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/liberty/ - Liberty

Non-authoritarian Discussion of Politics, Society, News, and the Human Condition (Fun Allowed)

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Ya'll need Mises.

File: e184c73f43915b8⋯.gif (1.62 MB, 200x200, 1:1, Lorenz_Attractor.gif)

 No.98123[Reply]

Why don't libertarians respect chaos theory more?

https://mises.org/library/chaos-theory-destroying-mathematical-economics-within-full-edition

It feels like a great way to get out of the old determinism v. free will debate by arguing about whether certain classes of natural phenomena are predictable as opposed to 'predetermined.' You can better incorporate the salients points of Hayek's local knowledge and Mises' calculation arguments. You can point out socialist hubris. Finally, you can actually speak in a harder and more rigorous scientific point of view.



File: e5247aa87ca8a84⋯.jpg (834.1 KB, 1500x1158, 250:193, Building-ORR-1883.jpg)

 No.97975[Reply]

I'm looking for books/articles that depicts in a positive light the libertarian era in the US. In particular I'm fascinated about the rise of big companies, private infrastructures, etc

I can always find hints of this in some books of austrian economists but I'm looking for something more specific and more of a light read.

Do you have any suggestions?

 No.97976

File: 7b884d6e369a69b⋯.jpg (16.85 KB, 477x284, 477:284, Nowhereyoucanrun.jpg)

>>97975

>I'm looking for books/articles that depicts in a positive light the libertarian era in the US. In particular I'm fascinated about the rise of big companies, private infrastructures, etc

I suppose I could suggest the three volume work of "The Economic Mind in American Civilization" but the notion of calling the 1800s (or any era in US history) a "libertarian era" is rather erroneous.

One thing you'll notice with American history in general is that for the most part, liberty is very rarely every gained throughout the course of US history, rather it's slowly lost through a period of a few hundred years to what we have now. This can be noted with the development of the Federal Reserve, the introduction of the income tax, the implications of the Civil War, World War 1, etc etc. That's not to say there's not notable events that contradict this trend (such as the repeal of the alien and sedition acts) but such acts are hardly indicative of US history as a whole.


 No.97977

>>97976

thanks. I know liberty is slowly lost and never gained, but I think in the early period liberty was enough to be considered a libertarian era. The birth of the Federal Reserve was probably the finishing blow.


 No.97983


 No.98010

YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.

>>97975

David Beito's book From Mutual Aid to the Welfare State: Fraternal Societies and Social Services, 1890-1967 is wonderful and a must read. It actually made me angry reading it, imagining what things could have looked like now before the welfare state came in and killed it off. Vid related is Beito giving a talk about the Voluntary City and Mutual Aid Societies at Libertopia 2010.


 No.98097

File: f693aeb7efea1a4⋯.jpg (72.07 KB, 625x491, 625:491, IMG_0111.JPG)

<TLDR

>1776-1861

The US isn't sure whether it wants to be a Rome or a Greece so to speak and walks the tightrope between a "Old republic" Timocracy and a French / Greek democracy with the US developing capitalism and the South / slave states remaining in sort of a Pseudo-Feudal / Capitalist haze

>1861-65

Lincoln (The liberator) shatters the Feudal / slave power in the south and opens the rest of the country up to capitalist development fully progressing it to a new mode of production

>1900s-???

Class conflicts become more evident / Crisis of capitalism etc




File: 07800a546b2004a⋯.png (328.92 KB, 1200x768, 25:16, 078.png)

 No.98044[Reply]

>Zognald signs bill amnestying more slaves who will vote for more gibs which will give the government more control who will terrorize us even more and even more of our freedom and we're too stupid, lazy, and weak to actually fight back and just take all of this up the ass.

 No.98046

yeah, it has been over for a while now, don't worry. Just try to enjoy these last days and that's it.


 No.98059

day of lavos when


 No.98075

>>98059

>day of lavos

sage negated


 No.98082

>>98044

>Zognald

This is so fucking dumb.




File: 9853c1f856929f4⋯.jpg (1.1 MB, 1500x938, 750:469, cityscape18.jpg)

 No.97895[Reply]

Should people have to pay for water?

11 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97992

>Should people have to pay for water?

"Should people have to pay for ____" always comes down to three simple questions.

1: Is the ____ you're taking somebody else's product?

>yes

2: Is the ____ you're taking a resource from somebody else's land?

>yes

3: Is the ____ you're taking a finite good that would be noticed if mysteriously missing?

>yes

If you want it without paying, ask nicely. People get shot over tampering with streams. Filling a canteen is a different story but the average "I don't wanna pay for stuff" kid probably isn't going hiking any time soon.


 No.98009

Nothing is free thus people can not have rights to free stuff.


 No.98035

>>97992

Hmm. Water flunks two out of three and I don't believe in land.


 No.98063

>>97990

i dont think it is very scarce


 No.98068

>>98063

I think the better argument is that if it was very scarce then it DEFINITELY should require payment.




File: 9583bd611ea8c00⋯.jpg (7.15 KB, 300x300, 1:1, 1335117565975.jpg)

 No.98054[Reply]

Some AnCaps believe they can survive and live the Fallout dream? Why are they so disillusioned while others could possibly do it?

 No.98056

>>98054

>Some AnCaps believe they can survive and live the Fallout dream? Why are they so disillusioned while others could possibly do it?

This is actually amazing, not only do you display a complete lack of understanding for what anarcho-capitalist arguments are, but you also display a severe lack of understanding for the English language as well. Bravo you fucking retard.


 No.98066

File: 5e4d09947827ed4⋯.jpg (75.71 KB, 565x848, 565:848, 1522848211_26730986_958170….jpg)

>>98054

Ancaps won't be taxed.

Ancaps won't get their guns taken away.

Ancaps won't be cucked to death by some great leader.

Ancaps will buy/enslave niggers to do all the fighting for them.

Ancaps will form evil corporations which will monopolize the wasteland.

Ancaps will build a welcoming home for the white man, but only if he is a high-IQ alpha male (not a commie/neet-soc).


 No.98092

>>98054

I don't care if I survive the "fallout dream" so long as the statist cucks don't outlive me.




File: a9dc1b9a489904a⋯.png (386.71 KB, 914x960, 457:480, a9dc1b9a489904abdf3f821e2c….png)

 No.87005[Reply]

tell me the most redpill thing you know

113 posts and 23 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.98053

>>98051

nah, too much have happened for it to become beyond a coincidence. Also you are probably one of them.

> prevent libertarians from rising up

People in government want to keep their jobs as well as justify their existence. You will do whatever it takes to keep your miserable but easy job with 100,000$ retirement funds.


 No.98058

>>98051

>never attribute to malice that which is explained by stupidity

On the whole, I agree. However, when you see disparate groups of people all exhibiting the exact same kind of stupidity at the most opportune possible moments repeatedly, it's much more difficult to presume innocence.


 No.98060

>>98040

>WN

>White Nationalism

lol wtf are whites a nation now?


 No.98064

>>98051

It's not simply a co-inky-dink, all that anti-white SJW bullshit is one of many tools of statecraft being used to weaken and exploit a population. Firstly, it's easier to control low IQ niggers than whites, and secondly, it's easier to control someone who has been shamed and beaten down from birth (modern white men) than someone who is completely confident in himself and his abilities (white men of the past).


 No.98065

>>98053

>People in government want to keep their jobs as well as justify their existence. You will do whatever it takes to keep your miserable but easy job with 100,000$ retirement funds.

This too. National-socialism is still socialism, it's more likely that governments would let neetsocs in or copy their policies (as they did after WW2), instead of letting libertarians get into power and erode credibility in the institution of government.




File: dee4efba0cacd97⋯.jpg (32.65 KB, 800x533, 800:533, china-flag.jpg)

File: 65ffd2697ae4fe5⋯.jpg (282.8 KB, 600x400, 3:2, china-95th-annivesary-part….jpg)

 No.97670[Reply]

In ancapistan why wouldn't rich governments just buy all the land?

32 posts and 9 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97986

>In ancapistan why wouldn't rich governments just buy all the land?

If they're doing so fairly, then they're paying you well enough to buy more land. Likely this isn't the case.

In a land GRAB, the historical habit of claythirsty governments and their cronies, the idea is to get people to "sell" the land for so cheap that they become tenants instead of owners from that moment forward. In other words, the government gains land it does not appropriately trade land for land.

That means coercion, that means aggression, that means McNuke™.


 No.98031

>>97967

yup, they are pretty much inflating the bubble


 No.98032

>>97904

>lose 90%+ of your troops

>declare victory

Truly the Pyrrhus of our time


 No.98034

>>97974

>failed to even capture any significant territory

>what is the entire Republic of Ireland


 No.98036

File: b1a9bb7bde9dbc7⋯.png (226.89 KB, 480x271, 480:271, ClipboardImage.png)

>>98032

>opponent loses 99% of china

>they win




File: 24c866184fadbd6⋯.jpeg (75.32 KB, 400x449, 400:449, cyberpinochet.jpeg)

 No.97927[Reply]

greetings laddingtons

i want to read about s pinochet? what books can you recommend?

2 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97988

>>97932

it does not


 No.97989

>i want to read about s pinochet? what books can you recommend?

Books about economics and private business instead. They'll serve you more once you're past the LARPing phase of your life.


 No.98002

>>97989

>reading biographies is larping


 No.98013

>>98002

Don't you know? Everything I don't like is LARPing.


 No.98026

>>97989

>dude history is for, like, children

Is that how you justify your ignorance?




File: fbae1d777ea2d39⋯.jpg (27.97 KB, 300x250, 6:5, Mym62Js.jpg)

File: 1296f4779643c35⋯.png (517.94 KB, 462x463, 462:463, Capture45.PNG)

File: d5ddb5c91f600b6⋯.jpg (58.67 KB, 610x343, 610:343, ad-council-uses-pro-bowl-k….jpg)

 No.96577[Reply]

Debate the intended message of this ad campaign, and why it's a positive step forward for society.

96 posts and 18 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97689

File: e1c4c27ff926928⋯.jpg (71.61 KB, 800x533, 800:533, 9I8dsgiXA7g.jpg)

>>97688

>The whole point of abortionists is to keep women from discovering the magic god endowned them with.

>child abuse is not as bad as child murder

AHAHAHA


 No.97691

>>97689

k i murder children now xd


 No.97708

>>97688

What an insightful webm you've included with your post.

>>97691

What an insightful post.


 No.98022

File: 41753b958b49ae2⋯.png (655.24 KB, 1912x2832, 239:354, human pregnancy is so fuck….png)

>>97688

>the magic god endowned them with

Seems he gave most other animals much better "magic".


 No.98023

File: 68f22f098733d07⋯.jpg (34.01 KB, 640x392, 80:49, economic ignorance.jpg)

>>98022

Holy shit, why are christcucks always the ones who take their ignorance up to eleven? That's like all leftist economics but honest and in good faith.




File: e5615530586c628⋯.png (152.67 KB, 721x803, 721:803, FuckYou.png)

 No.97732[Reply]

If American Communists pay through GoFundMe and Patreon, Centrists pay through Paypal and Credit/Debit Card, ☭☭European Communists☭☭ pay through WeChat and Yandex Pay, what will /librety/lads pay with?

Bitcoin and Ethereum are excellent alternatives to unreliable (((bank accounts))) that can be closed for being a part of an Alt-Right organization. (see → >>12778968 or http://archive.is/YIAOR) However, not everyone trusts opening a Bitcoin/Ethereum wallet with a clear Chinese entity used by druggies and porn addicts. The time for a /pol/ form of payment is now.

Here is the system I am suggesting… name it “/librety/lend™”

>User 1 wants a product from User 2

>User 1 send paper money directly to /pol/pay with a form attached

>User 2 receives the money physically, User 2 sends the money to his Church

/librety/lads could even give money to other countries. If a German from Berlin needs a product from America. The American could send his money to /librety/lend, /librety/lend HAM radio’s /librety/lend Berlin, and /librety/pay Berlin sends the money to the German. /librety/lend Berlin would be supplied the money in advance by investors.

Essentially, /liberty/lend is a underground bank network. Money comes in and proxy money comes out. The money is shipped in a special envelope that cannot show the money inside with a heat scanner.

It’s the perfect money exchange system for /librety/lads across the world.

5 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97938

>>97733

There's an excellent 200ish page book on how the government will raid your home even in a foreign country if you do just that and how others have tried something similar. I'll post it tonight if I can find the pdf.


 No.97993

File: 39418489c99d07d⋯.pdf (625.83 KB, New Private Monies - Kevin….pdf)

>>97938

Here we go, this is the one I was thinking of.


 No.98008

I have never heard of a more ridiculous critique about using cryptocurrencies. It's code. It doesn't matter what it's mostly used for. Most drugs and criminal activities are exchanged with USD and yet nobody cares about that.

In fact when internet began being a thing, it was mostly used for porn and drugs. So people had a very similar perception that the people who use that new technology are criminals/weirdos.

Sending cash is illegal, slow and your money can be taken away at border control.

Crypto is the perfect money when people actually start using it and its value stabilizes.


 No.98015

>>98008

The issue is Crypto grows too big and then proceeds to collapse in on itself due to people treating it like a stock market instead of using it as currency.


 No.98020

>>98015

That's an issue that the market will solve given time. Since BTC and other crypto is used primarily as a store of value and investment tool rather than as a standard of exchange, there isn't a lot of market demand for it to be stable–while it has more than its share of problems, USD is still stable enough that people don't have any issue using it to clear short-term transactions. If and when USD, the euro, the yen, or some other major currency becomes less suitable as a currency due to instability or some other failing, there will be more market pressure on crypto speculators and arbitrageurs to provide a stable price, as people start using crypto as a currency and not just as a store of value.




File: 2b5bc8bce9e68e8⋯.jpg (17.94 KB, 480x360, 4:3, hqdefault (2).jpg)

 No.97798[Reply]

/liberty/, where to emigrate to?

6 posts omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97819

>>97816

I kind of want to pay for your tickets.


 No.97837

>>97809

That's good to hear. Fun ownership is a genuine concern though, regardless of politics shooting is something I like to do and if a country inhibits me from doing so my payoff from moving there is lessened. I can't find anything on Liechtenstein's fun laws besides "loicenses n sheeit" and "it's more restrictive than the US."


 No.97851


 No.97941

>>97837

I hear Serbia has a gun-loving culture.


 No.97964

>>97798

Somewhere you feel your idea of liberty can take effect the most




File: 39b63d669c98713⋯.mp4 (4.4 MB, 466x262, 233:131, Are you smarter than a chi….mp4)

 No.93431[Reply]

what dont you like in the burgerland?

35 posts and 9 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97871

>>93450

is not the petrodolar thing a conspiracy theory?


 No.97872

USA have a government.


 No.97881

>>97871

The Waco Siege is a conspiracy theory. Fast and Furious is a conspiracy theory. Cultural Marxism is a conspiracy theory. Seth Rich is a conspiracy theory. And muh Russia isn't a conspiracy theory but a sound and grounded investigation. If you haven't caught my drift yet, anything the left doesn't like can be labelled and dismissed a conspiracy theory. And while the question of whether or not US actively pursues the maintenance of the petrodollar in its foreign policy may be open to some interpretation, one cannot deny that the petrodollar has been very beneficial for USD monetary expansion, even if this state of affairs was reached entirely by accident.


 No.97907

>>97881

Technically speaking any deed committed by a plurality of people is a conspiracy and anyone proposing such a deed was committed is proposing a conspiracy theory. I understand you're using the spooky government version of the term, as the poster you're replying to was, but at some point we need to take back language. We can't let evil people redefine English on us.


 No.97920

>>97881

did not CIA/FBI confirm pidorussians did something with the elections?




File: a68eb72010025b5⋯.jpg (61.23 KB, 562x527, 562:527, 1480540420590.jpg)

File: ed7931c8f26bb63⋯.jpg (179.02 KB, 620x306, 310:153, Mediterranean-Diet-Countri….jpg)

 No.97197[Reply]

Why aren't more libertarians moving out to sea?

>No taxes

>No property taxes

>No government

>No gun laws

>The only time you'll be taxed is for buying fuel

>Can catch food out at sea

>You're a free man not bound to any country

>Undisturbed

>Can freely enter any country along the shore

>Can invest in Bitcoin for money

27 posts and 8 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97887

Because Scientology gave it a bad name, liar


 No.97888

>>97886

You specifically are a mentally ill fascist.


 No.97889

Thank you for your eyeballs; this has been a test of the website’s functions; /liberty/ has no value as a forum.


 No.97909


 No.97913

>>97888

I am anarchist.




File: dfb863b3725c1cf⋯.jpg (120.76 KB, 768x768, 1:1, dfb863b3725c1cf47bee18009f….jpg)

 No.97894[Reply]

BROOOTHERSS!!!!

WE MUST UNITE THE NOBLEST AND STRONGEST BLOOD OF THE CHAN.

FOR IT IS A HOUSE UNITED THAT STANDS

THIS LAND SHALL NO LONGER BE DIVIDED UNDER THE RULE OF THE HERETICS

THE RULE OF NETFLIX

THE RULE OF JEWTUBE

THE RULE OF THE JESUITS.

IT IS TIME, THAT THE STRONGEST OF OUR BREED

BECOME GENESIS: BECOME NETFLIX.

Lets turn 8chs into the worlds best television network and recruitement office and force against evil. I just had this idea over in a board on pol and it went dead instantly. I cant post on pol now.

Who will stand in the face of evil and inequity.

 No.97898

>>97894

Why and how




File: ade1cb3f5201cdd⋯.png (161.53 KB, 370x229, 370:229, ClipboardImage.png)

 No.97417[Reply]

since democracy was a mistake, what's the alternative?

31 posts and 4 image replies omitted. Click reply to view.

 No.97724

>>97715

If humans are too retarded to run the best system maybe >>97429 is right.


 No.97727

>>97715

Except you have no choice when it comes to sending your kids to school, which is the primary way people are made stupid.


 No.97789

File: 361e2f53b936087⋯.pdf (7.36 MB, The_Discovery_of_the_Scien….pdf)

>>97727

no u can homeschool. public schools are called common school. they are provided for poor ppl because everyone, when there used to be families and ppl saved money, either went to private school or home school or there were small school houses like pilgrim style. no one has to go to school at all, read the law for your state. its 100% optional.

read this be more educated than anyone who went to english major at a college


 No.97867

The alternative is no rules.


 No.97893

>>97867

No rulers don't mean no rules




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