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/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

File: 8f3351d51f6f47e⋯.jpg (31.1 KB, 472x298, 236:149, thonking.jpg)

a40329  No.811519[Reply]

Any good arguments against atheism?

41 posts and 9 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

09e238  No.821180

this one should be better:

If there is something, then we know there was never nothing. This is because it is impossible to go from nothing to something.

It's impossible because in order to go from nothing to something, you would need to exist before you existed to cause yourself to come into being. That is of course impossible, so from this we establish that because there is something, there has in the past NEVER been nothing.

Now if there has never been nothing, then it logically follows that there must have always been something. This "eternal something" nessisarily also must be uncreated. This is because if the eternal something was created and had an origin, then that means that before that origin there wasn't always something, which is to say, there wasn't anything - and remember, there can never in the past have been nothing, and so for the eternal something it nessisarily must have never been created.

God is this uncreated eternal something, also known as a nessisary being. Atheists used to think the nessisary being was the universe itself, until they Got BTFO finding out that the universe had a beginning and therefor wasn't the nessisary being.


21f2a7  No.821211

>>821180

I’m assuming you mean the beginning of the universe is the Big Bang, which if you do mean, is it not possible there could be something before the Big Bang?


f978b8  No.821303

>>821164

> In fact, I spent a while as a gnostic, toying with stuff like hermetic philosophy, until I realized no amount of gnosis would bring me any closer to anything and I started to turn to Christianity.

Could you speak on what was the break for you? What was the event or thought or whatever that led you here?


54b554  No.821310

File: d428722f48fd5cf⋯.png (662.93 KB, 1288x800, 161:100, 02cda460266bb8a3c47fdca63c….png)


fb9ed2  No.821326

File: fe56e1b20c22839⋯.jpeg (640.34 KB, 700x6826, 350:3413, fe56e1b20c2283993a370f9e6….jpeg)

This image is excellent for the "muh reason, muh logic, muh proofs" crowd because it uses their own language and leaves them little choice to counter besides emotional outbursts like "well I DON'T BELIEVE THAT".




File: 25d9d30292d12ca⋯.jpg (101.9 KB, 704x1000, 88:125, Theotokos.jpg)

c6e364  No.821112[Reply]

Why do prots hate theotokos?

29 posts and 8 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

5550d7  No.821313

>>821312

Mary addressed Christ as her Saviour, thus Mary knew she had sin from which she needed rescue


c69d8e  No.821315

File: 41e20d20f8be227⋯.png (3.07 MB, 2560x1440, 16:9, 3.png)

File: c97d187c4462f99⋯.png (3.07 MB, 1920x1080, 16:9, David.png)

File: a4bf9bdd67176b7⋯.png (1.29 MB, 1920x1080, 16:9, Luke.png)

File: a23521752eb61dd⋯.jpg (82.52 KB, 997x1041, 997:1041, MaryGrace.jpg)

>>821257

Genesis 3:15 is retold in Apocalypse 12, the exact same people (the Blessed Virgin, the Christ child, and Satan) are at battle. She is a symbol of the Church, but she is not *just* the Church, because a symbol would not literally need to give birth. It's risible to say that the child is not the Christ, because it says He will rule with a rod of iron, a reference to the Psalms. She is also the Ark of the New Covenant, just as the Ark of the Covenant (also considered to be the holiest object on Earth) contained bread from Heaven, the rod of Aaron, and the Ten Commandments (God's Word), the new Ark contained God's Word Himself, the second Person of the Blessed Trinity, the Bread of Heaven, and the true High Priest. In Apocalypse 11, John sees the Ark (something we'd want to see talked about more, since the Ark was lost) and then immediately he talks about the woman crowned with twelve stars. That's on purpose.

>The Greek word used for blessed is 'eulogeo', and there is nothing in this word that implies sinlessness.

Why don't you go over kecharitomene? http://www.philvaz.com/apologetics/a116.htm Also, what of when she says ALL generations shall call her blessed? Don't suppose you're a Christian if you're not devoted to the Blessed Virgin. It's akin to a man in the OT refusing to venerate the Ark or refusing to march behind it in battle. Those who didn't show proper respect to the Ark would even die. Because the Ark represented God's spiritual presence on Earth. The very ground God stood on when he appeared before Moses became holy. How much holy must the Blessed Virgin be, for God to dwell in her womb for nine months?

>Queen of Heaven

In Apocalypse 12 she is crowned with twelve stars. In the Davidic Kingdom, the mother of the King was the Queen.

>why did neither Christ or his apostles ever talk about it?

Luke painted a picture of the Blessed Virgin. It was carried all the way to India by Thomas.

>Why does Mary have such a small role in scripture compared to other people of extreme Post too long. Click here to view the full text.


c69d8e  No.821316

>>821313

>Mary addressed Christ as her Saviour, thus Mary knew she had sin from which she needed rescue

I guess the sinless Christ should not have prayed? Again, shows how historically illiterate Protestants are. Thomists and Franciscans had this debate already. How could God be her savior if she was sinless? (Note: they never questioned her sinlessness, because the Fathers, Scripture, and common sense teach that she was indeed sinless). Christ is the savior of all mankind, therefore He must save her from something, yet she was sinless. Thomists said that she was exposed to original sin in the womb for a few moments, but God took it away, thus God was her savior. Franciscans said that her privilege was that God applied the effects of the redemption to her before being born, thus He was still her savior, retroactively, and this became the accepted Catholic view.


2d6368  No.821317

File: 9213385fc866608⋯.jpg (115.84 KB, 459x388, 459:388, MotherOfTheEucharist2.jpg)

>>821313

And yet an Archangel far FAR older than her and the nation of Israel even said she was full of grace. How can she be filled to the brim with God's saving grace if she was a sinner?

But lets assume an Archangel had no idea what he was talking about, name one sin that Mary committed. Spoiler Alert you can't

Thirdly, why would God arbitrarily dishonor His own mother and make her a sinner? He made His ark perfect in the Old Covenant, why not make His new Ark of the New Covenant perfect as well?

Fourthly, salvation isn't exclusive to the forgiveness of sins. Scripture even says that salvation can be attained by God protecting the person from sin without them evem knowing:

>Now to him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you without blemish before the presence of his glory with rejoicing, to the only God, our Savior through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and for ever. (Jude 24-25)

So Mary, being a humble and sinless creature, could assume she is a sinner yet God did protect her from the blemish of sin without her even knowing. She was saved from sin by receiving God's saving grace before she could ever commit a single sin.

Fifthly, if you are in the mystical body of Jesus Christ which you are if you are an authentic Christian than not only is God the Father your father, but the Blessed Virgin Mary is also your mother. Denying that fact means Mary isn't Jesus' mother, thus making thousands of years of prophecy invalid and Jesus NOT the Messiah.


5550d7  No.821323

>>821317

interesting argumentation, lets break it down a little

>And yet an Archangel far FAR older than her and the nation of Israel even said she was full of grace

i'm going to agree with you that an angel is most likely doctrinally inerrant, but not for his age, but because he's Gabriel who 'stands in the presence of God' - Luke 1:19 – thus even at that moment he is receiving direct and exacting orders on what words to proclaim

> How can she be filled to the brim with God's saving grace if she was a sinner?

speaking of Gabriel – who asserted his authority to John the Baptists' father Zechariah on the grounds that he 'stands in the presence of God' – do you remember the Lord Jesus saying of him "I tell you the truth, among those born of women, no one has arisen greater than John the Baptist…"

now Mary was born of a woman, wasn't she?

and she was older than John, being the cousin to John's mother – this predating John indicating that she was less graced than John, right?

should we then venerate John with more dulia than Mary?

or perhaps we should look to what being 'graced' actually means, and remember the words of Christ on John once more, because in the same breath He says "… Yet the one who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he is"

well since we know now that Mary was less graced than John the Baptist – and to argue with that statement is to argue with Christ the Living God – and since we know that Christ spoke at a time when The Kingdom had not fully arrived, since He had not died, ressurrected and ascended, thence to bestow the saving grace of God the Holy Spirit to all believers, thus making them more 'filled to the brim with God's sPost too long. Click here to view the full text.




File: a372b840f80f253⋯.jpg (1.23 MB, 1610x2160, 161:216, TeilhardP_1947.jpg)

0d5420  No.819177[Reply]

>“And so we can now say that the goal of worship and the goal of creation as a whole are one and the same—divinization, a world of freedom and love. But this means that the historical makes its appearance in the cosmic. The cosmos is not a kind of closed building, a stationary container in which history may by chance take place. It is itself movement, from its one beginning to its one end. In a sense, creation is history. Against the background of the modern evolutionary world view, Teilhard de Chardin depicted the cosmos as a process of ascent, a series of unions. From very simple beginnings the path leads to ever greater and more complex unities, in which multiplicity is not abolished but merged into a growing synthesis, leading to the “Noosphere”, in which spirit and its understanding embrace the whole and are blended into a kind of living organism. Invoking the epistles to the Ephesians and Colossians, Teilhard looks on Christ as the energy that strives toward the Noosphere and finally incorporates everything in its “fullness’. From here Teilhard went on to give a new meaning to Christian worship: the transubstantiated Host is the anticipation of the transformation and divinization of matter in the christological “fullness”. In his view, the Eucharist provides the movement of the cosmos with its direction; it anticipates its goal and at the same time urges it on.”

~Pope B16, "Spirit of the Liturgy"

>“Only where someone values love more highly than life, that is, only where someone is ready to put life second to love, for the sake of love, can love be stronger and more than death. If it is to be more than death, it must first be more than mere life. But if it could be this, not just in intention but in reality, then that would mean at the same time that the power of love had risen superior to the power of the merely biological and taken it into its service. To use Teilhard de Chardin’s terminology, where that took place, the decisive complexity or “complexification” would have occurred; bios, too, would be encompassed by and incorporated in the power of love. It would cross the boundary—death—and create unity where death divides. If the power of love for another were so strong somewhere that it could keep alive not just his memory, the shadow of his “I”, but that person himself, then a new stage in life would have been reacPost too long. Click here to view the full text.

10 posts and 2 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

0d5420  No.819600

>>819594

He clearly didn't believe this, but ok. Have you read his works yourself, in context? Or the writings of popes about him? Try this: https://teilhard.com/2013/05/21/orthodoxy-of-teilhard-de-chardin-part-i/


55ba34  No.819618

Just saw the intro to The Phenomenon of Man was written by Julius Huxley who was a close friend of Teilhard's. This is very bad news.


a9c407  No.819621

>>819600

>When our talk touched on St. Augustine, he exclaimed violently: 'Don’t mention that unfortunate man; he spoiled everything by introducing the supernatural.'"

From the man's own lips, he thought he knew better than the greatest Church Father and denied the existence of the supernatural. That right there is enough to ensure that I'll avoid his works like the plague til the end of time.


a9c407  No.819626

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>819598

Father Chad Ripperger does a brief biography of him in this video.


e0d3c0  No.821322

>>819177

>Excommunicated by Pius XII

>Excommunication lifted by John XXIII

This is all you need to know, but if you want more he was a globalist in league with the Anglo naturalists and transhumanists of his day. He was a friend of Julius Huxley ffs.




File: 19e2bdecc343257⋯.jpg (33.75 KB, 462x640, 231:320, 19e2bdecc343257816eb0ef49c….jpg)

007661  No.722985[Reply]

Post your successes/troubles.

The responsibility is yours. Since you're the man you are the driving force behind starting a relationship. It is your job to do the first move as it is to lead all other moves.

Women seek stability. A woman is like a flower that grows towards God. A man is more like a stick. He can direct the married couple towards God. If both of them are flowers, then they stay in mud.

>Be yourself

Be confident about who you are. It will give you a special aura around yourself

>Work on your confidence

Start at nofap thread, eliminate porn and masturbation from your life. Increase your testosterone levels by working out…./fit/

>Get hobbies

If you lack interests, you are less interesting to women. Women want men of action.

>Visit places where high quality women hang out

Church, library, your hobbies…

>Become more educated about your faith

If you want a good Christian girl you should study scriptures. If she takes her faith seriously she will probably be impressed.

Your future wife probably will not just appear out of nothing and ask you out. It is your job when she appears all of sudden to be confident enough to ask her out and handle that situation.

Purity thread:

https://8ch.net/christian/res/405648.html

If any of you guys have some useful meta, please post it so we can include it in the future to the OP.

295 posts and 44 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

68f582  No.821256

>>821251

As long as it's not vulgar shouldn't really be a problem. Maybe your girlfriend is just a prude? Maybe she wants to be your wife first? I dunno bro


4c2d3a  No.821301

>>821251

Honestly dude I know this is blunt but it sounds like she isn't attracted to you. Women like it when men they find attractive flirt with them, she may be your 'gf' but that doesn't necessarily mean she finds you attractive.


bb2971  No.821308

>>821256

She's on her period does that make a big difference in how they take compliments? Maybe I have nothing to worry about

>>821301

That's pretty much how I feel right now but she's said otherwise in the past so I'm frustrated and confused. I want the relationship to work so I might be overlooking things that will bite me in the future. I don't know how much I should be "trying" to be attractive (/fit/+/fa/) before it becomes vanity. I have more traits than this anyway (which she has admired) but it always feels they are not enough without looking good.


5823f0  No.821319

>>821251

If flirting is explicitly sexual then I would say it is a sin. If it is just compliment, it's all right

Look if you were not vulgar and it was a good compliment(you have to know yourself)….she may have been out of her mood or maybe had her period. The mood of the girl, from my experience, highly influences how she takes the compliment even from the guy she likes.

Last time I got whacked in compliment was when the girl was few days after break up, the girl I am going out with now, and I made a compliment about her dress. She just hummed looking absolutely bored/irritated. I knew it was bad so I waited a whole week before trying anything else. The next compliment went fine because the break up wore off somewhat.

That being said. Be sure to compliment only when you believe what you are saying and be sure not so sound vulgar/sexual/anything like that. Suit the style to the girl. If she said you should not say such things anymore, respect that this style of compliment is out of the way


f70a79  No.821320

>>820902

God bless Anon, praying for you to make babbies too (if that is what you are called to do, or if not to be a good priest to make many spiritual children)




File: ed32dc13b45f35b⋯.png (8.31 MB, 4115x3229, 4115:3229, Chaos.png)

dc288b  No.819199[Reply]

And that there is such a thing as absolute evil and absolute good in the world?

That there is, indeed, a fight between the forces of evil and the forces of good on earth ?

41 posts and 6 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

28cead  No.820820

>>819899

>I'm going to have disagree with you there, he is fairly known in tradicionalist circles, have done interviews with more proiminent people, and is expanding into my country as well.

Never heard of him myself, and i know a ton of fringe speakers and authors.

>Also i talked about him fairly famous because as soon as a person is a public figure, if he commits one mistake or has different opinion that you disagree with, he's a shill or a cuck or w/e.

That wasn't me.

I just called his theology likely heretical, and def. pseudo-intellectual and overrated.

>You yourself commits mistakes and probably has opinions that i disagree with, yet i don't call you a cuck or a shill or a fool. Reasonable debate is important and respect is necessary. Insults reeks of immaturity.

In that case, him getting into online beefs with people, implying anyone they didn't like is a pervert, and writing entire books just to talk smack about them makes him the most childish of us all.

>Well, good for you, but EMJ is doing it in a big scale and i don't see the bad in that. Maybe you don't see him as useful because you maybe be a mature christian, but there are lot of newbie lukewarm christians and even unbelievers who are disellusioned with the modern world that have known the truth about gay marriage, porn, as weapons agains't society. Even myself, someone who was always conservative knew very little about those things until i saw his videos.

Problem is, his ideas can and do lead to heretical conclusions pretty easily(someone in one thread understood that Jones was talking about white people as "the racial embodiment of Logos" which is heretical on a bunch of levels. Also see >>820040)

For crying out loud, we have 2000 years of christian theology.

We need to be selective in the stuff we support, especially for people stillPost too long. Click here to view the full text.


ba462f  No.820822

>>819225

>let's destroy capitalism because that is the same as moral relativism

>>>leftypol


ba462f  No.820823

>>820822

>>leftypol

It's been a while since I've been on here.


0fa4b5  No.821238

Is Rush Limbaugh a Jew lover?


0882fa  No.821318

>>821238

He's a neocon, its required




File: a3d88e83b6f6770⋯.png (35.44 KB, 1280x853, 1280:853, nazbol gang gang gang gang….png)

facbcf  No.798420[Reply]

can i be anti israel but christian??

52 posts and 14 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

95dcfc  No.821126

mm


e127a3  No.821254

>>814064

Uhmmmm ackshually in that tragedy died this dude Astor who was THE GUY against the fed/getting out of the gold standard, so take that as you will.


0dd5aa  No.821263

Yes. Being against Israel isn't against Christianity.

But it is against common sense.

Israel is the only decent country in the Middle East. When you look at standards of living, crime rate, social harmony and GDP, it is an all round success. There is nothing wrong with criticising the policies of Israel of for advocating Palestinian representation in Israeli government, but being against Israel as a concept is stupid, backwards, and based on feelings rather than facts.


1671e9  No.821265

>>821263

Yes the only rational thing is to be a good goy.


172a2a  No.821311

>>821263

"being against Israel as a concept"

I'm against Talmudists exerting massive amounts of influence on foreign governments, against Christians being tricked into believing that it is their moral duty to fight for their ancient enemies, against the talmudist attempt to destroy Edom through miscegenation and usury. I don't really care what Jews do to Muslims or vice versa.




File: a0fd3d193033d94⋯.jpg (10.43 KB, 334x151, 334:151, images(24).jpg)

b46426  No.818207[Reply]

I am a 21 year old Male. Not catholic. I really enjoyed it and it felt like the first genuine church I've been to in a long time. I felt closer to Jesus than I ever have

33 posts and 5 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

3befb7  No.821261

>>821158

Why do protestants love making non-arguments?


2423bf  No.821267

>>821262

Nice projection, but im not even that anon. If I were that anon, I'd make sure to use less big words so your prot brain can understand better. I'll pray that you continue your education.


7e7d21  No.821275

>>821267

>less big words

Oof. Classic midwit.


2423bf  No.821276

>>821275

>he still thinks ad hominems are arguments

Classic bible-idolater


d87ce0  No.821309

>>821261

>>821267

>>821276

i am that anon, and the initial post which started a discussion of taking the Lord's name in vain began with our friend here saying 'Jesus Christ' in exasperation at some advice to anon attending Mass – it seemed he didn't like the advice to cross one's arms to receive a blessing rather than the host, and preferred the attendee to stay in their pew

from that i assumed he was Roman Catholic, and i inferred from his remark that i was an 'Internet Catholic' that he felt he was a real one

now he seems to be pretending to be a protestant in order to trol you




File: 128845177bedccd⋯.jpg (7.41 KB, 239x160, 239:160, 1554370220206.jpg)

ea072d  No.821181[Reply]

I am a Jew who was raised in a fundamentalist protestant Christian environment. As a result, I feel very compelled to follow in G-d's will but I get stuck on Jesus randomly. I even just got circumcised as an adult but now I all of a sudden am stuck on the Jesus rabbit hole again. What should I do to determine the truth without calling upon Jesus for fear that it might be idolatry?

18 posts and 3 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

de09ef  No.821237

File: 43fe600ea9864f9⋯.jpg (139.28 KB, 770x960, 77:96, 1465173741846.jpg)

>>821181

Please consider the Logos, and you will see without a shadow of a doubt who your messiah is.

Start making spiritual gains.


8b0ffa  No.821242

>>821235

Nice try, schlomo, but you have no power here.


964f65  No.821246

>>821181

>idolatry

you will have to be convinced Jesus Christ is God. consider the arguments for and against it. this can be found by looking at arguments against the Trinity as well. arianism was a popular one for a time; might be a good place to start.

i don't see why you can't pray to God the Father on this issue.

>>821203

this, eventually.


188799  No.821291

>>821181

1 Corinthians 1:17-25

17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not in wisdom of speech, lest the cross of Christ should be made void.

18 For the word of the cross, to them indeed that perish, is foolishness; but to them that are saved, that is, to us, it is the power of God.

19 For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the prudence of the prudent I will reject.

20 Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this world? Hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

21 For seeing that in the wisdom of God the world, by wisdom, knew not God, it pleased God, by the foolishness of our preaching, to save them that believe.

22 For both the Jews require signs, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews indeed a stumblingblock, and unto the Gentiles foolishness:

24 But unto them that are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

Sermon 15. The Principle of Continuity between the Jewish and Christian Churches

http://www.newmanreader.org/works/subjects/sermon15.html


188799  No.821293

>>821181

Check out Books from Roy Schoeman, a Jewish Harvard professor that converted to Catholicism. Also, "Before the Dawn: Autobiographical Reflections by Eugenio Zolli, Former Chief Rabbi of Rome"

It's a story of how the famous and revered Chief Rabbi of Rome, Israel Zolli, became a Christian and entered the Catholic Church after World War II. Zolli was a world renowned Jewish leader and Scripture & Talmudic scholar, and an authority on Semitic philology.




File: 2899aade3edbb11⋯.png (617.88 KB, 600x1594, 300:797, victory.png)

416c3c  No.553707[Reply]

New meme thread because the old one is autosaging, starting with a request: I need the exploitable 8ch logo, have this crop in return

295 posts and 127 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

4f5ead  No.819866

File: 9524df9e4f9b589⋯.jpg (237.05 KB, 1200x1200, 1:1, doomerinquirer.jpg)

>>553707

for you, the one who thinks he is too broken by the world.


cb1487  No.821245

File: a3a8869ff38670a⋯.jpg (102.04 KB, 768x1024, 3:4, BishopWilliamsonDissTrack.jpg)


975043  No.821264

>>801932

>doesn't fit in at the campus Christian group

literally one of the reasons I left on campus Bible college for online

>cloud rap

>Calvinist

This is way to accurate


74b0de  No.821270

File: 97049a236fb8a18⋯.mp4 (5.82 MB, 320x568, 40:71, faith.mp4)

This gets me every time. Never lose faith bros


da53a2  No.821333

>>816261

I'm a little late on the draw, but you've blown me away with this drawing. Thanks for making my day.




File: 5d6471fae40e00f⋯.png (667.23 KB, 1224x2965, 1224:2965, Rebuking The Scopes Trial.png)

ec3527  No.821230[Reply]

Hey /Christian/ I have a post for you that I was wondering the validity of post. It seems like it relies on a lot of science with no citations.

Sorry if this is a shitty OP.

7bb92c  No.821243

File: f6dfcfcd28a98ac⋯.gif (2.99 MB, 252x263, 252:263, tldr.gif)

>>821230

>tldr:

>time's relative due to interactions with light, mass, energy, and space.

>six day creation literally and measurably happened.

i think this is just a very long way to say you can find God (specifically an intelligent creator) in the world around you.


c90c16  No.821269

>>821230

It's certainly interesting, but personally I won't share this until I verify it myself.




File: 486697f0b6033ef⋯.png (73.87 KB, 1200x1588, 300:397, 1200px-Simple_Labarum2.svg.png)

cc1b21  No.819612[Reply]

A few weeks ago, my priest (Catholic), gave a homily that I have been having trouble coping with. If anyone here could help me come to terms with this I would appreciate it.

The homily centered around this concept of predestination. As far as I had been aware up until this point, only Calvinists believed in predestination, but my priest gave this full length homily about how God already knows about who among us will be going to heaven or hell, as he is all knowing, therefore to a degree predestination exists.

This, coupled with some frustration I have had with my own recurring sins, has left me in somewhat perpetual anger and borderline hatred towards our existence. The reason for this is as follows. We are constantly told as Christians that God LOVES us and he sent Jesus to OPEN THE GATES OF HEAVEN. Well, if predestination is true, that means God is creating people who he knows will not go to heaven. He is creating people just to watch them writhe around in pain for 70 years and then die. We are supposed to be thankful to God for the gift of his son. I ask you this, if I am among those who God already knows is going to hell, THE SACRIFICE OF JESUS MEANS LITERALLY NOTHING TO ME. And yes, if predestination is true, I know where I am heading.

I have tried to just ignore this concept but it is festering. I feel never ending rage about this. It is unfair. Why would a supposedly loving God even make us like this? If he knows everything he would know how to fix our lives so we DONT go to hell. He CAN do it. So if he were loving he WOULD do it. This concept of my life being completely futile is absolutely repulsive for me.

Help.

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d6ee4d  No.821046

>>819612

Predestination is a christian concept, the thing Calvinists believe in is double-predestination a.k.a. God makes souls explicitly to burn in hell and suffer for all eternity a.k.a. super heresy.

When asked how this is characteristic with the rest of the bible where God says he wants everybody to be saved and how God loves everybody they generally answer something in the line of "Dude you just don't understand" and argue that we cannot comprehend how God thinks but it's per definition love.


95f107  No.821048

>>821046

> they generally answer something in the line of "Dude you just don't understand" and argue that we cannot comprehend how God thinks but it's per definition love.

talk to many Calvinists, do you?

the same sort of Calvinists who would point to certain key verses like God saying 'Jacob I loved, Esau I hated' or speaking of Pharoah 'I will harden his heart' ?

how about the kind of Calvinist who would look to greater themes in Scripture such as God's Justice, and the assertion that 'the Judge of All The Earth will do right', and that true Justice for mankind would be that every single one of we reprobates would be condemned to eternal fire before we are even conceived, so as not to mar His good earth with our rebellion against its Creator – so it is a scandal of the Cross that this same God would deign to rescue even one of us, though it be to the praise of His glorious Grace?

as to God being loving, well yes; but to Whom does God owe love if not to the Three Persons of the Trinity first and foremost – and if God the Father were to decide that it were best that God the Son not suffer the ignominy of Humanity's war against His Person; or if God the Son desired to uphold the Father's name from the assault of man's rebellion, and acting in unison so consign us to eternal flame: where would be the wrong in that – in fact, would it not be better that God never suffer our presence at all ?

but instead this patient and loving Three Persons act in unison from before the beginning in a plan of redemption, glorifying each other in their roles as Father, Son and Spirit; the Father patiently withholding His wrath and instead giving to the Son a people to be His reward, the Son redeeming this people from rightful wrath and so glorifying His Father, and the Spirit humbly contending with the hearts of these predestined people so as to bring their dead souls to life, thus loving Father and Son - each of these Persons demonstrating a long-suffering patient lovingkindness fPost too long. Click here to view the full text.


9a6608  No.821134

>>821006

Indeed. Predetermination removes moral agency from man and is thus heresy.

Protestantism is like far eastern thought where "fate" becomes all powerful and man simply a stupid vessel either for God or the devil. The devil doesn't have that kind of power morons, stop preaching Manicheanism.


05eba9  No.821210

>>821134

I feel like Ephesians 1-2 and John 15 kind of make it clear it isn't man doing the choosing…


c0da31  No.821255

>>820878

Best post of the thread




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861a07  No.821233[Reply]

Hi, I would like to ask for advice. I am a very protective person of the traditional.

I have been reading, manifestos and ancient letters about the Jews.

I need an advice. What should I study or do? What should I do as a job? To press politics, and be able to defend our noble interests.

I will translate this Jewish letter from Old Spanish into English.

They are two letters, one in request of help from the Spanish Jews. And another letter in response of the Jews in Constantinople. The Jews of Constantinople giving advice to the Jews of Spain.

"This following letter was found by the Hermit of Salamanca in the Archives of Toledo, looking for the antiquities of the Kingdoms of Spain, and, since she is heartfelt and remarkable, I want to write you here.

Letter from the Jews of Spain to those of Constantinople

Honest Jews: health and grace. Know that the King of Spain by public cry makes us become Christians. And they take away the haciendas and take away our lives, and they destroy our synagogues, and they make us other humiliations; which confuse us and uncertain what we should do. By the Law of Moses, we beg you and we beg of you for the good of the town council, & send us with all brevity the deliberation that you have made in it.

Chamorra, Prince of the Jews d'España.

Answer of the Jews of Constantinople to the Jews of Spain

Beloved brothers in Moses: We receive your letter, in which you mean the works and misfortunes that you suffer, of which the sentiment is as much a part to us as it is to you. The opinion of the great Satraps and Rabbi is the following.

To what you say that the King of Spain makes you Christians, that you do it because you can not do another. To what you say that they order you to remove your haciendas, make your merchants sons, so that little by little they may take theirs away. To what you say that your lives are taken away from you, make your children medical and apothecaries, so that they can take theirs away. To what you say that your Synagogues destroy you, make Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

3c23be  No.821253

>>821233

Si vis pacem, para bellum, If you want peace prepare for war.

But they said: Nothing. Then said he unto them: But now he that hath a purse let him take it, and likewise a scrip; and he that hath not, let him sell his coat and but a sword. Luke 22:36, Douay-Rheims

Anon, I cannot give you all of the answers you seek, but I share your sentiments. I would advise studying a trade as that will likely serve a far more practical purpose and provide you with longer term, if meager employment, however, if you feel you must pursue another line of education or work, give it some thought, as working a job you hate just to survive is hardly worth doing. I ultimately cannot dictate what you must do career wise.

I strive to make myself ready for the inevitable trials and insurrections which will befall Christendom. Get fit, stay away from debt if possible, purchase a firearm strictly for protection (Hello CIA!). Remain centered on Christ, I don't suppose you could tell me if you're Catholic, Orthodox, etc. (I'm a Catholic). Whatever it is understand your faith and your convictions. In short, become the best man you can be anon, because they are sorely needed.

I hope that helps.




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537d38  No.785185[Reply]

>raised protestant (Church of Christ)

>agnostic at 13

>atheist at 14

>gnostic occultist at 15

>protestant (Church of Christ) again at 17

>Orthodox at 20

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59a12a  No.821137

File: f1ea86691e13f80⋯.jpeg (50.23 KB, 689x500, 689:500, 426DD8BD-CE7A-473C-BB74-9….jpeg)

>raised vaguely baptist

>church hopped (different protestant churches) in the Tennessee/Kentucky with my parents in my elementary school years, not really finding any good ones; most were either Pentacostal-esque or big mega churches (this was back when televangelism was in-vogue)

>eventually move to home state of Virginia (8-9 y/o now)

>get baptized in family baptist church and start attending church there for the rest of my dependent years

>100-year old historical black church in the countryside of VA; comfy and traditional

>liked the focus on scripture and praise, didn’t like the uncomfortably close dips into Pentacostalism (some church goers would occasionally try speaking in tongues, though it was largely frowned upon; the Pastors would “get the Holy Ghost” and shout and stomp during their sermons, etc)

>in middle school and high school, attend a private protestant Christian school

>non-denomination, but old-school

>learn a lot about scripture through Bible classes and made the decision to get saved (really, more like a Confirmation than anything) after a particularly emotional sermon from a pastor at the school about “reaching for the Savior” in everything we do

>go really hard into learning more about scripture and start getting into online debates with atheists and LGBT (this was mid-2000s); learned apologetics and about where atheists and LGBT are coming from

>graduate and go to Liberty University where I continued to build on my knowledge of scripture with more Bible courses and Theology courses

>get exposed to contemporary non-denomination churches and start to like the worship and sermons a lot

>my family back at home has a falling out with our family church involving a lot of petty jealousy and egos clashing in the wake of the church pastor dying, leaving a power vacuum; unfortunately has jaded my parents to the point that they barely attend church anymore

>start to grow tired of contemporary worship and see it as nothing more than a concPost too long. Click here to view the full text.


fc0231  No.821141

>>821137

>am still in awe to this day of how I can be in any town and know that I have a good church to go to

Tell that to everyone complaining about "Novus Ordites"…


e7fc74  No.821192

>raised Catholic and attended Catholic middle/ high school

>not very strong in my faith, mostly going through the motions

>parents begin to become more invested in the faith: volunteering for rcia, icons, dad began wearing a scapular

>begin to take it more seriously

>start to dislike feel-good youth group type stuff from our church

>begin to dislike novus ordo

>parents take me to a latin mass, beautiful experience

>consider myself a conservative catholic

>first year of college

>stop going to mass

>see how many people go about life with nothing deeper than money/partying/etc

>protestant evangelical friend and another questioning friend ask me some questions about catholicism

>realise i cant answer all of them and i dont know the faith as well as i should

Where do i start in returning to the church and learning about the faith? I want to know everything i can so that i can actively “debate” my protestant friend and inform my questioning friend as correctly as possible.


4a942d  No.821199

>>821192

Denzinger, Erick Ybarra, Bishop Williamson, and the Catechism of the Council of Trent are all edifying.


933604  No.821209

>>821192

Learn about apologetics from both sides, pray, and see side God pulls you to. That's what I did and I've never been stronger in my faith than I am now.




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124320  No.820909[Reply]

>Enter ye in at the narrow gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way that leadeth to destruction, and many there are who go in thereat. How narrow is the gate, and strait is the way that leadeth to life: and few there are that find it!

Matthew 7:13‭-‬14

How few is few? What would you say is the strait and narrow path? Does denomination have something to do with it, like how Catholics say outside their church there is no salvation?

4 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

c15f65  No.821153

>>820936

nice post, thank you for this. i don't know why i've never heard about this before because its seems really important.


f0e0fb  No.821165

>>820936

These numbers are cause for absolute dispair imo and almost make me wanna throw in the towel (not literally, because I know I haven't got anything better to do than try to serve God as best I can)


c15f65  No.821167

>>821165

>These numbers are cause for absolute dispair imo

why? remember that when 33,000 people die in an hour, they're are going to be spread all around the globe, meaning that the majority of them aren't from christian nations at all. then take into account that not all of the people from christian nations are even catholic, and that out of the people who are actually catholic, most of them are only so in name and don't even go to mass every sunday. idk if someone wants to do the math, but at this point we're talking about a tiny minority compared to the entire world population. and thats just the bare minimum to even be considered a practicing catholic we're talking about. even out of the people who go to mass every sunday and confession maybe a couple times a year, how many do you think are actually following all of the commandments? how many of these people are fornicators? at least today i would say most of them just based on the fact that its so rare to see actual big families at mass. also i think i read somewhere that literally 99% of married catholic women use birth control. its really not that hard to be in the very top spiritual percentile, the reason most people aren't is just purely out of lack of trying.


5ea0f0  No.821168

>>820914

>Is the core requirement communion with Rome? I don't know for sure, but I am not willing to take that risk.

How do you know it's not communion with the Orthodox? Why are you willing to take that risk?


dba6dd  No.821177

>>821168

As long as you follow the apostolic faith, I can't imagine God denying you entrance into the kingdom of heaven




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57f37d  No.820830[Reply]

am i even really still a virgin if i've masturbated literally thousands and thousands of times in the past 8 years? i'm definitely not chaste, i know, but am i a virgin by God's standard. obviously i'm still a virgin by normie standards

10 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

34e984  No.820865

If we are to go by society's definition of the word, you are a virgin, however the only reason (((society))) labels you as such is because it's a laughable shaming tactic ("anon must put benis in hole or he not cool like us :DD") used to pressure men and women into corrupting one another, leading to broken families, unwanted kids, nihilism, and an otherwise unChristian society. That's mot to say (((society))) doesn't want you to masturbate as well… They just pressure you in a different manner (training you how to ejaculate from 5th grade onwards, erotic ads, free porn, etc.). As for whether you or I are virgins in God's eyes, I'm not sure. We can nevertheless repent of these sins and at the very least be chaste.


85c45d  No.820868

>>820859

Avoiding marriage or sex for lust is also a sin against nature.

99% of people who masturbate but choose to not to fornicate are much, MUCH less promiscuous than those who fornicate and don't masturbate.


57f37d  No.820869

>>820865

i just feel like i got winnie the poohed over, being given so much porn at such a young age, not being taught that masturbation is bad by anyone who was responsible for me. but i always felt that premarital sex was wrong and that i would never do it, or at least never have sex with a girl who i didn't plan on marrying because this was before i was catholic. i'd just like to think that maybe i at least did something right by not going around having a bunch of sex like everyone else.


6de1a2  No.820887

>>820863

>but like you said, thats the exception

It may be the exception, but if it's enough for you to have lost your virginity to, then so is masturbation. That's the original point I was making.

>>820869

>i just feel like i got winnie the poohed over, being given so much porn at such a young age, not being taught that masturbation is bad by anyone who was responsible for me.

You were poohed over. It is the responsibility of parents and other authority figures to keep children away from sin. But the authority figures in your life were poohed over themselves, having grown up in a post-sexual-revolution world the same as you did. The important thing now, however, is not figuring out who to blame. The important thing is that now you're aware of your sins, and you can choose to let God take them away.

>i'd just like to think that maybe i at least did something right by not going around having a bunch of sex like everyone else.

You did do something right in choosing not to fornicate. Every choice to avoid sin is a good choice. It's just that you also did something wrong in choosing to masturbate. The vast majority of us are right there with you. You already made one good choice in choosing not to fornicate; now all you have to do is make another good choice in choosing not to masturbate.

>>820868

>Avoiding marriage or sex for lust is also a sin against nature.

Avoiding marriage isn't in and of itself a sin at all, Jesus Christ and Saint Paul both encouraged it in the Scriptures.

Sex for lust is a sin, but it's not nearly as unnatural as masturbation. Lust directed at a woman and lust directed at a computer screen are both twisted forms of the natural procreative urge, but it's very obvious that lust directed at a woman is far less twisted than lust directed at a computer screen.

Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

ec065f  No.821162

>>820830

No. We live in a world ruined by the fall. Our inclination to sin was only furthered by the sexual revolution. Masturbation perverts the natural order of nature, it's worse than fornication. If fornicators aren't virgins, then those who abuse themselves certainly are not virgins.




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