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/younglove/ - Pedophilia Discussion

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 No.24294

Canned Arguments and Mass Opinion

Debating antis and pedophobes is a waste of time when most of the great sound bites have already been said better by someone else. Canned arguments are basically copypasta applied to debate.

I'm thinking specifically for youtube and reddit, where controlling the comments section is very important to change opinions.

Another important strategy is to "stack", which means replying to them in disapproval even if several other people have already. Remember, this is for those 90% reading the thread but not commenting. Showing them that those opinions are no longer popular gives them pause before expressing them themselves.

> "Sex doesn't hurt children, but society's outdated views on it do."

> "Because children's rights don't end where your feelings begin".

> "Last time I checked, wishing death upon someone because of their sexual orientation is hate speech".

> "Do you believe that masturbation is wrong too?"

> "Yes! I too think that sex is gross and icky! Do you think we could set up a few gas chambers disguised as ice cream trucks? How long do you think it would take to kill them all?

>"Huh, I didn't know you supported hitler's campaign against so-called "sexual deviants".

>"The age of consent was raised to give young girls more time to prepare for pregnancy. But today with free, easy and safe contraception that's no longer an issue."

>"So don't let your children do it. But denying other parents their right to choose so you can feel morally superior isn't just selfish, it's disgusting and makes you a bad parent.

>"I bet you only supported gay marriage when it became popular. Real progressives have been fighting for equality since when being gay was actually illegal. Fair-weather allies aren't welcome".

>"You can't call yourself a progressive without supporting a family's right to choose. It's just good politics".

>"Just because something is illegal doesn't make it immoral. See: Marijuana."

> "The war on child sexuality is only the latest in a long line of failed policies that work better on paper than the real world. See the war on drugs, terrorism and copyright infringement".

>"My kid is attracted to other kids. Does that mean he should be executed too?

> "The problem isn't with rind et al, it's with your bigoted and irrational hatred of other people. Just like climate change deniers, you ignore all evidence which goes against your dumb beliefs and continue to dig your own grave when all the science is against you".

> "The idea that kind people want to literally tear children limb from limb and feed them into woodchippers is incredibly ridiculous."

>"Let's agree to disagree." You believe x, and although that's not supported by science, logic or reason you have the right to your opinion".

>"You don't love who you love just because of sex. Why do you think it's any different with peds?

> "You don't have to be a pedophile to realize claiming all sex = rape is pants-on-head retarded."

> "The problem is this idea that sex is inherently evil. That's a judeo-christian view. Centuries of religious indoctrination have drilled this into your mind and the minds of your forefathers. In a diverse and multicultural society where not everyone believes in the same god, you have no right to force your views on others".

>"How would you feel if someone told you were only attracted to your wife because of how good she was in bed? People who say they love you just to get them in bed are the real monsters".

>"Almost everyone agrees that child abuse is bad, especially if you love them. That's why we're number one when it comes to fighting against it."

They can obviously be much longer and more detailed, but these are only a few examples. Now it's your turn to post!

ITT: Find the best arguments or modify existing ones used in support of ssm.

 No.24319

>>24294

Honestly speaking, greentext makes things really unappealing to read


 No.24327

>>24319

sorry, chan tradition. Won't use it anymore. :/

But have any canned arguments to contribute?


 No.24330

Bump, I'll post some as I think of them.


 No.24333

>>24327

I'm not sure which definition of "canned argument" you're referring to. Some of these are just strawmen while others could only work once expanded upon or evidenced. I don't really see any in particular that are very argumentatively strong.


 No.24335

>>24333

That's because these are incomplete on their own: You're supposed to use these slogans as part of a longer rebuttal.

Most arguments are not won through logic, but the repetition of opinion by many others. While logical arguments are important (and are available elsewhere), they aren't all that's needed. Ridicule and Humor are equally effective.


 No.24336

>>24335

*edit

Not supposed to, but it depends on the conversation. Cultivating a consensus that the topic has already been discussed and that the opposition is incorrect is accomplished by using words like "outdated" "puritan" "stodgy" "reactionary" "backwards" etc.

The terms you use are just as important as the words themselves.

I forgot to mention emotion, along with ridicule and humor. While it would look like pedophobes have the emotional arguments on lock with THINK OF THE CHILDREN, you can also argue that forcing children to grow up ashamed of their bodies is child abuse while sex-negativity deprives others of their humanity.

>Imagine if we treated childrens' growing language skills the same way we treat their budding sexuality. Every time a child begin to speak they would be slapped. "We don't talk in this house" parents would say, ignoring the fact that they were talking together as a couple in the very next room."

>"Believe it or not, human touch is a language all to itself, expressing opinions that are too deep for words"..


 No.24337

>>24335

That's what I meant by being not sure of what you mean by "canned argument". "Canned argument" could refer to repeated strawman(what you described) or it could refer to pre-explored arguments already widely used for certain topics. The problem is that there's a little bit of both in that list, some have a pejorative tone but others are just meek and apologetic. The list could use some pruning.

Still, here's one: "You are selfishly deciding the rights and futures of individuals based on arbitrary numbers"


 No.24346

>>24337

That's a good one. I would add that, instead of pruning it may be more helpful to expand it and segregate into these categories:

Harm, Consent, Morality and Ethics, Ridicule, Humor, Logic and Love

That way the right argument is easy to find.

More than this, an "info base" website would be helpful- a directory that contains memes, infographics, scientific studies and even testimonials/blogposts which help to strengthen our point and lend us immediate backup in arguments.


 No.24347

>>24337

>"I think when a lot of people talk about intergenerational intimacy, they have this mental image of a hairy old man brutally raping or sodomizing young children. Nobody in their right mind would defend people who do this, and we join you in calling for their long-term imprisonment. But most relationships between adults and children are nothing like that. For the vast majority, it never goes beyond touching- something they already do to themselves, where there's no risk of pregnancy and an extremely low risk of STDs. What about their rights? Who speaks up for the children who have to go through brutal all-day long police interrogation sessions to extract confessions? Or those who commit suicide because the world rips away people who legitimately love and care for them?

>"It's funny that in cases like this, the testimony of the victim is almost always completely ignored in favor of enforcing a monolithic view of sex and sexuality as invariably being harmful.

>"Who's really being hurt here? The children, or society's fragile morals? You say you want to protect kids, but you don't really mean it. If you did, then you would stand up for the rights of all children, including those who willingly engage in relationships with older people.

[Harm]

>"There are many ways to minimize the risk of harm. While it's true that children have a higher risk of drowning when they go swimming, we don't ban swimming: Instead, we use lifeguards. Right now, a child's only lifeguards are their parents, but what if they fail? We need to create a "culture of lifeguards" who recognize the signs of abusive relationships and are willing to intervene, sexual or otherwise.

>"Why do we mandate the wearing of seatbelts while driving cars, for instance? The proper use of safe-sex strategies such as washing your hands before and after or even wearing latex gloves can greatly reduce the risk of STDs".

>"Another common-sense proposal is to give parents more responsibility with their power: If we allow parents to decide when their children are ready to explore their sexuality, then we must hold them responsible if their child catches an STI".

>"If you are against child sexuality, then be consistent. Masturbation must also be illegal because it's a form of sexual activity, and those under the age of 18 cannot consent.


 No.24361

>hate speech

That's a load of liberal bullshit, having sex with children does harm them you dont have proof that its societies views.

fuck off NAMBLA


 No.24370

>>24361

Topshill m8

It doesn't matter if it's liberal, what maters is that it works.

What about all the other cultures (not just greece), where it was openly accepted and found not to harm them at all?

Where's the proof that consensual, non-penetrative intimacy not done in secret is inherently damaging?

Just admit you're an anti and join the other 97% of the western world.


 No.24371

>>24370

> is that it works

it doesnt though. It makes you look like a SJW and even most liberals arent fond of SJWs.

>and found not to harm them at all

No harm was recorded* That was thousands of years ago and we have no idea of the psychological affects it had on them you fucking moron.

>anti

In what way? Im a paedophile.


 No.24413

File: 1435985293468.jpg (47.89 KB, 582x400, 291:200, slacktivism1.jpg)

>I'm thinking specifically for youtube and reddit, where controlling the comments section is very important to change opinions.


 No.24494

>>24361

What about Rind study and the many times it was repeated? or Susan Clancy's study with child abuse victims? those ones don't count because people don't like the result?

On a side note, i need to know exactly why is pedophilia categorized as a disease, I know "children can't reproduce so attraction to them is useless" is one but what else?


 No.24502

>>24413

Creating media is equally important, but never forget how important comments sections are to forming opinions.


 No.24503

>>24502

If you take all the different places where form opinions, the comment section on youtube has got be near the bottom.


 No.24505

>>24503

Okay, so where else do you suggest? Online comments and blogs are all you people have at the moment.


 No.24506

>>24494

Speaking of which, here are some decent resources:

http://www.mhamic.org/rind/

https://www.ipce.info


 No.24507

>>24505

If you want to make a difference, you need to start writing letter to politicians and using your real name. You can't hide behind anonymity and pretend you are affecting anything.


 No.24509

I just want to say that the OP and anyone else campaigning like this has my respect. I truly think, like the other thread about the gay rights campaign, that we're on a road to being at least tolerated, if not outright accepted as total equals.

I'm (very slowly) writing a book. I have about 200 pages so far I think. It's in chunks right now, but the plan is to have two versions: one aimed toward mental health and social work professionals, with a lot more jargon and references to the literature, and one with more laymen's wording. When I'm eventually finished, I want to spread them as much as possible, both in print and electronic formats, hopefully to the point where media picks up the story and starts a debate there. I will try to start dialogues with researchers to see if they will be willing to take the risk of conducting studies that are nigh-untouchable right now (e.g. examining coercive vs. non-coercive sex, differentiating the various types of sexual encounters by level of penetration/touching). Maybe over time enough people will change their beliefs to the point that we'll have an actual critical mass of support, and can start working on legislation changes.

That's how I hope to make my contribution. Unfortunately, I'm just plain too scared to stand up and take part openly until things have improved.


 No.24599

>>24507

So, a letter writing campaign to politicians? They won't listen to kind people, but if you got more teen and parent advocates it might make a dent. In any case, it's a good thing i'm 16.

>>24509

Thanks, and best of luck with the book. I'm currently writing an "action oriented" plan like After The Ball (look it up on amazon), just got sidetracked for a while but will get back into it.

Even though i'm not a pedo, I sympathize with what you have to go through and feel common-sense reforms are possible, if strictly limited to nonpenetrative sex with parental consent.


 No.25228

fuck off and die pedocunts


 No.25289

File: 1436614134239.jpg (75.6 KB, 533x800, 533:800, 1433473305056-0.jpg)

>>25228

Butt… butt… this is OUR board.

What are you doing here, boring little anti?


 No.25361

Reminder that granting minors the rights to sexual autonomy does a world of good.

http://www.vox.com/2014/7/7/5877505/colorado-contraceptives-teen-pregnancy-birth-control




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