with the Transition event being a thing and even Cave porting their 1st game. And there being Darius, Raiden, Ikaruga and a shit-ton of shmup fangames being released on PC. This is what marks the ends of an era for me. Because this coincides with the deaths of arcades around the globe, and decreased generated revenue from arcades in Japan.

When I said my idea revolves around the whole community, I meant globally. If developers are migrating to PC, that means the players are too. And yet, for some retarded reason, I can't think of a single discussion platform accommodating both Western and Asian shmup players. You'd think there'd be a hub where everyone can get together, and yet it doesn't exist.

What I want is a forum which isn't limited to a single language. Similar to http://shmups.system11.org/, except this time with sections for people that speak Japanese, Chinese, Korean etc etc. The best players are still from these regions, so I can't even comprehend why there's such a large disparity between it and the West. Most people living in Asia don't speak English well or English at all. So it'd be really awesome if there was a place to accommodate those people. Everyone could just get together, share strats, scores, videos etc in 1 place.

Am I perhaps being a bit too idealistic about this?

>Inexperienced Touhou players tend to be easily impressed, and so they act as fuel for those that play for attention.

This is pretty much true for the whole genre. Bullet-hell is known as "Impossible" and "Inhuman". It's impossible to change the mindset of new players when thoughts like these linger in the minds of people that don't even play the games in the first place. The only way it'd change is if a large amount of players started playing the games and started 1ccing everything, they'd be able to represent how doable it all is in reality.

>Touhou players in recent years have become very territorial. They take even survival play seriously.

They have? Well, I guess it's true. Considering that there's people treating NMNB like it's the holy grail of Touhou. It'd be nice if people started taking it easy again. Whatever happened to "Yukkuri shiteite ne yo"?

>Perhaps Touhou as a game just isn't meant to be popular. It takes the right blend of mental illnesses to enjoy that most people don't have.

Touhou doesn't fit the mindset of what games should be to the modern gamer. The series will always only appeal to a small section of gamers.

>>122

>I'd like seeing a combination of both.

That's quite idealistic.

>It seems to be difficult improving without becoming cynical. It's one of the reasons why I look up to high-level players who are still nice to others.

That's hard to do in a community like this.

>Am I perhaps being a bit too idealistic about this?

The language barrier is heavy in the shmup community. It's not so simple to attract Asian players. They are in a world of their own and don't care much for the West. I see what you are trying to do but I can't begin to imagine how it would be implemented.

>This is pretty much true for the whole genre. Bullet-hell is known as "Impossible" and "Inhuman". It's impossible to change the mindset of new players when thoughts like these linger in the minds of people that don't even play the games in the first place. The only way it'd change is if a large amount of players started playing the games and started 1ccing everything, they'd be able to represent how doable it all is in reality.

New players have no way of knowing what degree of difficulty these achievements really take. There's a massive discrepancy of skill between players in a game like Touhou.

>They have? Well, I guess it's true. Considering that there's people treating NMNB like it's the holy grail of Touhou. It'd be nice if people started taking it easy again. Whatever happened to "Yukkuri shiteite ne yo"?

Players stopped respecting the game and started to treat it as a popularity contest. They knew they couldn't be the best at everything, so they started to focus on narrow scopes and building their little domain for the sake of getting a share of the ego pie. It's not apparent to new players, but the relationships between higher level players are filled with hatred, lying, hypocrisy, and backstabbing. The rush from Touhou is meant to come from getting a good achievement after putting a lot of work into it. Because the game was so mistreated, players that fed on the attention that comes after a run instead of the run itself ruined the community. To them, every player is either a source of ego fix or an enemy. As soon as a promising player shows up, they are seen as a threat. There is nothing they fear more than a player that is nice, skilled, and popular.

>Touhou doesn't fit the mindset of what games should be to the modern gamer. The series will always only appeal to a small section of gamers.

Touhou players tend to be mature and mature players gradually quit over time. There's not much attraction coming from younger players because they are not used to challenging games. Younger players focus on mobile and console platforms. Many are growing up without a PC, and those that do are stuck in digital prisons such as Steam. The few players we get tend to trickle down from a handful of video game and weeb scenes which are already obscure. They're too busy playing the latest AAA to worry about Touhou. This constantly rehashed, low-effort garbage designed to appeal to the least common denominator gets tends of millions of players while real games remain obscure.

>>126

>That's quite idealistic.

That can be a good thing though! We'll have something we can work towards!

>They are in a world of their own and don't care much for the West. I see what you are trying to do but I can't begin to imagine how it would be implemented.

I'm not talking about forcing them to get along with the Western players. What I want is almost the opposite, a place where Asian players can connect with and talk to other Asian players

>New players have no way of knowing what degree of difficulty these achievements really take. There's a massive discrepancy of skill between players in a game like Touhou.

It's kinda funny how bad it's gotten. Really big achievement are severely under appreciated because of it. The time-delay between not playing shmups at all and getting several Lunatic 1ccs is smaller than the distance between having Lunatic 1ccs and getting a good high-score.

>the relationships between higher level players are filled with hatred, lying, hypocrisy, and backstabbing

Is it really that bad? I don't really hang around many players, so I wouldn't know much about it. Are you speaking from experience?

>>141

>That can be a good thing though! We'll have something we can work towards!

Let's make /thg/ part of that.

>I'm not talking about forcing them to get along with the Western players. What I want is almost the opposite, a place where Asian players can connect with and talk to other Asian players

The technical side is easy. All you need is a web host and domain. But how do you intend to get these Asian players to use your site? Will they really trust a site maintained by a ⑨外人?

>It's kinda funny how bad it's gotten. Really big achievement are severely under appreciated because of it.

Agreed.

>The time-delay between not playing shmups at all and getting several Lunatic 1ccs is smaller than the distance between having Lunatic 1ccs and getting a good high-score.

That's true. I've seen players start the game and get Lunatic clears in the time it has taken an experienced player to do a single achievement. Some high-level players can only get a handful of meaningful runs per year. A lot of work goes into it.

>[spoiler]

I am, sadly.

>>142

> But how do you intend to get these Asian players to use your site? Will they really trust a site maintained by a ⑨外人?

I hope that in a couple years I'll have a good enough reputation because of high-scores and nice 1ccs. I'm expecting people would simply trust me out of respect. Even though I don't have many friends, it turns out many people already respect me for some weird reason. But now is not the time to start community things, that comes later!

>Some high-level players can only get a handful of meaningful runs per year. A lot of work goes into it.

And what's even worse is that the only people who can comprehend how good a score is are people who have a score just as high, if not higher than the score you've gotten. For the remaining players a high-score is just a number they compare to the WR.

>I am, sadly.

Awww, I would totally talk to you and be friends with you and stuff!

>>149

You are quite ambitious. It will be interesting to see what you can come up with.

>For the remaining players a high-score is just a number they compare to the WR.

True. It's silly how many players think that scoring is only about the WR.

>Awww, I would totally talk to you and be friends with you and stuff!

Sounds like fun. I'll be right here. Unless you mean outside of the board?